DIJKKIJK From France, joined Jul 2003, 1677 posts, RR: 5 Posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 919 times:
So, with just a week left before polling date, what's going to happen?
Will Labour romp home as many election forecasts have predicted or will the Tories use the immigration issue to swing voters in the last minute?
Will the new revelation that the Attorney General's letter on the Iraq war go against Blair? Strange that it should have surfaced now, just a week or so before the election?
[Edited 2005-04-28 11:43:53]
Never argue with idiots. They will bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience.
Mir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 19813 posts, RR: 56 Reply 1, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 915 times:
Will there even be one Labour vs. Tory thread on a.net??
Come on guys, we had plenty of Bush/Kerry threads, feel free to follow suit.
-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
Banco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 55 Reply 2, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 911 times:
Quoting Mir (Reply 1): Come on guys, we had plenty of Bush/Kerry threads, feel free to follow suit.
Difference is, we don't believe. We hate them all. Election threads (and we've had a couple) invariably end up with everyone saying how they loathe one party fractionally less than the other, so might, at a push, if forced, consider voting for them, but only because the other lot are even worse.
[Edited 2005-04-28 11:57:17]
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
Andreas From Germany, joined Oct 2001, 6104 posts, RR: 34 Reply 4, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 896 times:
Quoting Banco (Reply 2): consider voting for them, but only because the other lot are far, far worse.
See that's the difference to Germany: Our "red-green" government is crap, they did just about everything wrong they could lay their hands on, a brilliant counter-indicator so to speak...but given the comments of the others, the Christian Democrats and their boss, that horrible "Ossi" hag Merkel (communist until 1989, wants to tell us NOW how to organize markets ROFLMFAO!!), they are equally braindead, which leaves guys like myself who do not feel loyal to a certain political party just because their dad voted the same, in some kind of a vacuum.
You at least have a party that is "far, far worse"
BCal DC10 From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 717 posts, RR: 5 Reply 5, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 895 times:
Its one of those difficult situations at the moment in Brit politics....
Most people I've spoken to don't want His Tonyness back in power, think taxes will definitely go up under Labour administration (think NI defo next year) and are kinda scared that a vote for Bliar is a vote for a *shudder* scottish Prime Minister - Gordon Brown.
However, most don't want Michael Howard either, and the conservative party still leave me feeling a bit cold - that nothing much will change. I think the conservatives will improve with time as they have some very talented younger individuals coming through.... I personally think their time will be in 2009, after Labour hang themselves by raising taxes to pay for their huge debts and public service .
I'm not going to waste time typing about those lefty tree hugging lib dem fence sitters. Better things to do today.....
Banco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 55 Reply 6, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 889 times:
Quoting BCal DC10 (Reply 5): I think the conservatives will improve with time as they have some very talented younger individuals coming through....
The Tories have the same problem Labour did through the 1980's - memories of the last time they were in government. For Labour, everyone remembered the winter of discontent in 78/9, and for the Tories everyone remembers the chaos of the Major years. You're right, there are a few younger Tory MP's coming through that aren't tainted with those years, and as they rise to the top, the Conservatives will start to look like a real alternative.
Personally, I can't see any genuine alternative to Labour as a government but I do desperately want that majority cut substantially. I'd rather stick pins in my eyes that vote Conservative, but I want them to do a lot better than last time. Three consecutive huge majorities is a bit undesirable.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
BCal DC10 From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 717 posts, RR: 5 Reply 8, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 880 times:
what do you think then? a majority over 100 is still pretty powerful - I'd be happier with a maj of 70 odd but thats a pretty huge swing for the tories to achieve...
The nature of the majority is also quite relevant. I think it is the more right wing Labour MP's that are likely to lose their seats, so the new Labour Government may well be pretty left wing - and hence more likely to rebel against Tony and be defeated in Commons votes.... it could make life quite difficult for him. Cue Gordon....
Banco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 55 Reply 9, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 879 times:
Quoting Gkirk (Reply 7): Labour will win I think, but I believe I shall vote for the SNP
Kirkie, I've never got this. You don't like the EU, so why would you vote for a party that says it wants Scottish independence, but also wants to sign up for everthing the EU puts forward? Is that not a bit of a contradiction? Is that not just swapping an (imagined) English dominance for a European one?
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
JGPH1A From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 11, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 875 times:
Quoting Banco (Reply 6): I'd rather stick pins in my eyes that vote Conservative, but I want them to do a lot better than last time. Three consecutive huge majorities is a bit undesirable.
Hehe - well put ! But I think on the whole I'd rather the Labour majority was slashed by Lib Dem gains than Tory ones. I don't have much info as to how well who is doing at the moment, but Private Eye (the only English journal I will deign to read) said that in Folkstone, there may be a Labour swing to Lib Dem to not only do down some Blairite apparatchik parachuted in, but also the ghastly Tory leader himself, Michael "Vlad the Impaler" Howard, who is the sitting MP. I will watch out for that one on election night.
BCal DC10 From United States of America, joined Jul 2001, 717 posts, RR: 5 Reply 12, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 869 times:
I think die hard Labour areas where there are majorities of 10,000+ in traditional Labour seats are likely to stay that way.
Marginals where the majorities are less than a few thousand, where people protest voted against the 1997 Tory administration, where the voters are not natural Labour supporters are more likely to fall either back to Tory or Lib Dem control.
If that does happen, maybe it will leave the Labour party political balance heading back towards the left, with a smaller majority
Maybe not. It was just a thought that I had, plus something I read in that balanced piece of editorial journalism known as the Telegraph.
Cornish From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2005, 8187 posts, RR: 55 Reply 13, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 863 times:
Quoting Banco (Reply 6): Personally, I can't see any genuine alternative to Labour as a government but I do desperately want that majority cut substantially. I'd rather stick pins in my eyes that vote Conservative, but I want them to do a lot better than last time. Three consecutive huge majorities is a bit undesirable.
That's exactly my feeling Banco - we at least need an opposition that is going to be somewhat meaningful and keep the government "honest" (well as honest as politicians can be).
too big a majority is never healthy - nor is a hung parliament mind you - but there has to be some sort of opposition.
[Edited 2005-04-28 12:44:04]
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
Banco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 55 Reply 14, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 859 times:
Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 11): said that in Folkstone, there may be a Labour swing to Lib Dem to not only do down some Blairite apparatchik parachuted in, but also the ghastly Tory leader himself, Michael "Vlad the Impaler" Howard, who is the sitting MP
Well, I used to live there, and Howard was my MP! The thing about that seat is that at every election, pretty much the same thing has been said about it - Labour supporters will switch to Lib Dem etc. I remember in both 1992 and 1997 (i.e. before I moved away) Howard was supposed to be under threat. It just never happened. His majority stayed at around 9,000 regardless of what was happening nationally. It fell a bit last time to around 6,000, but I suspect that realistically, that is as low as it's going to go. For Howard to actually lose the seat, the Tories have got to do substantially worse than last time. I just don't see it.
Up the road in Dover it's a bit more interesting. After years of being Conservative, Labour got in in 2001. The MP Gwyn Prosser isn't the most popular of local representatives. That one may well go back to the Tories.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
Banco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 55 Reply 15, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 852 times:
Quoting BCal DC10 (Reply 12): Maybe not. It was just a thought that I had, plus something I read in that balanced piece of editorial journalism known as the Telegraph.
Well, I agree that there may well be a swing back to the Tories in the marginals - to what degree is the question. But I don't think the New Labourites are concentrated so much in these seats. The change in type of MP is fairly uniform across the country, not just concentrated in the marginals.
Funnily enough, smaller majorities often make backbenchers less inclined to rebel, not more, as they can topple the government with an injudicious vote. Of course, if you have a genuine schism in the party (i.e. Conservatives, 1990-1997) then it's just a disaster, but I don't really see that with Labour.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
Gkirk From UK - Scotland, joined Jun 2000, 24627 posts, RR: 58 Reply 16, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 848 times:
Quoting Banco (Reply 9): Kirkie, I've never got this. You don't like the EU, so why would you vote for a party that says it wants Scottish independence, but also wants to sign up for everthing the EU puts forward? Is that not a bit of a contradiction? Is that not just swapping an (imagined) English dominance for a European one?
So you think I should vote UKIP? I dont think they have a candidate around here. We have Labour, Tories, Lib Dems, SNP, or Scottish Socialist.
Now, the guy running for Labour is a pillock, Tories I just dont like, no idea who's the lady running for the Lib Dems, SNP guy's altright and not sure about who's running for the Socialist party.
On the day, it'll probably come down to Paper, Stone, Scissor who I vote for, but I am leaning towards the SNP even if I do hate the EU
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
Banco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 55 Reply 19, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 845 times:
Quoting Gkirk (Reply 16): So you think I should vote UKIP? I dont think they have a candidate around here. We have Labour, Tories, Lib Dems, SNP, or Scottish Socialist.
Now, the guy running for Labour is a pillock, Tories I just dont like, no idea who's the lady running for the Lib Dems, SNP guy's altright and not sure about who's running for the Socialist party.
On the day, it'll probably come down to Paper, Stone, Scissor who I vote for, but I am leaning towards the SNP even if I do hate the EU
I wouldn't be so presumptuous as to suggest who you should vote for! I was just wondering about how you rationalised voting for a party who believes in something you dislike so much. You've pretty much answered that.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
Banco From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2001, 14752 posts, RR: 55 Reply 22, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 840 times:
Quoting Skidmarks (Reply 17): The day that UK decides that we are to be part of the greater hedgemony is the day I give up and retire to somewhere hot and sunny and remote.
That's not fair! You've left us with two competing desires. a) We can get rid of you, but it means taking on that Godforsaken hole or b) leave the damn place alone, but we get to keep you.
Bugger.
I think we should go for a compromise and tax you bastards to the hilt to pay for your defence etc.
Quoting Gkirk (Reply 18): Just to annoy Banco once more, isnt it great the Scottish MPs can meddle in the affairs of the English, yet the English can't meddle in ours
Isn't it great how the Scots have all the oil, but we have all the money?
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
GDB From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 12736 posts, RR: 79 Reply 24, posted (8 years 1 month 3 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 824 times:
If the Tories do very badly again, (while bad for democracy, judging by their sub BNP/UKIP whining Daily Mail 'campaign' they do richly deserve another drubbling), it will I think be seen as being due to them not opposing Iraq in 2003.
So all the stuff now from them sounds desperate and frankly dishonest.
Ironic considering that's what they are accusing Blair of.
Of course if the very unlikely did happen, and Michael Howard got to No.10, he'd have a problem.
Vile GOP Spinner Karl Rove, has banned him from the White House, due to Howard's belated (and opportunistic) attacks on Blair over Iraq.
(Better yet, some of those younger Tory MP's were invited to the US Embassy for the US 2004 election night, were wearing Kerry badges, and they weren't joking or being ironic!).
More likely, the Tories lose again and 'one more heave' to power still looks far off, what leader?
They've got it wrong every time since 1997, (just imagine how badly they'd be doing if Duncan-Smith was still running them), Howard was to them, (the old, europhobic, curtain twitchers who make up most of the Tory membership) the least worst option left, not that this time they really got a choice, after they screwed up so badly with Hague and IDS.
A terrible thing to say, but it seems they won't get a decent leader until much of the current Tory membership are 6 feet under, literally.
25 Willo: Can anyone name anybody in the Conservative party other than Messrs Howard and Letwin? I'm bu*g*red if I can, and I read the Telegraph! At the moment
26 Banco: I don't blame them for doing this. It's distasteful, definitely, but they have to do something that'll get people voting for them. Immigration, becau
27 BCal DC10: I see all 3 leaders are being wheeled out by the BBC tonight on a question time thing. Everyone watching?! They are appearing in turn, rather than all
28 Gman94: Tony Blair is not as good a mass debater as Howard and Kennedy. Sorry couldn't resist it.
29 Cornish: Doesn't need to be when you look at Cherie's big gob Sorry couldn't resist that one either
30 BCal DC10: The old ones are the best eh Gman94... lol I don't know - I think Tony Bliar has mass debating down to a fine art ooops edit for sp[Edited 2005-04
31 WhiteHatter: I'm getting bored with it all now and wish it was today instead of next week. I'm fed up of being accosted by bushy tailed canvassers who pounce on me
32 DIJKKIJK: How about the BNP? How are they likely to do? Any gains possible anywhere? There was a feature on Newsnight the otherday, when they showed some immigr
33 DIJKKIJK: If the interview he gave to Jeremy Paxman is any indication, he is going to be grilled by the audience.
34 Gkirk: They'll probably get seats in Bradford and maybe Leeds
35 CaptOveur: I am looking forward to acting like a Euro and lecturing all of you on something that has no bearing on my life and I know nothing about.
37 Banco: No they bloody won't! It's very unlikely indeed that they'll win any Parliamentary seats. The odd council seat is the best they've ever done. Extremi
38 Cornish: I'll tell you something you don't see any more with this election. I don't know if it is the same in other areas, but round where I live I haven't see
39 GDB: CaptOveur, whatever millionaire servant of big business you elect, does have an effect on us, and judging by many comments on here on US politics, and
40 Gkirk: I thought they currently have 1 or 2 MPs? My mistake if false
41 Cornish: Nope they don't -only ever won council seats in places like Burnley, Oldham and Bradford I think.
42 Banco: No. Nowhere near. They usually lose their deposits when they stand. As I say, they have a few local councillors, nothing more.
43 Gkirk: Ok, my mistake. Time to change flags me thinks anyway
44 Andreas: AAAAH, Kirkie in Turkey , Sout East Anatolia, the paradise of shhep breeders, Kirkie in heaven
45 Gkirk: Turkey is a wonderful place...hot weather, nice people, cheap beer
46 CON207: Politics... Bonkers!!. Still, I suppose some gullable idiot has to do it. I ain't voting for any of the big three. I've had my fill of lie's from poli
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