Dvk From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1058 posts, RR: 1 Reply 4, posted (8 years 1 month 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 1519 times:
Somehow, I don't expect Benedict XVI to shake things up, but rather, to lock things down. As a disaffected Catholic who still has great faith, although not in the Church and its hierarchy at this point, I'm terribly disappointed. It's worse than seeing Bush win last November.
I'm not dumb. I just have a command of thoroughly useless information.
PROSA From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5439 posts, RR: 5 Reply 6, posted (8 years 1 month 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 1488 times:
Quoting Ctbarnes (Reply 3): It's already happened once in the 20th Century. John XXIII was considered to be merely a placeholder when he announced Vatican II much to the shock an horror of just about everyone in the curia.
Or, to cite a secular example, Earl Warren. He was the Republican Attorney General and then Governor of California, a staunch conservative who garnered a lot of criticism for blocking judicial nominees he deemed too liberal, and ran for Vice President on Dewey's Republican ticket in 1948.
Some years later, (Republican) President Eisenhower appointed Warren Chief Justice, thinking he'd carry on his conservative views. Warren instead did a complete 180 and became the prototypical bleeding-heart liberal and a champion of criminals' rights. One of his main allies on the Supreme Court was Hugo Black, a former KKK member who turned into a super-liberal once he exchanged his white robes for black ones.
Moral of the story: appointment to a lifetime position can do strange things to a person's views. Let's not assume that the new Pope will be an ardent opponent of change and modernization.
"Let me think about it" = the coward's way of saying "no"
Jaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 9, posted (8 years 1 month 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 1455 times:
Let's not assume that the new Pope will be an ardent opponent of change and modernization.
This Pope is 78 years old.
Earl Warren was much younger, more nuanced, and prone to a far less conservative ideology than the Catholic Church. Also, remember that many of the policies you call bleeding heart liberal had their roots in legislative fiat, something a straight line conservative would be forced to dispense under the law.
While your attempt at drawing comparisons is commendable, I think that comparisons are at best odious here.
BAW2198 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 637 posts, RR: 5 Reply 10, posted (8 years 1 month 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 1445 times:
Its a disappointment in one respect that, I think a lot of us were looking for a replacement to John Paul II. I for one would have preferred a Pope that would continue with John Paul II's ideas and direction of the church. I don't know that much about Cardinal Ratzinger (Pope Benedict XVI). Hopefully he doesn't turn the papacy into seclusion. Much of what the church gained in the way of followers was because of John Paul II's openness and being seen by the masses.
"And remember, Keep your stick on the ice"--->Red Green
Superfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 38485 posts, RR: 80 Reply 11, posted (8 years 1 month 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 1442 times:
Quoting Dvk (Reply 4): It's worse than seeing Bush win last November.
I disagree. Dubya's winning a second term was the worse day in America since 9/11. I am not that bothered by the selection of Ratzinger. Vatican will be selecting another Pope within 10 years anyway. This man is 78 years old.
Geizistgeil From Germany, joined Apr 2004, 148 posts, RR: 0 Reply 13, posted (8 years 1 month 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 1390 times:
...I agree most of the replies above. Ratzinger is so conservative ...even most of the german cardinals didn´t want him (so do I). I had to read books of him in school, oghhh.... I can tell you absolutly conservative . I would have liked to see a Third World pope. But I think, the next pope will be a more liberal, since Benedict will have a difficult inheritance after Johaness Paul II.
"If the Wright brothers were alive today. Wilbur would have to fire Orville to reduce costs" (H. Kelleher)
LTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 12329 posts, RR: 12 Reply 16, posted (8 years 1 month 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 1354 times:
I am somewhat surprised by the short time of this decision, but then the electing Cardinals have been in Rome for over 2 weeks, so plenty of time to think and discuss whom should be the next Pope.
I did believe that the next Pope, as here with the new Pope Benedict XVI, would come from within the Vatican heircharcy, not someone from outside it. As almost all of the voting Cardinals were appointed by Pope John Paul II, and were all stanch Theological Conservatives, so no wonder that at well defined Conservative was chosen. I would note that he is the 1st Germanic Pope since the 11th Century, and a 2nd secessive non-Italian Pope in 500 years (?)At age 78, probably Pope Benedict XVI may be around for 4-6 years, 10 years tops. There was some talk of a 'caretaker' Pope, an older man expected to be around a modest term and apparently this has come true. I also do not expect this Pope to be as much of a traveler as JPII, but will travel to his native Germany, and possibly Africa.
God bless him.
Dvk From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1058 posts, RR: 1 Reply 18, posted (8 years 1 month 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 1346 times:
TACAA320...I'm Catholic, but I'm not happy with this selection, and I'm not optimistic that lightning will strike twice and make Benedict the second coming of John XXIII. I don't have blind faith in the hierarchy of the church, and I'm afraid they got it wrong this time. If I'm proven wrong in the years to come, I'll admit it, but I'm not holding my breath.
I'm not dumb. I just have a command of thoroughly useless information.
787 From Italy, joined Jan 2000, 290 posts, RR: 1 Reply 21, posted (8 years 1 month 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 1286 times:
Lol all the silly comments from the gallery. People will be surprised abut Pope Benedict XVI all you should do is give him the chance? People in the "modern" world people have extremely closed minds and thus the problems we all have in society today.
I am very happy. I wish you could be happy too for whatever the good reason.
Leskova From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 6075 posts, RR: 72 Reply 23, posted (8 years 1 month 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 1203 times:
I'm no catholic, not even christian - so all this interests me more from the view of "what effect will Benedikt XVI have on world politics"...
Clearly, John Paul II had quite a lot of influence - much has been said and written about his influence in the fall of communism in Eastern Europe, and he clearly deserves credit for that.
What will, or can, the new Pope achieve? Where can, or could/should, he try to use the influence of the church he now represents?
As for those seeing dark times ahead for the Catholic church - think again: Cardinal Ratzinger held a position that gave him a great deal of influence in matters of faith, he was - aside from, obviously, Pope John Paul II - one of the highest, if not the highest, authorities within the Catholic church.
If you weren't completely unhappy with the way things were going in Rome these past few years, then don't expect things to take a turn for the worse now.
Several times in history have people that everyone expected to be "nothing special" turned out to be a positive surprise... then again, some stayed "nothing special" throughout their time...
Boeing7E7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 24, posted (8 years 1 month 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 1197 times:
Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter): What do you think, could it be possible to get a new pope who could shake the very foundation of all the conservative ideals of the last century?
1. Not in 10 Centuries, and rightly so.
2. It's not a churches function to change, it's the function of the members to change.
Why can't you liberals get that through your thick ignorant skulls?
Try this on. The Catholic Church has rules. You abide by them or you're not a Catholic. Simple as that. You don't like it, leave. It's not a Democracy.
Quoting Dvk (Reply 2): Looks like it's Ratzinger, so the picture on the left appears to have won. Too bad.
Quoting Dvk (Reply 4): Somehow, I don't expect Benedict XVI to shake things up, but rather, to lock things down. As a disaffected Catholic who still has great faith, although not in the Church and its hierarchy at this point, I'm terribly disappointed. It's worse than seeing Bush win last November.
You can come to grips with the fact you aren't a true Catholic anyway at any time. Please, feel free to find another church.
[Edited 2005-04-19 23:05:40]
25 Jaysit: Try this on. The Catholic Church has rules. You abide by them or you're not a Catholic. Simple as that. You don't like it, leave. It's not a Democracy
26 JpetekYXMD80: Ha, to think that the church hasn't changed its doctrine at all is pure ignorance. Look at the loosened lenten meat restrictions that used to be such
27 MD11Engineer: Jaysit, No reason to argue with 7E7. He always needs somebody to tell him when to jump. His only question will be "How high,sir?" Jan
28 Lucky727: Well, John Paul II chose something like 90% of those who voted for the new pope - so I'd expect the current conservatism to last for at least the next
29 Jaysit: The Church just said otherwise. You should really try and get that through your thick head. It did no such thing. I'd lay off the communal wine. You'r
30 Tbar220: Well if 7E7 disagrees with you, then he resorts to insults and you just must be wrong. I would respond to you to open up your thick ignorant skull an
31 Boeing7E7: I'm Lutheran (Missouri Synod - not the wanna be ELCA) and well versed in both faiths. You don't want to make that challenge. If anything, the Catholic
32 SAS_A330-300: I think there are three, (one of them was Ratzinger) who were not choosen by John Paul II.
33 EmiratesA345: With all due respect but, the Bible does condemn gay marriage and homosexuality altogether. Do you not think it would be a little out of place for the
34 TACAA320: Why don't let Him begin His Papacy? He is not even enthroned yet...
35 TACAA320: Pe@arson, nice to see you back in here. So many days on vacations from a.net? Back on tracks, I never said so, nor even thought that, nor even think
36 Falcon84: The Church's charge isn't to follow whatever the modern world is doing, Bofredrick. It's to keep the faithful just that-faithful to what it sees as t
37 L410Turbolet: Falcon, are you some sort of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde by any chance??? I mean one day you are all out bashing Dumbya/republicans for being desperately