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Commentary On New Pope  
User currently offlineTbar220 From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7013 posts, RR: 26
Posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 1971 times:



What do you think, could it be possible to get a new pope who could shake the very foundation of all the conservative ideals of the last century?


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76 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineWunalaYann From Australia, joined Mar 2005, 2839 posts, RR: 25
Reply 1, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 1956 times:

Picture on the right any day of the week!!!!!!!!!  Smile

Too bad, just as likely as the A380 being the next Air Force One!  Wink

Cheers,

Y.


User currently offlineDvk From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1058 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 1926 times:

Looks like it's Ratzinger, so the picture on the left appears to have won. Too bad.


I'm not dumb. I just have a command of thoroughly useless information.
User currently offlineCtbarnes From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3491 posts, RR: 50
Reply 3, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1894 times:

It's already happened once in the 20th Century. John XXIII was considered to be merely a placeholder when he announced Vatican II much to the shock an horror of just about everyone in the curia.

Charles, SJ



The customer isn't a moron, she is your wife -David Ogilvy
User currently offlineDvk From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1058 posts, RR: 1
Reply 4, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1871 times:

Somehow, I don't expect Benedict XVI to shake things up, but rather, to lock things down. As a disaffected Catholic who still has great faith, although not in the Church and its hierarchy at this point, I'm terribly disappointed. It's worse than seeing Bush win last November.


I'm not dumb. I just have a command of thoroughly useless information.
User currently offlineMoPac From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 215 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1857 times:

What happened to the "No Superpower Pope" thing????

I think a lot of people on this side of the Atlantic were really rooting for the Cardinal of Honduras. What a disappointment.


User currently offlinePROSA From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 5644 posts, RR: 4
Reply 6, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1840 times:

Quoting Ctbarnes (Reply 3):
It's already happened once in the 20th Century. John XXIII was considered to be merely a placeholder when he announced Vatican II much to the shock an horror of just about everyone in the curia.

Or, to cite a secular example, Earl Warren. He was the Republican Attorney General and then Governor of California, a staunch conservative who garnered a lot of criticism for blocking judicial nominees he deemed too liberal, and ran for Vice President on Dewey's Republican ticket in 1948.
Some years later, (Republican) President Eisenhower appointed Warren Chief Justice, thinking he'd carry on his conservative views. Warren instead did a complete 180 and became the prototypical bleeding-heart liberal and a champion of criminals' rights. One of his main allies on the Supreme Court was Hugo Black, a former KKK member who turned into a super-liberal once he exchanged his white robes for black ones.
Moral of the story: appointment to a lifetime position can do strange things to a person's views. Let's not assume that the new Pope will be an ardent opponent of change and modernization.



"Let me think about it" = the coward's way of saying "no"
User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21521 posts, RR: 53
Reply 7, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1822 times:

MoPac: What happened to the "No Superpower Pope" thing????

Whatever they may want to believe, Bavaria is not a superpower!  cool 


User currently offlineDIJKKIJK From France, joined Jul 2003, 1822 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1814 times:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4462077.stm

Yes, Joseph Ratzinger it is.



Never argue with idiots. They will bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience.
User currently offlineJaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1807 times:

Let's not assume that the new Pope will be an ardent opponent of change and modernization.

This Pope is 78 years old.

Earl Warren was much younger, more nuanced, and prone to a far less conservative ideology than the Catholic Church. Also, remember that many of the policies you call bleeding heart liberal had their roots in legislative fiat, something a straight line conservative would be forced to dispense under the law.

While your attempt at drawing comparisons is commendable, I think that comparisons are at best odious here.


User currently offlineBAW2198 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 637 posts, RR: 4
Reply 10, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1797 times:

Its a disappointment in one respect that, I think a lot of us were looking for a replacement to John Paul II. I for one would have preferred a Pope that would continue with John Paul II's ideas and direction of the church. I don't know that much about Cardinal Ratzinger (Pope Benedict XVI). Hopefully he doesn't turn the papacy into seclusion. Much of what the church gained in the way of followers was because of John Paul II's openness and being seen by the masses.


"And remember, Keep your stick on the ice"--->Red Green
User currently offlineSuperfly From Thailand, joined May 2000, 40070 posts, RR: 74
Reply 11, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1794 times:

Quoting Dvk (Reply 4):
It's worse than seeing Bush win last November.

I disagree. Dubya's winning a second term was the worse day in America since 9/11. I am not that bothered by the selection of Ratzinger. Vatican will be selecting another Pope within 10 years anyway. This man is 78 years old.



Bring back the Concorde
User currently offlineBofredrik From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1774 times:

It is a disaster for the Catholic Church as he is so conservative and will not make any adjustments to follow a modern world.  banghead 

User currently offlineGeizistgeil From Germany, joined Apr 2004, 149 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1742 times:

...I agree most of the replies above. Ratzinger is so conservative  old ...even most of the german cardinals didn´t want him (so do I). I had to read books of him in school, oghhh.... I can tell you absolutly conservative  no . I would have liked to see a Third World pope. But I think, the next pope will be a more liberal, since Benedict will have a difficult inheritance after Johaness Paul II.

MS



"If the Wright brothers were alive today. Wilbur would have to fire Orville to reduce costs" (H. Kelleher)
User currently offlineMatt27 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1729 times:

Quoting Bofredrik (Reply 12):
It is a disaster for the Catholic Church as he is so conservative and will not make any adjustments to follow a modern world

You said it Bofredrik.

//Mattias


User currently offlineTACAA320 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1709 times:

Quoting Dvk (Reply 2):
Looks like it's Ratzinger, so the picture on the left appears to have won. Too bad.



Quoting Bofredrik (Reply 12):
It is a disaster for the Catholic Church as he is so conservative and will not make any adjustments to follow a modern world



Quoting Matt27 (Reply 14):
You said it Bofredrik

Let Him begin His Papacy.

For us [the Catholics] His election is a reason of great joy. I personally wish Him wisdom. And God will give Him enough.


User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13200 posts, RR: 15
Reply 16, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1706 times:

I am somewhat surprised by the short time of this decision, but then the electing Cardinals have been in Rome for over 2 weeks, so plenty of time to think and discuss whom should be the next Pope.
I did believe that the next Pope, as here with the new Pope Benedict XVI, would come from within the Vatican heircharcy, not someone from outside it. As almost all of the voting Cardinals were appointed by Pope John Paul II, and were all stanch Theological Conservatives, so no wonder that at well defined Conservative was chosen. I would note that he is the 1st Germanic Pope since the 11th Century, and a 2nd secessive non-Italian Pope in 500 years (?)At age 78, probably Pope Benedict XVI may be around for 4-6 years, 10 years tops. There was some talk of a 'caretaker' Pope, an older man expected to be around a modest term and apparently this has come true. I also do not expect this Pope to be as much of a traveler as JPII, but will travel to his native Germany, and possibly Africa.
God bless him.


User currently offline777236ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1703 times:

Perhaps his first act should be to openly condemn paedophilia within the church and ensure the parents of the abused children that their abusers will be brought to justice?

User currently offlineDvk From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1058 posts, RR: 1
Reply 18, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1698 times:

TACAA320...I'm Catholic, but I'm not happy with this selection, and I'm not optimistic that lightning will strike twice and make Benedict the second coming of John XXIII. I don't have blind faith in the hierarchy of the church, and I'm afraid they got it wrong this time. If I'm proven wrong in the years to come, I'll admit it, but I'm not holding my breath.


I'm not dumb. I just have a command of thoroughly useless information.
User currently offlineJaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1657 times:

I personally wish Him wisdom. And God will give Him enough.

I guess god was on vacation or taking a nap when Ratzinger dismissed the priestly pedophilia scandal as a "planned campaign" against the church.

Either that, or god needs to dole out wisdom with a trovel in the next few days.


User currently offlinePe@rson From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 19259 posts, RR: 52
Reply 20, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1639 times:

Quoting TACAA320 (Reply 15):
I personally wish Him wisdom

Does this mean he has no wisdom at the moment???!



"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
User currently offline787 From Italy, joined Jan 2000, 292 posts, RR: 1
Reply 21, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1638 times:

Lol all the silly comments from the gallery. People will be surprised abut Pope Benedict XVI all you should do is give him the chance? People in the "modern" world people have extremely closed minds and thus the problems we all have in society today.

I am very happy. I wish you could be happy too for whatever the good reason.

Habemus Papam!



787 Italia - Io, il comandante dell'aria
User currently offlineSFOMEX From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 1606 times:

Quoting TACAA320 (Reply 15):
Let Him begin His Papacy.

For us [the Catholics] His election is a reason of great joy. I personally wish Him wisdom. And God will give Him enough.

Well said TACAA320. Benedict XVI is a great Theologian and a man of prayer. He will be Pope for us Catholics, and not for those who oppose the Catholic Church. Therefore, as Catholic, I'm full of joy.

Quoting Dvk (Reply 18):
. I don't have blind faith in the hierarchy of the church,

Neither don't I. Yet, I have faith and therefore I blindly trust the Holy Spirit. I'm sure Benedict is the right man at the right time.


User currently offlineLeskova From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 6075 posts, RR: 70
Reply 23, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 1555 times:

I'm no catholic, not even christian - so all this interests me more from the view of "what effect will Benedikt XVI have on world politics"...

Clearly, John Paul II had quite a lot of influence - much has been said and written about his influence in the fall of communism in Eastern Europe, and he clearly deserves credit for that.

What will, or can, the new Pope achieve? Where can, or could/should, he try to use the influence of the church he now represents?

As for those seeing dark times ahead for the Catholic church - think again: Cardinal Ratzinger held a position that gave him a great deal of influence in matters of faith, he was - aside from, obviously, Pope John Paul II - one of the highest, if not the highest, authorities within the Catholic church.

If you weren't completely unhappy with the way things were going in Rome these past few years, then don't expect things to take a turn for the worse now.

Several times in history have people that everyone expected to be "nothing special" turned out to be a positive surprise... then again, some stayed "nothing special" throughout their time...

Give him the benefit of the doubt.

Regards,
Frank



Smile - it confuses people!
User currently offlineBoeing7E7 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (9 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 1549 times:

Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter):
What do you think, could it be possible to get a new pope who could shake the very foundation of all the conservative ideals of the last century?

1. Not in 10 Centuries, and rightly so.
2. It's not a churches function to change, it's the function of the members to change.

Why can't you liberals get that through your thick ignorant skulls?

Try this on. The Catholic Church has rules. You abide by them or you're not a Catholic. Simple as that. You don't like it, leave. It's not a Democracy.

Quoting Dvk (Reply 2):
Looks like it's Ratzinger, so the picture on the left appears to have won. Too bad.


Quoting Dvk (Reply 4):
Somehow, I don't expect Benedict XVI to shake things up, but rather, to lock things down. As a disaffected Catholic who still has great faith, although not in the Church and its hierarchy at this point, I'm terribly disappointed. It's worse than seeing Bush win last November.

You can come to grips with the fact you aren't a true Catholic anyway at any time. Please, feel free to find another church.

[Edited 2005-04-19 23:05:40]

25 Jaysit : Try this on. The Catholic Church has rules. You abide by them or you're not a Catholic. Simple as that. You don't like it, leave. It's not a Democracy
26 JpetekYXMD80 : Ha, to think that the church hasn't changed its doctrine at all is pure ignorance. Look at the loosened lenten meat restrictions that used to be such
27 MD11Engineer : Jaysit, No reason to argue with 7E7. He always needs somebody to tell him when to jump. His only question will be "How high,sir?" Jan
28 Lucky727 : Well, John Paul II chose something like 90% of those who voted for the new pope - so I'd expect the current conservatism to last for at least the next
29 Jaysit : The Church just said otherwise. You should really try and get that through your thick head. It did no such thing. I'd lay off the communal wine. You'r
30 Tbar220 : Well if 7E7 disagrees with you, then he resorts to insults and you just must be wrong. I would respond to you to open up your thick ignorant skull an
31 Boeing7E7 : I'm Lutheran (Missouri Synod - not the wanna be ELCA) and well versed in both faiths. You don't want to make that challenge. If anything, the Catholic
32 SAS_A330-300 : I think there are three, (one of them was Ratzinger) who were not choosen by John Paul II.
33 EmiratesA345 : With all due respect but, the Bible does condemn gay marriage and homosexuality altogether. Do you not think it would be a little out of place for the
34 TACAA320 : Why don't let Him begin His Papacy? He is not even enthroned yet...
35 TACAA320 : Pe@arson, nice to see you back in here. So many days on vacations from a.net? Back on tracks, I never said so, nor even thought that, nor even think
36 Falcon84 : The Church's charge isn't to follow whatever the modern world is doing, Bofredrick. It's to keep the faithful just that-faithful to what it sees as t
37 L410Turbolet : Falcon, are you some sort of Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde by any chance??? I mean one day you are all out bashing Dumbya/republicans for being desperately
38 TACAA320 : Are you Roman Catholic?
39 Clipperhawaii : Isn't it funny that some on here who are not catholic and hate almost everything about the church are preaching what we as Catholics should do and not
40 NWA : Falcon84, for once I totally agree with you. The way I look at it, the Lords words have not changed, and do not, over the years. The bible condems gay
41 Jaysit : Just because modern societies have a rage for gay marriage, abortion-on-demand and the like, doesn't mean the Church should bend to those fads of the
42 777236ER : When your Church covers up mass sexual abuse, it becomes everyone's problem.
43 Falcon84 : Another "grab-bagger", who thinks, just because the times change, The Church should change it's basic core beliefs, and there, friend, is where you a
44 Dvk : Boeing 7E7...Why don't you go sign up to join Mother Angelica's monastery? You're in no position to tell anyone who doesn't blindly accept everything
45 Delboy : Absloutely fantastic front page headline in this mornings Sun newspaper. There was a picture of the new Pope with his hands spread (in the way only a
46 Klaus : Falcon84: Most of Europe, which is becoming a modern grab-bag for whatever goes, The european secularisation and the current changes going on on our c
47 MD11Engineer : I think the basic argument is to whom does the church belong: The clerical hierarchy in Rome or the worshippers.The worshippers in Europe and North Am
48 Falcon84 : Wasn't even trying to get into it's roots or background, Klaus. That could take up a 500 page book, I would wager. But I stand by what I said, whatev
49 JGPH1A : Maybe not, but in a contest between human rights and religious dogma, guess who wins ? People change, beliefs change, values change - this has happen
50 Dvk : Falcon84...The problem is that the church tries to exert its teaching over all of society, Catholic or not. You have to admit that, if the Pope and th
51 TACAA320 : Amen. By the way. He never ever said a word here, about the pedophile problem in his country [or anywhere else]. He's only interested in attack the R
52 Jaysit : They absolutely do have a rage for it, or else some of the gay supporters on here wouldn't be bashing the Church as they do. Gay men and women are not
53 Post contains images L410Turbolet : If this is not the ultimate hypocrisy, then I don't know what is. Basically you are saying: If certain group of people is discriminated and stigmatiz
54 Theredbaron : One thing I told my wife like 2 weeks ago is that the new Pope had to be more dark skinned or we will be a FIERCE champion of PEACE. WHY? Because Mala
55 PROSA : To tie in the threads we've had here about Turkish membership in the EU, the new Pope has made statements in the past opposing the idea. In an intervi
56 Falcon84 : If something is wrong, then it's wrong. It's no hypocrisy to continue such a teaching. They hypocrisy, sir, is you, demanding the Church change just
57 JGPH1A : In what way above ? It's just the same old "They're different from us, therefore we fear them !' bollocks from the usual sad old gang of reactionarie
58 PROSA : I don't view it that way. What the Pope seemed to be saying is that EU membership would diminish Turkey's own cultural heritage and lead to a loss of
59 JGPH1A : Yes, I'm sure he's blubbing into his Papal pillow at the thought of the poor but culturally pure Turks being swamped by all that decadent Western eco
60 Klaus : Falcon84: Wasn't even trying to get into it's roots or background, Klaus. Indeed. You simply dismissed any possible validity of the ongoing changes as
61 Jaysit : They hypocrisy, sir, is you, demanding the Church change just because the times change,and just because secular society might accept it. But you're al
62 Pope : When are people going to realize that an institution with 2,000 years of history behind it doesn't change course very easily. My god, it took a couple
63 TACAA320 : Actually more than five hundred years... John Paul II did it![Edited 2005-04-20 18:07:21]
64 AM744 : Right on dvk. Either you are a spiritual leader OR a Head of State. If Rome wants to play both roles they got to take the heat and criticism. Each to
65 Ctbarnes : An Atheist once asked the Christian poet Kathleen Norris how she could be a part of a church that was so hypocritical. She responded, "The only hypoc
66 Post contains images Klaus : Pope: When are people going to realize that an institution with 2,000 years of history behind it doesn't change course very easily. Wait - now this is
67 Pope : Neither - I'm the next one.
68 777236ER : To me it seems like there was a concious effort to cover up mass sexual abuse of young children, nothing else. My lack of faith notwithstanding, I'd
69 TACAA320 : For a zillion time. You sound like a broken record. Why don't you talk about the problem in general. We can discuss based on arguments. Without them,
70 777236ER : Again, it's my problem and not the Church's problem. Less obsession, more denial, perhaps.
71 Post contains images Paulc : knew it was going to be german pope by the size of the beachtowel they put on the balcony
72 Post contains images JGPH1A : It was a stitch up ! Cardinal Ratzinger was spotted at 5 am putting it out there...
73 Post contains images Klaus : JGPH1A: It was a stitch up ! Cardinal Ratzinger was spotted at 5 am putting it out there... No... they showed a bunch of men in black draping it over
74 TACAA320 : You said so. It´s YOUR problem!
75 777236ER : The fact that hundreds of young children were raped by preachers of your faith is my fault?
76 TACAA320 : Did you read what I quoted from YOUR reply number 70? Obviously no. Here goes again>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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