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Suggestion For A Federal US Gun Law  
User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8707 posts, RR: 42
Posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 1682 times:

I've got one simple suggestion for a gun law that might make a difference:

All citizens with a record of criminal violence, considerable* psychological issues or who have served a prison term of more than __* months are hereby banned from purchasing and owning firearms. For every purchase of a firearm, a licence which can be obtained by all citizens aged 21 or older after a background check is required.

Those who violate this law or any part of it are to be sentenced to prison terms no shorter than 18 months. Firearms owned by citizens who are banned from owning them can be turned in in exchange for compensation* at any police post. If the owner of the firearm wishes to keep it, it will have to be made unusable and proven unusable by the police.


*to be defined


Does that sound like something you could settle for?


Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
69 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineJpetekYXMD80 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 4389 posts, RR: 29
Reply 1, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 1672 times:

Amen. The considerable psychological issues is a major one. Sometimes all people think about are robberies and dangerous criminals. They neglect to see all the instances terrible tragedies happened via depressed, mentally unstable people that should not have had access to firearms!! School shootings, workplace shootings, and most recently this horrific tragedy in my home of Brookfield, Wi. These are not your run of the mill criminals, these are your everyday people abused or with mental issues that just SNAP. To me that is the scariest of all.


The Best Care in the Air, 1984-2009
User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29799 posts, RR: 58
Reply 2, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 1668 times:

Actually about 99% of what you suggest is already in place

Quoting Aloges (Thread starter):
All citizens with a record of criminal violence, considerable* psychological issues or who have served a prison term of more than __* months are hereby banned from purchasing and owning firearms.

Already in place, felons are not allowed to own firearms, ditto for domestic violence misdemeanors.

Quoting Aloges (Thread starter):
For every purchase of a firearm, a licence which can be obtained by all citizens aged 21 or older after a background check is required.

minimum purchasing age 18, pistols 21 and there is a background check already required.

Quoting Aloges (Thread starter):
Those who violate this law or any part of it are to be sentenced to prison terms no shorter than 18 months

Actually for the above there are already sentences, and I would add that in most states, commiting a crime with a firearm gains additional charges or longer punishments.

Quoting Aloges (Thread starter):
Firearms owned by citizens who are banned from owning them can be turned in in exchange for compensation* at any police post. If the owner of the firearm wishes to keep it, it will have to be made unusable and proven unusable by the police.

Actually refered to a "De-milling" and most police departments will do this, say if some widow shows up at the station with a Mp-40 that her husband brough back from world war II. Usually however these weapons are destroyed.



OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
User currently offlineAgill From Sweden, joined Feb 2004, 1011 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 1667 times:

I doubt that. But why are you even concerned with american gunlaws. It really doesn't affect us over here.

User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 29
Reply 4, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 1665 times:

I could settle for this, and in fact, I'm all for it. These morons don't deserve to possess anything deadly ever again. The catch however, is that it won't prevent most of them from possessing guns. Many gun crimes are committed with stolen or smuggled guns, especially when gangs are involved, and these people will still have them and get them even if this is passed. It is a good idea, but enforcement would be near impossible.

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 29
Reply 5, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 1660 times:

Quoting Agill (Reply 3):
I doubt that. But why are you even concerned with american gunlaws. It really doesn't affect us over here.

Because he is sharing his ideas and promoting discussion with the rest of us. Just because you don't care doesn't mean others foreign to the US don't.

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8707 posts, RR: 42
Reply 6, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 1659 times:

L-188, are those laws just not enforced or why do we hear so much about shootings, more shootings and even more shootings?

Quoting Agill (Reply 3):
It really doesn't affect us over here.

However, it does bother me.



Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineAgill From Sweden, joined Feb 2004, 1011 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1658 times:

Newark777: I can aggree with that, but we have had these discussions before and they aaaalways end up with a big fight and accusations about anti-americanism or anti-europism (if that is a word).

Aloges: And rereading my post I see it could be taken for quite rude, this was not my intent  Smile

[Edited 2005-03-16 00:57:19]

User currently offlineJpetekYXMD80 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 4389 posts, RR: 29
Reply 8, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1658 times:

If you think the background check system is adequate in this country, you need to wake up and smell the roses.

Check that: wake up and smell the gunpowder.

Yes, if someone really wants a gun, they will have access to it in some way or another. The biggest effect I think this could have is it would help curb the sale to people with a history of mental problems that want the gun for defense etc- and then go on to use it for an unplanned sinister purpose.

[Edited 2005-03-16 00:57:00]


The Best Care in the Air, 1984-2009
User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8707 posts, RR: 42
Reply 9, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1649 times:

Quoting Agill (Reply 7):
they aaaalways end up with a big fight

I understand your concern, but I remember that a considerable part of my political threads managed to remain civil for a long time, so I thought this one might, too.

Quoting JpetekYXMD80 (Reply 8):
Yes, if someone really wants a gun, they will have access to it in some way or another.

That's the same in Germany (and everywhere), however there seem to be more deterrants in my country than in the US.

Edit

Quoting Agill (Reply 7):
rereading my post I see it could be taken for quite rude, this was not my intent

Don't worry, no harm done!  Smile

[Edited 2005-03-16 00:59:09]


Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29799 posts, RR: 58
Reply 10, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1647 times:

Quoting Aloges (Reply 6):
L-188, are those laws just not enforced or why do we hear so much about shootings, more shootings and even more shootings

If it bleeds it leads Algoes.

A few years ago there where a couple of instances where drunks ran their cars into large groups of people, killing many.

Didn't get near the coverage in the media, outside the towns where it happened.



OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 29
Reply 11, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1640 times:

Quoting JpetekYXMD80 (Reply 8):
The biggest effect I think this could have is it would help curb the sale to people with a history of mental problems that want the gun for defense etc- and then go on to use it for an unplanned sinister purpose.

That would be a step in the right direction. Too many times we hear after the fact that the killer had some kind of history of mental problems or mental disorders. If we can prevent these purchases, we can hopefully cut down some of the gun deaths. Even if one crime is prevented, the extra checks would be worth it.

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39887 posts, RR: 74
Reply 12, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1614 times:

Quoting Aloges (Reply 6):
L-188, are those laws just not enforced or why do we hear so much about shootings, more shootings and even more shootings?

...because gun control laws simply don't work.


I am uneasy with the government haveing the right to decide who can and can't own a gun. Hell even I could be labeled 'enemy of the state' just because I disagree with Cheney/Bush/Rove/Halliburton & Co.
If this government has this amount of power, we can forget about haveing a revolution.  Sad



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineAloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 8707 posts, RR: 42
Reply 13, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1607 times:

No no no, I'm not talking about the government deciding who can own a gun. I'm talking about legislation that's supposed to make your country safer. Governments change fast, laws don't.

As for "enemy of the state", the US is still a far cry from a revivial of McCarthyism. At least I hope so.



Walk together, talk together all ye peoples of the earth. Then, and only then, shall ye have peace.
User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39887 posts, RR: 74
Reply 14, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1592 times:

Quoting Aloges (Reply 17):
As for "enemy of the state", the US is still a far cry from a revivial of McCarthyism. At least I hope so.

Oh things are getting pretty scary over here under Dubya's regime.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently onlineMaverickM11 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 17506 posts, RR: 45
Reply 15, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1588 times:

"Oh things are getting pretty scary over here under Dubya's regime."

Scarey compared to what? Neverland?



E pur si muove -Galileo
User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 29
Reply 16, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1583 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 18):
Oh things are getting pretty scary over here under Dubya's regime.

Must be a California thing. I feel quite OK over here in Jersey.

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineBoeing7E7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1581 times:

Quoting Aloges (Reply 6):
L-188, are those laws just not enforced or why do we hear so much about shootings, more shootings and even more shootings?

Because no matter how you slice it, criminals get guns. Even in countries that don't allow them.


User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39887 posts, RR: 74
Reply 18, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1576 times:

MaverickM11 & Newark777:
If you aren't outraged, you aren't paying attention!



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 29
Reply 19, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1572 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 22):
If you aren't outraged, you aren't paying attention!

So if I'm not on your side, I just don't know what I am talking about?  Yeah sure

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineJpetekYXMD80 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 4389 posts, RR: 29
Reply 20, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1567 times:

I'm in the middle here. I don't like the direction the country is headed under Bush, but do not feel it is as bad as you say it is Superfly. If these guys weren't paying attention...this is their chance. Bring the meat and examples if you want a prove a point.

[Edited 2005-03-16 02:02:51]


The Best Care in the Air, 1984-2009
User currently offlineBoeing7E7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1566 times:

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 20):
Must be a California thing. I feel quite OK over here in Jersey.

Can't be that much a California thing either. My parents still live out there, they seem fine. Fine here in Wisconsin.


User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 39887 posts, RR: 74
Reply 22, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1563 times:

Quoting JpetekYXMD80 (Reply 24):
I don't like the direction the country is headed under Bush

Key word, "headed".



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineBoeing7E7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1558 times:

Quoting Superfly (Reply 26):
Key word, "headed".

Quit being such a drama queen.


User currently offlineJpetekYXMD80 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 4389 posts, RR: 29
Reply 24, posted (9 years 6 months 1 week 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1555 times:

Things headed in the wrong direction and the scary near McCarthyism that you described are a bit different.

Please provide some examples so you don't continue to sound like an angry liberal blowing hot air to these people!



The Best Care in the Air, 1984-2009
25 Post contains images Superfly : JpetekYXMD80: I'd be more than happy to provide you with examples but I'd rather stay on topic. If you'd like, I could start a thread when I get home.
26 Post contains images JpetekYXMD80 : Sounds good if you want to, I'll eagerly await!
27 ANCFlyer : Aloges, first, most all of this is already a "law". Second, dosen't do any damn good. As a few of us with some damn common sense have been saynig, OVE
28 MD11Engineer : Actually German law is more lenient in some aspects: In Germany, even if you were convicted for a felony, if you behaved yourself for ten years, and h
29 L-188 : Not in this country. Short of having your record expunged, a felony is a no-go. Doesn't matter if it is a violent one, or if you ripped off the compa
30 Post contains images Newark777 : Looks like Martha Stewart won't be buying a gun anytime soon. Harry
31 L-188 : Nope, not only not buying one, but be in possesion of one, or handling one. All of which are now verboten because she is a felon.
32 MD11Engineer : Concerning felonies, I checked e.g. that in Germany even as a convicted felon you still have your voting rights. You can lose your rights to run for o
33 L-188 : Yeah, state law varies somewhat in the US MD11Engineer. Some felonies will quash your voting rights, some won't. Martha for example is now prohibited
34 Post contains images MD11Engineer : Heard this story from my blasting instructor in the civvil defense school in Ahrweiler, Germany. He knew many of the blasting and demolitions technici
35 Post contains images L-188 : Yup, if you needed proof that Monty was a lousy general, that was it. I think I remember you telling that Sten story. I think if the Democrats ever g
36 Post contains images Aloges : "Common sense" and "bullshit threads" aside, I have two points to counter your post: 1: Why do you think all criminals are complete outlaws who would
37 ANCFlyer : No. Possibly. Again, possibly. Agreed. Way too lenient. Please see my post in the OTHER stupid gun ban thread running this week that says I'm all for
38 Aloges : I don't agree with a ban either - I just want some people to be banned from owning guns and the rest to be more aware of the threat all guns pose. If
39 BN747 : What's really STUPID is the quoted response.... the criminals are the only ones you want with guns (aside the cops). It clearly seperates the bad guy
40 Post contains images ANCFlyer : ALoges - what is stupid about these threads my friend is there are two running currently, and every week there is a new one. The result is always the
41 BN747 : My guess would be 'people' who have a closer affiliation' with the 'goings-on' of criminal usage of guns... and yet they don't have a clue as how to
42 Aloges : Before the '04 Presidential election, we had zillions of "I love Bush/Kerry, f*ck Kerry/Bush!" threads. Were all of those stupid, too? Or just the pr
43 ANCFlyer : Ha Ha Ha - you presume, don't you that I'm a Bush voter . . . . I'd hardly compare the presidential campaign of any country in the world to the issue
44 Aloges : LOL! How true... BUT I never said anything about "ban everyone from owning guns", where in this thread did you read that? My suggestion for a gun law
45 Post contains images ANCFlyer : OK, then you and I are probably on the same sheet of music - just playing in different bars Or a robber, or a vandal, or an slew of other type of thug
46 Captoveur : As has been stated already, this law already exists but it is almost impossible to enforce. The instant background check misses a lot. I have heard i
47 Aloges : I don't know the laws as well as NoUFO and MD11Engineer do, but I can live with it if it's true. If a former felon who has served his sentence and bu
48 CaptOveur : No, it is the simple fact there is NO way to enforce laws on weapon transfers between people, only on transfers from liscensed dealers. The transfers
49 Post contains images Aloges : So why are transfers of crack from one person to another illegal, and how is that law easier to enforce than one on transfers of guns? If it can limi
50 Newark777 : Because crack is illegal. Guns are not. Unfortunately, it will only slow the trend of allowing law abiding citizens to obtain firearms, and make thei
51 Post contains images Aloges : No, really. I didn't know that. That's news to me. For Christ's sake, I was talking about what could happen if some people were banned from owning gu
52 L-188 : I'm one. My Dad two, My Aunt, uncle, cousin, his wife, grandfather, grandmother,.........and in many rural Alaska villages everybody hunts because th
53 MD11Engineer : Ok, since I started talking about German gun laws, here are some basics: To own a firearm you´ll need a licence. There are basically three types of l
54 Aloges : I guess you do know that Alaska is an exception, don't you? There are few other states that enjoy 9 months of winter and 3 months of lack of snow. AR
55 ANCFlyer : Yeah that way when the assholes break in while I'm home I can just sit and watch . . . I quite agree - I find your example to be a bit flamboyant, bu
56 Swatpamike : OK, you had to go there. BN747 there is no such thing as Gun Violence. Guns do not kill people! People kill people. A criminals might use a gun or a k
57 Zak : the problem is not primarily the aviability of guns. take switzerland as example, most people have assault rifles at home yet you will rarely have gun
58 BN747 : Get what straight??? Some cute little jingle that some political chanter came up with at an NRA rally .... 'Guns do not kill people! People kill peop
59 Swatpamike : OK BN747, when did you??? BTW, No hostile language or criticizing of others. It's a shame that you have to respond with such venom. Cheers swatpamike
60 Swatpamike : BN747, let me let you in on a secret. A gun has no power until a person puts it to use. BTW, I will take you shooting any time. Let me know, I'll pay
61 BN747 : Mike you don't need too... I've done a .38, 9mm, M-16 and an M-60. You missing the point. How much damage can a 4 year old boy inflict on any one? How
62 ANCFlyer : I would agree . . . as cliche as it sounds - not once ever, never ever has a gun just got up by itself and shot someone. . . . ever. Deny it BN747. M
63 Post contains images Swatpamike : BN747, if your point is that the guy that robs a bank with a gun has more power than if he uses a knife, I get it. But there is still a person behind
64 BN747 : And to think in our 1st tango over this issue you expressed an articulated such well stated viewpoint of the power and respect of weapons.. and now y
65 L-188 : I know there where special classes that where offered to US miliary personel to gain this license. I am sure you already know this but if you end up
66 ANCFlyer : BN747 . . . I stand by the "articulate" conversation we had earlier - there can be more done. But I also stand by this statement as much a cliche as
67 BN747 : That's a tempting offer Mike... thanks... you never know. As for beer with L-188... he might say something so stupid I might drown drinking my beer...
68 ANCFlyer : I agree with the concept - but submit that even as you can't legislate intelligence into gun ownership, you similarly can't legistlate accidents out
69 Post contains images BN747 : As much as my hours are my own... a current work-in-progress has my sleep situation changing ever minute ... when my typos are so pronounced (as ther
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