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What Is A True Conservative?  
User currently offlineTbar220 From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7013 posts, RR: 25
Posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 1107 times:

I can think of this

- Fiscally conservative
- Smaller government
- Environmentaly conscious

This is what I think is a real conservative, only that so far though. What else would you consider a real conservative?


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User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 29
Reply 1, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 1106 times:

Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter):
- Fiscally conservative
- Smaller government
- Environmentaly conscious

I believe all three of those fit me, and I consider myself a conservative. Unfortunately, many in Washington would disagree over that definition.

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 977 posts, RR: 51
Reply 2, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1091 times:

Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter):
This is what I think is a real conservative, only that so far though. What else would you consider a real conservative?

Talking about idealogy is irrelevant if without action. The last three "conservative" administrations have all driven the U.S. deeper into debt (not fiscally conservative), done nothing to cut beuracracy (smaller gov), and have implemented some of the most explotive eniviornmental policies.

"Conservatives believe in X, Y, Z... but we've done the exact opposite every time we've had power."

We now see the "conservative" party exploiting evangelical Christians and their blind ignorance of homosexuals, foreign policy, and worse, the frickin Constitution. "Real conservatives" be damned, the one's actually practicing are a group I will never ever associate myself with...


User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21637 posts, RR: 55
Reply 3, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 1082 times:

Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter):
- Fiscally conservative
- Smaller government
- Environmentaly conscious

That sounds almost like a watered down form of libertarianism, not conservitavism.

I'm not really sure what a "true conservative" is. But what I do know is that they're starting to become a rare breed.

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineTheCoz From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 1069 times:

Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter):
Environmentaly conscious



Quoting Mir (Reply 3):
a form of libertarianism, not conservitavism.

I stopped to think on that for a second as well. I can't really see a libertarian driving around in a hummer throwing beer cans out the window.  Silly


User currently offlineSLC1 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 1063 times:

I think the idea of conservativism's "smaller government" has all but disappeared except as a tagline to attract some of the real conservatives. I see nothing conservative about the current administration, considering they've increased the size of government, increased government spending, etc. etc.

User currently offlineNKP S2 From United States of America, joined Dec 1999, 1714 posts, RR: 5
Reply 6, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 1063 times:

Too many disagreements between the social and fiscal conservatives to even nail it down.

I'd say the view on the right of private firearm ownership is a good "quick and dirty" litmus test.....Wedge-issue if you will.

[Edited 2005-05-07 03:27:15]

User currently offlinePacificWestern From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 1058 times:

Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter):
Environmentaly conscious

er, um....NOT.


User currently offlinePhaeton From Germany, joined Jan 2004, 406 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 1006 times:

To quote the great English philosopher John Stuart Mill:

"Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are Conservative."



"History will be kind to me for I intend to write it.", Winston Churchill
User currently offlineFokker Lover From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 982 times:

I agree with NKP S2 on the gun issue. That's a very good dividing line. A conservative is also smart enough to know that exploiting the environment doesn't mean destroying it. Trees grow and trees die. Harvest the older ones so that the younger ones have a place to grow. Harvest the wood before it dies and goes to waste. Most people who protest oil wells have never seen one in person, or have no idea that ANWR is a frozen desolate wasteland. For the record, I have an active oil well in my backyard. The deer love to gather around it in the evening to eat grass.

A conservative will say I worked hard to be successful, you can too if you just try. A liberal will say you are too stupid to do it yourself. Let the Government do it for you.
I've observed that most liberals live in the city where the local government provides gas, sewage disposal, water, transportation, and trash pick up. Basicly everything is taken care of for them. Though they pay through the nose in taxes.

Most conservatives live farther out where we have to do these things for ourselves like drill water wells, and hire our own trash removal companies. We also provide our own transportation. I would say that we are more "do it yourselfers" instead of "let somebody else do it" kind of people.

It seems that younger people are liberals because their parents have been taking care of them all of their lives. They think that this is how the whole world works until they have to survive on their own for a while.

A conservative will teach you how to fish. A liberal will take half of your fish and give them to somebody that they feel isn't smart enough to fish.
Finally, a liberal feels, and a conservative thinks.


User currently offlineYyz717 From Canada, joined Sep 2001, 16281 posts, RR: 56
Reply 10, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 973 times:

Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter):
I can think of this

- Fiscally conservative
- Smaller government
- Environmentaly conscious

Yes, I agree with this general definition. I would also add "pro business". Environmentally conscious I consider to be synonymous with smaller goverment and pro-business since the biggest environmental strides have always been made by the private sector seeking ways to use fuel more efficiently.

Unfortunately in the US, "conservatism" has been taken over by the religious right also and hence in the US conservatism also implies a religious or anti-progressive stance on social issues.

Here in Canada, I am active in the Conservative (right of centre) party, and yet I am pro-abortion, pro-gay marriage, pro-evolution, and more secular than religious. This would probably make me a liberal in the US.

Liberalism in Canada is really anything but -- it is very left-wing, anti-US, and socialist. I am definitely not a Canadian Liberal (ie, socialist).



Panam, TWA, Ansett, Eastern.......AC next? Might be good for Canada.
User currently offlineFDXMECH From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 3251 posts, RR: 34
Reply 11, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 961 times:

Quoting Phaeton (Reply 8):
To quote the great English philosopher John Stuart Mill:

"Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are
Conservative."

I take it John Stuart Mill was ultra-conservative.



You're only as good as your last departure.
User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 977 posts, RR: 51
Reply 12, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 957 times:

Quoting Fokker Lover (Reply 9):
Finally, a liberal feels, and a conservative thinks.

Ahahaha... so compassionate conservatism is based on reason? The last time I checked, it was based on faith. Faith as in, belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence.

Tell me with a straight face that the conservative agenda was thinking when it said the Constitution of the United States subverted religion?

Quoting Fokker Lover (Reply 9):
It seems that younger people are liberals because their parents have been taking care of them all of their lives. They think that this is how the whole world works until they have to survive on their own for a while.

Young people are liberal because they look at the shitty world their grandparents and parents are about to hand them and they are bitter. Then they have kids and don't have time to care anymore.

Quoting Fokker Lover (Reply 9):
Most people who protest oil wells have never seen one in person, or have no idea that ANWR is a frozen desolate wasteland.

Two parents both in the petroleum industry. One worked for Arco, moved to Orex, fired. The other, worked for Sun, asked to move to Kerr-Maghee, moved, fired. I have moved across Texas more times because of that stupid industry that I was never in the same school for 3 years until high school. Before I was born, my father spent 5 years on spars in the North Sea. For every guy that gets rich off oil, there's a hundred who went bust trying.

I know full well about the oil industry, and yeah, I'm protesting.

Quoting Fokker Lover (Reply 9):
A liberal will say you are too stupid to do it yourself.

You're making that case by the second.

Quoting Fokker Lover (Reply 9):
I've observed that most liberals live in the city where the local government provides gas, sewage disposal, water, transportation, and trash pick up

I will raise the same question you raised about oil wells: ever live in a city? If so, you would recognize that you can't provide your own utilities  Yeah sure . Yeah we pay taxes, but guess what? We're more productive.

Quoting Fokker Lover (Reply 9):
I would say that we are more "do it yourselfers" instead of "let somebody else do it" kind of people.

And that's a quality to be respected? Before I turn 50, there will be another 3 billion people on this planet, think we can all go-it alone?

Lemme guess... I bet you think of yourself as more of a "man" that way.  Silly


User currently offlineSSTjumbo From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (9 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 951 times:

Old school conservative politics seem to be mostly synonymous with today's libertarian politics, any validity to this? Back in the day, I would have voted for conservatives to keep the government out of my bedroom and out of my pocketbook. Who can I vote for today?  boxedin 

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