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Honda Why No Flagship Car.  
User currently offline747400sp From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3758 posts, RR: 2
Posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 3432 times:

Nissan has the Maxima and Toyota has the Avalon why Honda has no car to fight them. A scaled down Honda version of the Acura RL would make the perfect car to go against the Nissan Maxima and theToyoda Avalon. The V6 in RL can be tune down and compete with the 265 hp V6 in the Maxima and the 280 hp in the new Avalon. I know Honda has there reason, but I see it as a miss opportunity.

34 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineDeltaGuy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 3397 times:

Because Honda is a useless car, that's why. They spend all their time trying to market it as a complete gas saver...you'll never see a honda with more horsepower than it needs..no fun in fuel savings. Any honda I've ever driven was a gas sipping, 0-60 in 2.5 days, busch-league piece of highschool-grade junk. Just my .02 though.

DeltaGuy


User currently offlineAsstChiefMark From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 3395 times:

VROOM !! VROOM !!



User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13200 posts, RR: 15
Reply 3, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 3386 times:

They don't need a separate car, they already have the Accord as their flagship car. If you want more luxury and preformance, then go to the Acura line. that is just like the American car business, you had the Chevy for the basic customer with Olds, Buick and then Caddy for the better off customers.

User currently offlineACDC8 From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 7653 posts, RR: 35
Reply 4, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 3384 times:

The interesting thing about Honda is that the Accord sold in Europe is always different then the one sold in North America, at least the sedan model is. The current European Accord is sold in North America as the Acura TSX, go figure.


A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
User currently offlineCORULEZ05 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 3382 times:

um, what about the Accord? I would venture to say that is their "flagship" car. I don't know much about the brand but the Accord certainly looks like a decent car that can compete with all the others in that class.

Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 3):
If you want more luxury and preformance, then go to the Acura line.

EXACTLY! Although, you can get some luxury with the Accord but obviously less priced than the Acura RL.


User currently offlineDelta767300ER From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 2562 posts, RR: 11
Reply 6, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 3372 times:

The Honda S2000 is a hell of a car. 2.0 Liter 240 HP VTEC, 6-speed manual gearbox, Digital guages, ect. This car will flat out fly! It makes you feel like your in a fighter jet.

-Delta767300ER


User currently offline747400sp From United States of America, joined Aug 2003, 3758 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 3362 times:

Not to put down the Accord because I drive one. But it compete with the Nissan Altima and Toyota Camry.




PS: The Altima maybe a little more fun to drive than a Accord but the Camry is just boring.


User currently offlineSrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 3350 times:

Screw Honda, buy a Dodge, maybe the Charger, preferably with a Hemi!!!!!!!!


User currently offlineAerobalance From United States of America, joined Sep 2000, 4683 posts, RR: 46
Reply 9, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 3346 times:

Yet Honda can still kick Chevy's (Cosworth) ass in the IRL........

[Edited 2005-07-31 04:34:40]


"Sing a song, play guitar, make it snappy..."
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26815 posts, RR: 75
Reply 10, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 3 hours ago) and read 3330 times:

Quoting 747400sp (Thread starter):

Nissan has the Maxima and Toyota has the Avalon why Honda has no car to fight them. A scaled down Honda version of the Acura RL would make the perfect car to go against the Nissan Maxima and theToyoda Avalon.

Honda, by marketing its Acura division to not only the high (like Lexus) but also the medium level market, has killed the Honda marque's need for a top level car in the US. Remember too, the Maxima has always been targeted more at sport sedan buyers, while the Avalon and the much lamented Cressida are square at the Buick-buying public

Quoting 747400sp (Thread starter):
The V6 in RL can be tune down and compete with the 265 hp V6 in the Maxima and the 280 hp in the new Avalon.

They would need to uprate the engine in that case, not derate it



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineAsuflyer05 From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2373 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 3321 times:

Quoting 747400sp (Thread starter):
A scaled down Honda version of the Acura RL would make the perfect car to go against the Nissan Maxima and theToyoda Avalon.

They do it's called the Acura TL. And it whips the Maxima. You can even get it with a 6 speed.

Toyota only sold a little over 37,000 Avalons in 2004, down from about 51,000 in 03. Nissan has been struggling with the Maxima also, as you can tell by the $1500 rebate they are offering on them.

For 2006 the Accord V6 is rated at 250hp (up 10 from 05) and both the sedan and coupe are available with a 6speed manual. They will also feature the most technologically advanced navigation system in their class. IMHO the Accord fills a huge spectrum of the market. From the 18,000 Value Package to the $32,000 Hybrid.

Matt


User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 59
Reply 12, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 3320 times:

here's their flagship car... bigthumbsup 




"Up the Irons!"
User currently offlineFlight152 From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 3413 posts, RR: 6
Reply 13, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 2 hours ago) and read 3314 times:

Because Honda is a useless car, that's why.

What a useless comment. Honda kicks GM's ass in the reliability, depreciation and build quality is concerned, which hardly makes it useless.


Honda, by marketing its Acura division to not only the high (like Lexus) but also the medium level market, has killed the Honda marque's need for a top level car in the US.

Not always true, VW has made a niche (abliet quite small) for the Phaeton.

[Edited 2005-07-31 06:00:02]

User currently offlineDan2002 From United States of America, joined Dec 2002, 2055 posts, RR: 5
Reply 14, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 1 hour ago) and read 3296 times:

Quoting Flight152 (Reply 13):

What a useless comment. Honda kicks GM's ass in the reliability, depreciation and build quality is concerned, which hardly makes it useless.

Dont you have a BMW to crash or get tickets in?


-Dan



A guy asks 'What's Punk?'. I kick over a trash can and its punk. He knocks over a trash can and its trendy.
User currently offlineACDC8 From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 7653 posts, RR: 35
Reply 15, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 3260 times:

Quoting Flight152 (Reply 13):
What a useless comment. Honda kicks GM's ass in the reliability, depreciation and build quality is concerned, which hardly makes it useless.

Absolutly, Honda's are fantastic. I've had a Civic and an Accord and never had a single problem with them. I had a Pontiac Sunbird and it was literly in the garage getting fixed every other weekend.
My parents have have had 2 Buicks, nothing but problems. And are now very happy with their Accord.

Quoting Flight152 (Reply 13):
Not always true, VW has made a niche (abliet quite small) for the Phaeton.

Very, very, very, very small niche. Personally I think they should have given the car and Audi badge. As good as the Phaeton is, and I'm sure it's worth every penny, but $66,000 is waaaaaaaay too much for a VW.



A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
User currently offlineN1120A From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26815 posts, RR: 75
Reply 16, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 3253 times:

Quoting Asuflyer05 (Reply 11):
They do it's called the Acura TL. And it whips the Maxima. You can even get it with a 6 speed.

As you can with the Maxima



Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
User currently offlineRedDragon From United Kingdom, joined Jul 2004, 1135 posts, RR: 6
Reply 17, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 3221 times:

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 15):
Very, very, very, very small niche. Personally I think they should have given the car and Audi badge. As good as the Phaeton is, and I'm sure it's worth every penny, but $66,000 is waaaaaaaay too much for a VW.

Ditto for the British market, but replacing the dollar sign with a pound sign. Now that's too much for a VW A8!


User currently offlineJacobin777 From United States of America, joined Sep 2004, 14968 posts, RR: 59
Reply 18, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 11 hours ago) and read 3205 times:

Quoting DeltaGuy (Reply 1):
Because Honda is a useless car, that's why.

people could say whatever they want..but there is a reason why Honda has had record earnings and GM's debt rating is JUNK..JUNK, JUNK, JUNK!!


did I mention that GM's debt rating is JUNK?  spin 



"Up the Irons!"
User currently offlineFlight152 From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 3413 posts, RR: 6
Reply 19, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 3181 times:

Dont you have a BMW to crash or get tickets in?

How about you say nothing if you don't have something productive to say?


User currently offlineCORULEZ05 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 3178 times:

Quoting Flight152 (Reply 19):
How about you say nothing if you don't have something productive to say?

that would be the end of the non-aviation forum!!!!!!!


User currently offlineMrChips From Canada, joined Mar 2005, 938 posts, RR: 0
Reply 21, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 3175 times:

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 18):
did I mention that GM's debt rating is JUNK?

Not to mention almost every vehicle that they make. I once had the opportunity to get a ride in GM's "flagship" SUV, the Cadillac Escalade, and for a vehicle that cost almost CDN$110,000, I was dismayed to see more plastic trim than in an econobox. Also, the fit and finish of the interior reminded you that you are in fact driving a truck and not a vehicle passed off as a luxury car.

And don't get me even started on GM's mid-sized and econoboxes...they are poorly made, butt-ugly and very unreliable. Christ, my 18 year old VW is more reliable than some of these cars.

The only cars that GM produces that I can tolerate are the GTO (we don't get it here in Canada, the current model is done next year, and they're gonna screw it up in 2008 anyways by making it into a 4-door coupe...let's see how bad GM makes it), and the C6.

Now, as far as I'm concerned, when you buy a Honda (and to a lesser extent, Toyota), you are getting far superior automobile in all aspects. Even GM will admit it...their new ad campaign for their trucks says it all..."There's no Japanese word for pick-up truck". Now why would they be spreading FUD if they had a better product than the Nissan Titan or the Toyota Tundra?



Time...to un-pimp...ze auto!
User currently offlineChris78cpr From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2004, 2823 posts, RR: 50
Reply 22, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 3173 times:

Quoting DeltaGuy (Reply 1):
Because Honda is a useless car, that's why

Right......

Civic Type R..... S2000...... NSX....... Accord Type R.......

I had the pleasure of travelling about 1000 miles in an NSX recently and i can say that it was everything but useless! 194mph in a Honda is sure not useless! Fapping fun as heck i would say! Big grin

Chris



5D2/7D/1D2(soon to be a 1Dx) 17-40L/24-105L/70-200F2.8L/100-400L/24F1.4LII/50F1.2L/85F1.2LII
User currently offlineFlight152 From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 3413 posts, RR: 6
Reply 23, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 9 hours ago) and read 3173 times:

Now why would they be spreading FUD if they had a better product than the Nissan Titan or the Toyota Tundra?

I think Ford and GM should be embarrassed that the newcomer to the market, the Honda Ridgeline beat out their offerings in the big auto mags, even though they have been in the market for decades.

http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=15&article_id=9470


User currently offlineAmericanMD80 From United States of America, joined Apr 2000, 491 posts, RR: 5
Reply 24, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 4 days 8 hours ago) and read 3157 times:

Quoting DeltaGuy (Reply 1):
Because Honda is a useless car, that's why. They spend all their time trying to market it as a complete gas saver...you'll never see a honda with more horsepower than it needs..no fun in fuel savings. Any honda I've ever driven was a gas sipping, 0-60 in 2.5 days, busch-league piece of highschool-grade junk. Just my .02 though.

I guess you've never had the pleasure of driving one with one of their smooth, very responsive V6's. I drive a 97 Civic with 104,000 miles on it. Never a single problem. I love getting great gas mileage. My friends have had nothing but problems with the their GM's.

Accord's kick ass. But it is dissapointing that they put all the luxury emphasis on Acura.

Cannot wait to see the 2006 Civic. I hear we're getting Navi available in it. Moving up market.

VTEC 4 EVER!

//americanmd80

[Edited 2005-08-01 00:25:16]


do what you like . like what you do . life is good
25 N312RC : Im born and raised in Detroit, and as much as I'd like to see the hometown guy do well, I must say that General Motors cars are simply crap. The probl
26 Post contains images ACDC8 : I sat in one of their STS's, priced at about CDN$70,000. The amount of the absolute cheapest plastic I've ever seen in my life filled every nook and
27 Slider : Good point- Honda's FIRST TRUCK with the largest engine they've ever built and they knock the ball out of the park. Home run at first swing at the pl
28 Falcon84 : When I first met my wife, she had an '85 Accord. Nicest car I've ever gotten to drive. Power everything; quite; smooth; who gives a shit if it can't
29 Halls120 : I have a TL with a manual transmission. It corners like a monster, and it not only whips the Maxima, but holds its own with the BMW 5 series. When I
30 Post contains links and images AmericanMD80 : I currently have this as my desktop background. It's my favorite design from Honda. I want this car so bad! I wish I had the money so I could even con
31 Delta767300ER : I've always been a GM guy but their are only a few of their vehicles I like. Of course I like the Camaro/Firebirds (Hope they start em up again someti
32 Post contains images ACDC8 : Would be nice if GM would bring them back in 2007 (40th anniversary). If GM was smart, they'd get the styling right for once and give us Mustang owne
33 Post contains images Delta767300ER : ACDC8, Yes it would be great. I liked the 1st/2nd/4th Generation F-Bodies but I think its time to go slightly retro. If they decide to return, I hope
34 Post contains images ACDC8 : That's what I'd like to see as well. '68 Camaro is my absolute dream car. Sweet! Mine is stock ... 2000 GT.
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