Matt D From United States of America, joined Nov 1999, 9502 posts, RR: 45 Posted (13 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 6 hours ago) and read 4342 times:
Ok, rather then get into the now growing tired debate about America and its "petty puritanism", let's all see what, in your mind would constitute a "perfect" country-one that you would not be able to complain about.
If I had my way, these great United States would be something like the following:
Everybody would be required to speak a common language-namely English. Communication is essential, and pockets of people all speaking their own native tongues is divisive, and creates more problems than it solves vis-a-vis education, cultural tolerance, etc.
English comprehension on a measurable 8th grade or higher level is mandatory for legal admission into the States. If you want to speak your native tongue among your family, fine. But anywhere else, your language is the official one: English.
Any person or persons attmpting to illegally enter the United States is subject to DNA collection, incapacitation, or death from the Border Patrol. Persons aiding and abetting in illegally bringing persons into the United States are subject to lifetime imprisonment and/or Capital Punishment.
Prisoners shall perform necessary public service such as litter collection, graffitti cleanup, bridge repair, etc so as to earn a return on the costs of their incarceration.
No signage, advertising, road signs, or Government forms will be permitted to be printed in any language other than English.
If you are going to emmigrate here, you are no longer a person of whatever land you came from, be it Mexico, France, Canada, China, Korea, or Jupiter. There will be NO ethnic categorizing. Either you are an American, or you are not. If you want to be Peruvian, fine. Then you belong in Peru.
The loser in any lawsuit will be required to pay the winners legal costs as well as their own. Failure to do so will result in seizure of assets and/or imprisonment commensurate with the length of the trial and what the legal bills final total is.
Literary tests mandatory for voting. If you do not posess basic cognitive skills, and have the requisite skills for decision making and following directions, you have no business participating in the leadership/initiative process.
If a spouse is found guilty of infidelity/adultery in any established marriage, that spouse automatically loses 100% of their assetts regardless of when obtained to the other spouse.
Abortion is only legal is medically verifiable instances where the fetus and/or mothers life is clearly in jeopardy if the pregnancy is allowed to proceed. Cases involving rape and incest will be handled on a case-by-case basis, and will require provable evidence.
The complete and total abolition of Social Security, Welfare, HUD, WIC, Medicare, and any and all other taxpayer funded Public Benefits, with the exception of Unemploymnt Insurance. No exceptions. The phaseout of Social Security will occur over a 10 year period. the amount that you will pay (and be eligible for in benefits) will be determined by your age and how much you have paid into it. If on January 1, 2001, you were 25 years of age, or younger, you will be exempted from paying any further SS taxes. You also will not be eligible for ny benefits upon your retirement. No refunds will be given so as to ensure that current obligations are paid. No person shall be allowed into the United States without proof of literacy and self sufficiency.
No US citizen will be eligible for any kind
Marriage (and all marriage related benefits-from tax breaks to health benefits) is recognized by the State as between a man and a woman only.
All corporations, businesses, government agencies,and groups are free to determine who thry hire, except, and who they do not at their sole discretion, and predetermined qualifications. There is no forced inclusion or Affirmative Action. If a group of Blacks want to start a "Black Only" business, they are free to do so without reprimand. Same goes for any other segment of society. If the Boy Scouts want to exclude Gays from their ranks, they are free to do so without fear of retribution.
Persons determined to be 51% or more at fault for any motor vehicle collision shall lose their license for 30 days and pay fines to the State in amounts to be determined. These fines double with each violation, until the 4th incident, at which time the offender will lose their license for life. If they are caught driving without a license, that is automatically 5 years jail time.
All drivers must pass not only written and visual tests, but also hearing and reflex tests as well. Those that cannot pass will not be issued a license.
Legal age for alcohol purchase and consumption lowered to age 18. However a DUI conviction is punishable up to and including lifetime incarceration.
Complete freedom of religion or freedom from religion as you desire. Government will take no part in any religious dispute. If a judge or teacher hangs The 10 Commandments on their wall, that is their right. If you are offended by it, you may attend a different school. No protests ordering their removal will be honored.
Establish different curriculums in school that pertain to different religious persuasions, or a lack thereof. All will be equal in terms of requisite graduation. As an example, schools will be free to teach any subject from any religious, or atheist perspective. Students (or parents) will be free to choose whichever program they desire. An "A" earned in athesistic secular Biology will be equal to an "A" earned from a Christian (or any other religious) perspective.
I could go on (and I probably will, but this is enough for now).
DeltaRNOmd-80 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (13 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 5 hours ago) and read 4257 times:
what would yours be Lax2000?
Divide all earnings among the population, everyone has the same income (street bums earn as much as entrepreneurs), the government controls every aspect of life- from religion to meal time, you are told which occupation you will have at the moment you are born, etc. Am I getting close?
Lax2000 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 541 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (13 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 3 hours ago) and read 4234 times:
Your far off Mr. RNOmd-80.
My Ideal nation would have the health and welfare benefits of Sweden, the drug leniency of the Netherlands, The work hours and overall lifestyle of Spain and France. The multi lingual and ethnic make up of NYC and L.A.
Abortion, Gay Marriage and Pot are legal in all states.
N863DA From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 48 posts, RR: 5
Reply 11, posted (13 years 8 months 3 weeks 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 4217 times:
My ideal country would be something akin to the following: (could it be more different?)
In much the same way as Switzerland is at the moment, the tax rates would be somewhere around 33% as the top rate of tax, with a 15% rate as the introductory rate.
Unlike some, I believe that diversity can do nothing but help in the long run. To this end, (in much the same way as in Canada – although using a different language) people are encouraged to speak both Spanish and English – and Spanish is a requirement in High School from age eight. (Kids have been proven to learn new languages much better; the earlier you start teaching them) Things are required to be written in dual languages – although not in magazines and on tins of food as in Canada. However, for use in politics and other things, no other language may be used. Immigration will be very simple; if you meet the requirements and can show a passion to live in the country, then you are welcome. It is not the fault of somewhere as to where they are born, and they should be allowed to live wherever they choose. It is required to have semi-fluency in either Spanish and/or English, but you do not have to speak either of those in your home if you do not wish to.
I don’t care if it is an idea reminiscent of Socialism, but I think that state-assisted healthcare is a brilliant idea. It may be ANYTHING but profitable – but social responsibility dictates that there be some caring for others. And besides, when you get sick – you don’t have to pay up the whazoo for a simple check-up.
Although personally I abhor abortion (who doesn’t?) it cannot be banned – as if this is the case, it would just go underground and make it quite horrific for those who required one. However – a judge must certify beforehand that the abortion should take place. There will be no spontaneous on-the-spot decisions. However, all court sessions will take place within one week of the request being put in by the person who wishes to have the abortion.
As many companies from all nations (eg. Deutsche Telecom, AT&T, BT, MCI) are welcome to compete on an equal footing in the country in the Communications market. As much competition as possible on the GSM 900, 1800 and 1900MHz cellphone system would be welcomed from anyone who was interested in giving it. No other cellphone standard (CDMA, TMDA or AMPS) will be in place. GSM-400 is an option for the future.
No prescription drugs may be advertised on television – and an independent commission decides what can be shown on TV. A watershed of 21:00 would be imposed allowing no explicit words or any explicit content to be shown before 9pm.
Incarceration and Capital Punishment
There will be no state-sanctioned Capital Punishment. Period. The circle of hate has to stop somewhere, and for the state to indeed perpetuate the ‘revenge’ motive of the death penalty is somewhat hypocritical and quite unnecessary in my mind. Rehabilitation will be the order of the day while incarcerated – and those that refuse or appear unaffected by all attempts shall be dealt with on a case-by-case basis, depending on the situation.
Firearms are permitted, including handguns. However, two-week waiting periods are required for all firearm purchases. Persons with criminal records found in possession of firearms will be subject to multiple fines and incarceration for a period of time relating to the degree of offense and the specific situation.
Racism and Discrimination
Racism and discrimination will be dealt with in an extremely harsh way – but on a case-by-case basis. Free market economics and business practices allow people to hire who they want, when they want. However, if racism can be proven, (through a disinterested judge) then severe action will be taken. However, all businesses must be represented in both Spanish and English.
EVERYONE is equal, regardless of any personal trait. Anyone caught interfering with a person’s equality (bribery, old-boys-club membership etc) will be heavily disciplined. However, no same-sex marriages between men will be allowed. This is not to say that equality does not extend to same-sex couples; just to say that the country (namely me) doesn’t agree with it.
Politics, Social Security & Economics
A two-party system, consisting of a right-wing party, somewhere in between the Republicans and Democrats, and a left-wing party akin to the Democrats, if not slightly to the right. An elected party with a ruling leader will be elected who, by default, becomes President, (in much the same way as the British Prime Minister gets elected). An entirely free-market economy would be in place, trading more than 70% with the US (of course.) However, necessary utilities (Natural Gas, Electricity and Water) will be state-provided. Social security would only be available after court hearings verifying whether, indeed, the person was eligible. Unless disabled, the maximum limit for length on social security is thirty days. Defrauding the Social Security Service will result in an immediate fine of 1000% of the amount stolen and five years in jail.
Drugs, Alcohol, Smoking & Driving
A hard line will be taken on drug offenders and under-age drinkers. The drinking age will be 18, along with the driving age. Speed limits of 65 on rural two-way roads and 80 on freeways would be imposed. No drug currently illegal in the US will be legal. (IE all drugs other than classified as FDA approved will not be permitted). All persons found in possession of drugs are subject, again, to heavy fines and imprisonment.
Everybody would be required to take either Comparative Religion or Religious Education classes in school, and schools would be allowed to have as much religion as they wish. However, parents are free to choose what school to send their kids to, based on (among other things) the religious background of the school. The Government, when in matters of other religions, shall have total religious neutrality. No preference is to be given just because a certain group is Jewish, Muslim, Catholic, Baptist, or of any other denomination.
It may be socialistic – it doesn’t mean to be, in any way – but if that is how it sounds, then so be it.
Either way, ideally it would be as far away from Europe (except Spain and the UK) as possible and as close to the US (on a friendship level) as possible.
N400QX From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (13 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 4187 times:
I'm sure many of you probably have an idea of my ideal nation. Before I describe it in detail, I'll say that my ideal nation is one under the United States Constitution... the one that was written in the 18th century, not the one that is distorted today. If I had been around back then and been influential, I would rather have had things stated more clearly so that people could not twist it to fit their own agenda. So, my ideal nation would be the US, but changed in the following ways.
My ideal nation would be based upon these priniciples:
• That each individual is endowed by his Creator with certain unalienable rights; that among these are the rights to Life, Liberty, Property and the Pursuit of the individual’s personal interest;
• That the freedom to own, use, exchange, control, protect, and freely dispose of Property is a natural, necessary and inseparable extension of the individual’s unalienable rights;
• That the legitimate function of government is to secure these rights through the preservation of domestic tranquility, the maintenance of a strong national defense, and the promotion of equal justice for all;
• That history makes clear that left unchecked, it is the nature of government to usurp the liberty of its citizens and eventually become a major violator of the people’s rights; and
• That, therefore, it is essential to bind government with the chains of the Constitution and carefully divide and jealously limit government powers to those assigned by the consent of the governed.
The pre-born child, whose life begins at fertilization, is a human being created in God’s image. The first duty of the law is to prevent the shedding of innocent blood. It is, therefore, the duty of all civil governments to secure and to safeguard the lives of the pre-born. Under no circumstances may the federal government fund or otherwise support any state or local government or any organization or entity, foreign or domestic, which advocates, encourages or participates in the practice of abortion.
The closer civil government is to the people, the more responsible, responsive, and accountable it is likely to be. The Tenth Amendment to the US Constitution makes clear that the federal government has only those powers which are explicitly delegated to it. All other powers are reserved to the states and to the people. This nation must be faithful to this Constitutional requirement and to work methodically to restore to the states and to the people their rightful control over legislative, judicial, executive, and regulatory functions which are not Constitutionally delegated to the federal government.
Capital punishment would be required in ALL first-degree murder convictions without exception. It would also be instituted in all violent gun crimes.
More funding to the Department of Defense to add troops and equipment and restore honor to the armed forces. No troops under foreign control (NATO, UN), no troops in foreign matters (Balkans) except in situations of vital interest to the United States (Israel, Iraq, etc). Our troops would instead be placed on our borders... militarize the Mexican border and add some military units to the Canadian border to deal with drug smuggling and terrorist activity.
Absolutely NO Federal involvment in education. The Department of Education would be abolished. Public education would be up to the respective States. Their teacher certification, educational curricula, textbook selection, learning standards, comprehensive sex education, psychological and psychiatric research testing programs, and personnel all comes from the State level. So that no parents need defy the law by refusing to send their children to schools of which they disapprove, compulsory attendance laws should be repealed.
The 17th Amendment would be abolished. Senators would be elected in the way they were originally intended under the Constitution's system of checks and balances. The legislatures of the States would appoint two Senators.
More dependance on domestic energy sources. Rogue states that control a large chunk of these sources can effectively shut down our nation. Drill ANWAR, drill Wyoming... For the energy we cannot get from within our borders, we'll take our business to friendlier nations.
Again, absolutely NO Federal involvement in environmental issues. Repeal of federal wetlands legislation and the federal Endangered Species Act. Moreover, oppose any attempt to designate private or public property as United Nations World Heritage sites or Biosphere reserves. Call for an end to United States participation in UN programs such as UNESCO, Man and the Biosphere, and the UN Council on Sustainable Development. Oppose environmental treaties and conventions such as the Biodiversity Treaty, the Convention on Climate Control, and Agenda 21, which destroy our sovereignty and right to private property. Restore any environmental power to the States.
The right to bear arms is inherent in the right of self defense, defense of the family, and defense against tyranny, conferred on the individual and the community by our Creator to safeguard life, liberty, and property, as well as to help preserve the independence of the nation. The right to keep and bear arms is guaranteed by the Second Amendment to the Constitution; it may not properly be infringed upon or denied. Absolutely NO Federal gun control legislation. ANY responsible, law-abiding citizen can have a gun. Encourage responsible home ownership of firearms.
No socialistic national health care system. No socialistic welfare systems. No socialistic social security programs. No Federal involvement whatsoever in social programs.
Abolish 16th Amendment. No Federal income tax. Return the system to how it was intended- excises, duties, etc. Maybe a LOW sales tax.
Abolishment of Federal minimum wage. Allow for a free market.
In summary... EXTREMELY LOW Federal involvement in government. Return the power to the States as it was intended. LOW taxes (good thing) means WEAK Federal government (good thing).
AerLingus From China, joined Mar 2000, 2371 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (13 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 4184 times:
My ideal nation would be an island in the middle of the Pacific to control immigration.
Immigration would be open with the requisite of, in addition to a standard citizenship exam, an english proficiency exam to ensure that they are capable of being productive citizens, not just dead weight.
Drugs and alcohol policies:
Narcotics policies will be very strict. There will be none! Violators will be promptly shipped to the nation's prison island for service in the prison's maintenance corps for 6 months, no excuses, no questions.
There is no legal limit on alcohol consumption, however before the age of 16, a drinker must be in the presence of an adult. This is an honour law.
The education system will be a nationally standardised system and will be established with consultation from Japan. A required course in the universities will be business.
There is no business tax to speak of, but industrial taxation will be directly proportionate to the size of the corporation and the amount of pollution and waste they produce. I have a system mapped out, but it is rather elaborate to describe here.
What people choose to do with their health is their own issue...which is why they will be forced to go to the US or other countries to get an abortion. The government will not fund hospitals and clinics that give abortions on the islands and those in operation will be shut down doctors and administrators running them will be imprisoned for 1 year with their medical license revoked, never to be regained. I should also state that abortion ships run by activists, if they do not turn around as immediately ordered, will be fired upon and disabled by our navy and confiscated when they enter the when they enter national waters. Those aboard will then be arrested and held until the nation of their origin has them transported home at the expense of their home nation.
Ownership for all firearms is legal, however those who wish to own firearms must enlist i na citizen's militia, a reserve, in the case of invasion or a loss of military resources overseas. As a result, all men and women between the age of 21 and 31 will be required to enlist and their yearly physicals will determine their remainder in the service. In normal circumstances, they will be required to be enlisted for only three years. Those who do not meet the standards, or have completed their tenure of service will be dropped from the militia, but will be able to keep their firearm to do with as they please (except violate the law). It is extremely unlikely that the militia will be needed. It is merely a test of dedication to their country.
Any organisation who wants to form a party are allowed to do so, however a party who wishes for the certain secession of an island will not be permitted under the penalty of treason. The system will be much like that of the US and other nations.
Organisations, unless they are religious sects, and businesses will not be permitted to discriminate on the grounds of race, creed, religion, disability or prior nationality. Those who do not comply will have their licenses revoked for one year, and continued operation without a license will result in the incarceration for the leader of the organisation for 6 months.
Paying for healthcare will not be an issue for any of our citizens. Those who drop out of high school will be placed in minimum wage jobs within the state, driving mass transit railway lines, busses, collecting trash, cleaning and maintaining state property, etc. The lower class will be made productive citizens, whether they like it or not.
There is none. If you get them on it, they'll never get off of it.
Mcdougald From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (13 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 4151 times:
1. Politics is a low-key activity, rarely making headlines. Elected bodies function along the lines of a board of directors, meeting infrequently and briefly, leaving the day-to-day running of the country to professional managers hired on contract and paid bonuses for excellent performance. (Personally, I'd much sooner have my country run by the likes of Bob Crandall or Gordon Bethune than some charming popularity-contest winner.)
2. The nation itself is never raised on a pedestal or treated as sacred or holy. It is an organisational unit, essentially a condominium writ large, and that's it. As long as you pay your fees for the common elements and abide by ground rules so as to not make life worse for the neighbours, you've done your bit. If you're an outsider who wants to buy in, fine. If you're not satisfied and want to live elsewhere, that's fine too. It's your decision to make.
3. The people are friendly and laid back, believing that until there's evidence to the contrary, you only get one turn at life, so you might as well enjoy it. Lunches are customarily at least an hour long and preferably not at your desk. Quality of life is treated as something more than an afterthought or a mere measurement of the percentage of homes with cable TV and automatic dishwashers.
Lax2000 From United States of America, joined May 1999, 541 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (13 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 4133 times:
One more thing,
In my country teachers will make as much as doctors, lawyers and uh, airline pilots...and schools will have no more than 15 kids a class. I think this will help solve the problem of bad public schooling, which might help solve a lot of our current counties problems such as poverty and hard drug abuse. Kids might actually want to be teachers when they grow up and this would make becoming a teacher very competitive and eventually only the best will teach, thus making the public school system as good as private schools. Of course these salaries would be paid for through your tax money..but taxes wouldn't be raised because we would be saving so much money NOT fighting the war on drugs.
JetService From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 4798 posts, RR: 11
Reply 22, posted (13 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 4127 times:
Ikarus From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 3524 posts, RR: 2
Reply 23, posted (13 years 8 months 3 weeks 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 4126 times:
And another pointless thread.
Anyway: My (pointless) contribution:
Ideal State - Ikarusland:
1 male inhabitant (me)
possibly a few hundred good looking female inhabitants to entertain the president of Ikarusland
1 totalitarian president (also me)
lots of space
lots of nature
some mountains (that do not erupt into flames on a regular basis)
and an internet connection that automatically filters away right-wing crappy posts.
Death penalty for illegal immigrants? Teachers being allowed to infiltrate the minds of innocent children with that most harmful and evil of drugs generally known as religion? I start to get the feeling that you really do not want to be taken serious by anyone except the Mattologists who pray to their glorious e-idol every day.