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Switzerland- Why No E.U?  
User currently offlineAerlingus330 From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2004, 834 posts, RR: 1
Posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 2762 times:

Hi, Do you think that Switzerland should join the E.U?

Any Swiss people here that have a view on the point is more than welcome to put it forward.
*I am led to believe that the French-Swiss are for joining the E.U and the German-Swiss are not.

Is one of the main reasons for them not joining the E.U, because they are afraid of loosing their national identity to the European Union?

*Correct me if I am wrong.

Thank-You
aerlingus330


Aer Lingus Airbus A330-300
48 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineRJ100 From Switzerland, joined Nov 2000, 4126 posts, RR: 29
Reply 1, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 2741 times:

Hey there

I would say it is 50-50 in Switzerland (pro and contra).

I am against it (at this point) simply for the reason because Switzerland would become one of the largest net payer but on the other hand has no decision power (because of the small population).

Also, the Swiss political system is based on federalism, every region and every person in this region has a very direct decision power. Once in the EU this will be past because the EU is more centralized.

You are right in saying that the French speaking cantons together with the two Basel cantons are more pro EU while the most part of German speaking Switzerland (apart from Basel) is against the EU.

Regards,
RJ100

[Edited 2005-02-23 21:26:19]


none
User currently offlineKieron747 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 2733 times:

I once knew this guy from Geneva, he was an accountant.

His personal opinion was simple...

Money and National Identity

...were the reasons (in that specific order!

I think there can be similarities drawn with the UK


User currently offlineBackfire From Germany, joined Oct 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 2728 times:

Switzerland voted in 1992 not to join the EEA. It was considered a surprise result, and the vote was very close.

User currently offlineRJ100 From Switzerland, joined Nov 2000, 4126 posts, RR: 29
Reply 4, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 2726 times:

Yeah it was 51% against joining versus 49% joining or something like that. Only a few thousand votes made the difference.


none
User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8761 posts, RR: 42
Reply 5, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2715 times:

Well, "net payer no. 1" says hi!  Laugh out loud I'd like it if Switzerland decided to join the EU since it would probably mean the end of certain bank accounts and so on, if you catch my drift.

Maybe the Swiss could also make some of their democratic traditions more attractive for the rest of the bunch, such as the plebiscites "our" politicians seem to fear so much.



Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13195 posts, RR: 15
Reply 6, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2715 times:

There are other reasons that come to my mind the discourage them from becoming part of the EU.
Probably they would have to dismantle their secretative banking rules and lose a lot of very profitable banking business, have to report bank deposits to other countries of their citizens avoiding taxes by banking in Switzerland.
They would have to remove their very strict immigration and citizenship rules. They would also have to open up to guest workers as is common in the EU with the related additional social programs costs.
As noted above, they would probably as a relatively rich country, have to give far more then they get back in EU taxes.
They would have to conform to EU imposed government financing, tax and spending regulations.
They would have to conform to EU pollution and related laws.
They would lose their 'neutrality' and lose the headquarters of many international organizations.
Allow more non-swiss products, espceially food products into their country, hurting local farmers.
Easier access as no border checkpoints, thus allowing more undesirable people into the country.


User currently offlineRJ100 From Switzerland, joined Nov 2000, 4126 posts, RR: 29
Reply 7, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2710 times:

That thing with the banks is more or less a myth. No doubt, illegal stuff happens. But not more than somewhere else.


none
User currently offlineRJ100 From Switzerland, joined Nov 2000, 4126 posts, RR: 29
Reply 8, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2709 times:

Quoting LTBEWR (reply 6):
Probably they would have to dismantle their secretative banking rules and lose a lot of very profitable banking business, have to report bank deposits to other countries of their citizens avoiding taxes by banking in Switzerland.


Do you know that the largest Swiss banks employ more people in the US than everywhere else?

Quoting LTBEWR (reply 6):
They would have to remove their very strict immigration and citizenship rules. They would also have to open up to guest workers as is common in the EU with the related additional social programs costs.


We are open for guest workers. In the company I work I am the only Swiss on my floor. Where I live 30% of the people are from foreign countries.


Quoting LTBEWR (reply 6):
They would have to conform to EU pollution and related laws.


Switzerland has some of the strictest laws concerning pollution. The EU could learn a lot from us. We have stricter laws concerning a lot of things such as animal treatment etc. etc. And no offense but someone from the US is simply not allowed to bash Switzerland because of pollution...


Quoting LTBEWR (reply 6):
Allow more non-swiss products, espceially food products into their country, hurting local farmers.


Agree with you.



none
User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8761 posts, RR: 42
Reply 9, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2707 times:

"Easier access as no border checkpoints, thus allowing more undesirable people into the country."

That last one isn't correct, the Schengen Treaty is not related to the EU, see Norway. Being a member of the EU does not make anyone a member of the Schengen Treaty, see the UK.



Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineSolnabo From Sweden, joined Jan 2008, 858 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 2678 times:

Switzerland got 4 official languages, right?

German, French, Italian....dont remember the 4th!! Anyone who knows?

Danke/Merci/Grazi

Micke  Confused



Airbus SAS - Love them both
User currently offlineAviationMaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 2664 times:

Micke:

The 4th official language is Romansh.


User currently offlineKaddyuk From Wallis and Futuna, joined Nov 2001, 4126 posts, RR: 25
Reply 12, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 2646 times:

I once knew this guy from geneva...
His shirt had a very big sleeve...a

Anyone wanna continue? LoL!



Whoever said "laughter is the best medicine" never had Gonorrhea
User currently offlineSabenapilot From Belgium, joined Feb 2000, 2728 posts, RR: 46
Reply 13, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 2639 times:

Since Switzerland is a rather loose confederation of cantons and there is a clear mayority pro-EU in the French speaking part, did our French speaking Friends ever gave it a thought to leave the Helvetic confederation and join the EU on their own? After all, as I hear it, the French speaking Swiss are not particularly happy about the dominance of the German speaking part of their country (for instance the way in which SWISS disappeared from Geneva and concentrates on Zurich).

User currently offlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5569 posts, RR: 36
Reply 14, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 2601 times:

Quoting LTBEWR (reply 6):
They would have to remove their very strict immigration and citizenship rules. They would also have to open up to guest workers as is common in the EU with the related additional social programs costs.


We don't have so strict immigration rules. We have, for example, more ex-Yugoslavians than any EU country. We have also already a contract with the EU that all EU citizens may work and live in Switzerland.

Quoting LTBEWR (reply 6):
They would have to conform to EU pollution and related laws


We even had stronger pollution laws as the EU had. We were the first country in Europe to forbid the leaded gas. In our days the laws against pollution are almost the same.

Quoting LTBEWR (reply 6):
Easier access as no border checkpoints, thus allowing more undesirable people into the country.


In fact at the boarder almost nobody is controlled, you usually pass by car without stopping.

There are other reasons: most people fear to loose our so called "direct democracy". We can vote over almost all new laws if we want to. We don't only have elections every four years but at least four times a year votations about new laws.


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21521 posts, RR: 53
Reply 15, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 2592 times:

Then there´s the aspect that Switzerland de facto adapts to most EU regulations in order to stay halfway "compatible" with all their neighbours and primary trading partners... Joining the EU would finally open the possibility to actually have a say about those regulations as well... As of now, it´s an almost entirely passive process as far as I know...

User currently offlineAviationmaster From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 2567 times:

The longer Switzerland puts off joining the EU, the more it´s going to hurt the country later on when it finally joins. But that´s probably still another 10-20 years down the road... heck it took us almost 50 years to join the UN!

User currently offlineDIJKKIJK From France, joined Jul 2003, 1822 posts, RR: 4
Reply 17, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 2564 times:

Quoting LTBEWR (reply 6):
They would have to conform to EU imposed government financing, tax and spending regulations


The one , only and the biggest reason why Switzerland doesn't want to join the EU!



Quoting LTBEWR (reply 6):
They would have to remove their very strict immigration and citizenship rules. They would also have to open up to guest workers as is common in the EU


Immigration and citizenship rules in all EU countries are as tough as the Swiss ones if not more.
and Switzerland has its share of guest. workers, as RJ100 has pointed out.



Never argue with idiots. They will bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience.
User currently offlineJGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 2541 times:

Switzerland is halfway there already. They are already part of the Single Aviation Market, virtually all Swiss products already conform to EU consumer standards, and I think I read that Switzerland will join the Schengen travel area soon.

User currently offlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5569 posts, RR: 36
Reply 19, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 2540 times:

Quoting DIJKKIJK (reply 18):
Immigration and citizenship rules in all EU countries are as tough as the Swiss ones if not more.
and Switzerland has its share of guest. workers, as RJ100 has pointed out.


That is true. We have more foreigners (in %) than any of the EU countries except perhaps Luxemburg. About 2 of our 7 million inhabitants are not Swiss citizens. Almost 30 %.


User currently offlineRacko From Germany, joined Nov 2001, 4857 posts, RR: 20
Reply 20, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 2515 times:

The difference is, all the wealthy emigrants go to you while we get the ones who don't even get a job in their country...  Big grin

Switzerland is a case of its own, with an incredible history, and to be honest they're very, very well off at the moment - and the rule says: Never change a running system.


User currently offlineStoney From Switzerland, joined Jan 2005, 199 posts, RR: 3
Reply 21, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 9 hours ago) and read 2488 times:

Hi guys

Some points are absolutely valid, and other points are just myths. I don't really have tons of time to explain it right now, but I'll do it once I get home (like later tonight or sometime tomorrow)

The other Swiss members pointed out how it really is, and to be honest, if you're not from Switzerland and have to listen to all these mostly stupid pro/contra discussions, in which the candidates always repeat the same arguments, you wouldn't know why we don't want to join the EU. It took us like forever to join the UN, where we aren't bound to do anything, so I'll guess it'll never happen that we join the EU. Well, I'll explain it later

Greetz
Stoney



BAZL - Bundesamt gegen Zivilluftfahrt - royally screwing around with swiss aviation
User currently offlineZRH From Switzerland, joined Nov 1999, 5569 posts, RR: 36
Reply 22, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 2470 times:

Quoting Racko (reply 21):
The difference is, all the wealthy emigrants go to you while we get the ones who don't even get a job in their country...


Oh yes, all the Jugoslavien and Albanien people we have are wealthy and very well integrated. What bullsh... do you post? We have the most persons seeking asylum of all European countries (in % of the population). You in Germany don't have the half of it! That's the typical ignorance and arrogance of the Germans I like so much. Embarrassment The Germans are perhaps the most important reason why we don't want to join the EU.


User currently offlineOrion737 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 5 hours ago) and read 2466 times:

At least the Swiss have had their say on the EU. We in Britain had a referendum to jointhe EEC trade association but never a say on integration in the EU.

British politicians are scared to let the British people have a say on the Euro because they would lose it. Much of Britain is anti- EU.

Well done Switzerland and Norway for staying out, you are not missing a thing!


User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29832 posts, RR: 58
Reply 24, posted (9 years 9 months 4 weeks 3 hours ago) and read 2446 times:

Quoting RJ100 (reply 8):
And no offense but someone from the US is simply not allowed to bash Switzerland because of pollution...


Well technically true, but I would point out that you are bashing someone from Jersey.

You can't say thie same thing to someone from Alaska.



OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
25 Swisskloten : LTBEWR: Switzerland voted to end neutrality about two years ago. Also, things are fine in Switzerland. Maybe that's why they aren't desperate to joing
26 RJ100 : Sorry Swisskloten, but when did Switzerland vote about ending neutrality? If you mean the UN voting, then you are wrong anyway. Joining the UN did not
27 JGPH1A : So who's the hold-out ? I'm betting San Marino or the Vatican.
28 Post contains images RJ100 : San Marino is a member since 1992 as far as I know. And Vatican is not a state, its only a holy sea, so they cannot become a member. I think the missi
29 Post contains images Pelican : Sounds like another small country in the neighborhood with penis envy? It's not everything about arrogance but often about ignorance. It's probably b
30 RJ100 : Yes there are a lot of foreign people in Basel. Are they doing jobs others wouldnt do? No. Why? Because we have laws in Switzerland that guarantee a
31 Post contains images Airsicknessbag : Correct. Correct, it's indeed the State of the Vatican City. Correct. A holy sea, with holy fish swimming around in it? The Vatican is a state, there
32 Post contains images RJ100 : Hey Daniel Very interesting. But I disagree with Vatican. It is a so called "Heiliger Stuhl" and the English word for it is holy sea (I know it sounds
33 JGPH1A : Nearly. The English term is Holy See (with an 'e').
34 Post contains images RJ100 : Oh god damn it But it doesnt sound much better anyway
35 Swissgabe : The EU does have like a lot of other things have advantages and disadvantages. Honestly, I wouldn't know right now if I would like to see Switzerland
36 Post contains images Pelican : Sounds quite familiar. Here in Berlin we have a school with about 350 kids and only 4 have German origins . That's of course a cause of many problems
37 Post contains links and images Airsicknessbag : I know. I was just poking fun at your "holy sea" vs. Holy See confusion I guess you'll have to agree to disgree with me and basically every scholar o
38 Post contains images RJ100 : Hi Daniel Now I can agree with you that Vatican is a state. Thanks for the links and information. I will read it with interest. In fact I just begun t
39 Kilavoud : Just like Saudi Arabia is proud to remain number one in Petrol, Switzerland is proud to remain number one in Banking. Some legacies need a special car
40 MIAspotter : And don't forget Number 1 in Chocolate!.... hmmmmm...chocolate.... MIAspotter
41 Kilavoud : Cocoa need a special care too. That's right. So many things need a special care nowadays. Planes too. Good night. Kilavoud.
42 Regis : What is there for Switzerland to gain by joining the EU? Very little. Recognition from its EU partners? Some tax advantages in exporting its products
43 RayChuang : Given the fact that the Swiss likely to keep neutral as much as possible, fat chance they will join the European Union anytime soon as a full member.
44 Marambio : Hello gentlemen, Very interesting discussion so far. It's a great pleasure to read your posts. Just a small correction: the missing country in the UN
45 Post contains images Airsicknessbag : Hey Thomas, that must be a first for non_av: a civilised discussion ends in one participant actually convincing the other one We should be nominated
46 Alphafloor : Can you explain why it is a problem ?
47 RJ100 : Sure. If you have 2 Swiss kids in a class and 20 others ( and those 20 others speak 10 different languages) then you can imagine how much the kids und
48 Stoney : My sister also went to school in a class of 16, where she was the only native German speaker. The problem is not that the foreigners aren't smart, but
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