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Alienware Or PowerBook?  
User currently offlineSpringbok747 From Australia, joined Nov 2004, 4387 posts, RR: 10
Posted (9 years 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 1354 times:

It's finally happened, my HP laptop died this morning after a long struggle with a failing hard disk and a flickering display. The bill to fix it is just ridiculous (AU$1200)...so I decided to give it a proper burial and get a new laptop..  tombstone 

I was an Apple user but stopped using it about 5 months ago when my cousin stole my iBook from me  Sad

So..I was considering buying a light notebook which I can carry around with me. I don't like Dell (because their service sucks..at least here in Australia), and nope..I don't want another HP/Compaq.

Alienware seems pretty good...but is it really worth spending $3000 for it? For the same price I can get a Powerbook G4 with superdrive. Which do you guys think is better? Anyone here own an Alienware? How is their after-sales service?

From experience, I know that Mac is a much better OS than Windows, but the software available for Mac is very limited and expensive..so I was thinking of getting a Windows machine.

So..which one should I get - Windows or Mac? I'd appreciate any help I can get here.
Thanks in advance  Smile


אני תומך בישראל
33 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineAmy From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2005, 1150 posts, RR: 7
Reply 1, posted (9 years 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1352 times:

Windows, but don't get Alienware they're stupidly overpriced!

Get a techy mate to make your system for you.



A340-300 - slow, but awesome!
User currently offlineZone1 From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 1035 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (9 years 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1345 times:

Quoting Springbok747 (Thread starter):
I was an Apple user but stopped using it about 5 months ago when my cousin stole my iBook from me

Can't you steal it back?

Alienwares get horrible battery life and weigh a ton. If your choices are only Alienware or Apple, go with the Apple. Girls are more impressed with them anyway.



/// U N I T E D
User currently offlineUA777222 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3348 posts, RR: 11
Reply 3, posted (9 years 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1347 times:

Quoting Springbok747 (Thread starter):
I was an Apple user but stopped using it about 5 months ago when my cousin stole my iBook from me  

Gotta love family!

I say go for the powerbook. You clearly see what the PC's are built of and like yourself, I was faced with the same choice only my PC was much much newer. I made a leap for a powerbook G4 and never turned back. That was a little over a year and a half ago and I have sense upgraded to a 15" powerbook over the 12" though I like the smaller size much more.

I know that here in the states you get almost 50% off on software and close to 13% off on all apple products with proper student id... just an idea. Don't quote me on the those numbers either.

Thanks,

Matt



"It wasn't raining when Noah built the ark."
User currently offlineTedTAce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (9 years 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 1337 times:

Definately NOT Alienware, it's all bang, bucks, and little QUALITY.

Toshiba  thumbsup 
or
www.tomshardware.com
or slightly biased www.pcmag.com


User currently offlineAirlinelover From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 5580 posts, RR: 23
Reply 5, posted (9 years 2 weeks 4 days ago) and read 1334 times:

NOT any piece of Sheit by apple.... I'd rather die then use a macintrash..

Chris



Lets do some sexy math. We add you, subtract your clothes, divide your legs and multiply
User currently offline174thfwff From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (9 years 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 1287 times:

Wow, okay Chris...very intelligent comment.

Spring,
I have an Apple Powerbook. I bought it for three reasons.
1) Ease of use
2) Lack of Spyware/Viruses
3) Features for cost

If you look at a fully loaded Powerbook, sure the cost does seem high to those $1000 Dell notebooks, however when you add DVD burners, bluetooth, wireless internet, they all add up.


I love my Powerbook, and if you have any specific questions, please feel free to ask me.


-JP

PS- Go visit www.macnn.com for all your Mac needs!


User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 85
Reply 7, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 1266 times:

This may be the last time I ever say this, but now is not the time to buy a new Apple laptop unless you really need a computer now.

Note I'm also not suggesting you buy a PC, because I never would.

N


User currently offlineF9Widebody From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1604 posts, RR: 10
Reply 8, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 1262 times:

Go check out a tablet PC before you make up your mind. Those things are sweet!


YES URLS in signature!!!
User currently offlineCfalk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 1256 times:

I have an Alienware Area-51m 7700 laptop - this one, in fact:


It has a 3.6 Ghz processor, 2 GB of RAM, 120 GB HD, and an NVidia graphics card with 256MB. The 17inch screen is literally the finest quality screen I have ever used, either laptop or desktop, LCD or CRT. Images are beautifully sharp, the colors great, and contrast is perfect. Gaming on this machine is great, with the 4 integrated speakers plus integrated subwoofer. Performance-wise, the 7700 is a tour-de-force.

Now the downsides. This sumbitch is a heavy motherfu%ker. If you need to move your PC a couple of times per week, fine. But you do not want to carry it arround every day.

Second downside. With all the power that this PC has, it gets hot, especially around the area your palm rests on. Basically this heat makes using the keyboard very uncomfortable after a while. I solved this problem by finding a very nice, very thin mobile cordless keyboard and mouse made by Logitech. The keyboard is ultrathin, and easily slips into the carrybag alongside the PC. It's this one:


So that's it - It's hot and heavy, pun intended, for both good and bad. you might consider the lighter versions like the Sentia series laptops and lose the nice 17 inch screen, or you can choose a less powerful processor than I did, and have the 7700 run cooler.

Cheers,

Charles


User currently offlineLOT767-300ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 1246 times:

Quoting 174thfwff (Reply 6):
If you look at a fully loaded Powerbook, sure the cost does seem high to those $1000 Dell notebooks, however when you add DVD burners, bluetooth, wireless internet, they all add up.

You can buy a Compaq with a Turion 64 bit processor with 512mb RAM, 14 inch WXGA, DVD Burner, 802.11G with a 60GB HD for $750 after $200 Mail in rebates. What kind of crap argument is bluetooth, seriously. You can get a 100m Bluetooth USB adapter for $30-40.

Show me an Apple for that price with those features. Apples are nice but they can go shove those prices back to Califronia where they belong for the specs they have. Yea a 15 inch powerbook starts at $1999 and the lowest end 12 inch (thats just too small of a screen to begin with) is $1499...ridiculous. If you want a 17 inch powerbook thats $2699 with 512mb of RAM.

To be serious, I sell computers, I build my own computers and I get to play with every diffferent companies computers and models and Apple are very sexy looking and nice interface. But if I want something nice and sexy to look at ill go out with my girlfriend. Sorry, id rather dish out $800-1000 for a Windows based machine than minimum of $2000 for the same screen size, To me keeping my Anti-Spyware on automatic scan and Norton doesnt trouble me that much, at least it doesnt trouble me enough to spend $1000 more on making it go away. In my eyes its all how you care for your computer, you use it smart and run the right stuff you will RARELY run into trouble.

BTW, just by looking at the Apple website and looking at the upgrade from 512mb to 1GB of RAM makes me want to punch Apple in the face and burn down their HQ. $150 for 1 stick of DDR 333mhz? Bah I know you can buy it normal RAM for apple at retail store (For which a PC3200 512mb chip goes for $25 after rebate) but thats a price only that fool who drives that Ford Explorer with the Mac apple bumper sticker would accept. Did I mention the 15 inch powerbook for $2000 doesnt come with a DVD-Burner, oh yes thats another $150. So we are up to $2300 for a 15 inch laptop? I could get a 3.6ghz P4 with probably 2GB of RAM a DVD-Burner and a 100GB HD for less than $2000 With a 17 inch screen

[Edited 2005-08-07 09:36:44]

User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 85
Reply 11, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 1223 times:

They price what the market will bear... and they get outstanding yields as a result.

You also have to keep in mind that, for the time being, their cost base is much higher due to the components used. That will change next year and I think we'll get pleasant results.

N


User currently offlineCfalk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 1216 times:

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 11):
They price what the market will bear... and they get outstanding yields as a result.

True. Apple has snob-appeal, It's kinda like buying a Rolls Royce - It's not a better car than a BMW, but it sure costs more.

That's why IBM got shot out of the market. They assumed that people would be willing to pay more for an IBM than for one of the hundreds of generic brands. Oops.

As long as Apple has a different operating system, they will keep that snob appeal. But if they start using Intel processors where the Mac OS would operate on any other Intel PC, they are gone.

Charles


User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 968 posts, RR: 51
Reply 13, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 10 hours ago) and read 1212 times:

>> That's why IBM got shot out of the market. They assumed that people would be willing to pay more for an IBM than for one of the hundreds of generic brands. Oops.

So let's ignore the facts that the ThinkPad series of notebooks have widely been regarded as the best PC-based laptops since their inception, to this very day? Or the fact that IBM has, for some time now, been migrating away from consumer and corperate products and focusing on the service industry?

>> As long as Apple has a different operating system, they will keep that snob appeal. But if they start using Intel processors where the Mac OS would operate on any other Intel PC, they are gone.

This isn't true. Mac OS-X is years ahead of Windows-based opperating systems, many of the "innovations" set to debut on Windows Vista were introduced months ago with the introduction of the latest OS-X build. Even running on an Intel chip, Mac OS-X's unix code is more stable and more efficent than Windows. You're completly wrong.

What's snobish about a system that works well? I don't enjoy spending my time obsessing about security, waiting for a sluggish opperating system to respond, or watching my performance degrade as my system registery becomes bloated, and that makes me.... a snob?

Try using Mac products for a while before passing such sweeping generalizations.


User currently offlineCfalk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 1203 times:

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 13):
So let's ignore the facts that the ThinkPad series of notebooks have widely been regarded as the best PC-based laptops since their inception, to this very day? Or the fact that IBM has, for some time now, been migrating away from consumer and corperate products and focusing on the service industry?

Thinkpads were OK, but I would not call them the best. But I think you were still in Grammar school when IBM was the number 1 PC supplier. They eventually got beaten by Compaq, then Dell, and now everyone. Here in Switzerland, their PCs were 2 or 3 times more expensive than a generic in the early 90's.

IBM did not migrate away from consumer products. They were thrown out of the sector, feet first (with the exception of their decent notebook division, which was sold).

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 13):
What's snobish about a system that works well? I don't enjoy spending my time obsessing about security

I run XP, and every day or two I visit a website that doesn't like my firewall and antivirus, so I shut them off for about an hour. I have never once let in a virus or spyware that way. I think the whole thing is overblown in order to sell security software.

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 13):
waiting for a sluggish opperating system to respond,



We have a collegue who insists on working on Macs for her graphics. Her top of the line Mac crashes frequently with large eps files, and takes forever to recover. My laptop is much faster, has a better display, and has never crashed using the same files (actually, I create those files - she just publishes)

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 13):
and that makes me.... a snob?

Most people use Macs out of snobbery, I am convinced. I keep hearing how Mac is much better for graphics. People in the graphics and publishing industry keep saying that. I've been hearing that for nearly 20 years, and while it was certainly true back then, it isn't any more.

And then there is this one-button mouse. My mouse (a Logitech Mediaplay) has 11 buttons, plus a scroller. I only use 6 of the buttons and the scroller, but I can fly around the screen, getting stuff done - especially with graphics. When I watch guys going so slow using one or two buttons, I get upset at them.

Charles


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21442 posts, RR: 54
Reply 15, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 1192 times:

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 14):
I run XP, and every day or two I visit a website that doesn't like my firewall and antivirus, so I shut them off for about an hour. I have never once let in a virus or spyware that way. I think the whole thing is overblown in order to sell security software.

Your system is so crippled that you need to disable security to access the web properly? Wow! That´s pretty bad!  Wow!

And no, it´s not overblown. A well-known german computer magazine keeps testing Windows security among other things, and it usually takes an unprotected Windows less than an hour on average to become infected. Some patches help somewhat, and not using Internet Explorer helps significantly, but it´s still russian roulette.

Sure, if you don´t care about your credit card data or spammers using your system as a relay right under your nose - just keep going like that...  crazy 

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 14):
We have a collegue who insists on working on Macs for her graphics. Her top of the line Mac crashes frequently with large eps files, and takes forever to recover. My laptop is much faster, has a better display, and has never crashed using the same files (actually, I create those files - she just publishes)

Let me guess: That system had been "top of the line" about four or five years ago, still runs under Classic MacOS (not OS X) in order to not upgrade some specific applications and one of those applications crashes when it has to read Windows-generated EPS files (which are notoriously problematic - publishing houses use Macs exactly because of that, among other reasons).

You´ll find that OS X applications have a hard time crashing the entire system. Which also means there is no significant recovery time - just restart the offending application and go on.

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 14):
Most people use Macs out of snobbery, I am convinced.

And just to be sure, you never bother to confront your "convictions" with actual reality... Big grin

Actually, most people use Macintoshes because they just work - primarily because of the software (OS X and its applications), secondarily because of the hardware; In both cases you notice that somebody actually did give a damn about usability (which certainly can´t be said about 98% of all PCs and least of all about Windows, regardless how cheap or expensive the PC it´s running on).

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 14):
And then there is this one-button mouse. My mouse (a Logitech Mediaplay) has 11 buttons, plus a scroller. I only use 6 of the buttons and the scroller, but I can fly around the screen, getting stuff done - especially with graphics. When I watch guys going so slow using one or two buttons, I get upset at them.

I´ve always used multi-button mice with my Macs. I can understand that some people prefer the simplicity (and under OS X applications are generally designed so you normally don´t ever need context menus - contrary to Windows). You simply have a bunch of never-examined prejudices.

I´ve worked with Windows, Linux and MacOS (both classic and OS X). And I prefer to work with OS X by a wide margin over constantly fighting Windows or having to fiddle with Linux config files. I could - I just don´t want to. I need to get my work done, I have no spare time for permanent system babying.


User currently offlineCfalk From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 1184 times:

Quoting Klaus (Reply 15):
Your system is so crippled that you need to disable security to access the web properly? Wow! That´s pretty bad!

I think it's Norton. I have 4 PC's, all with Norton Security, and all have the same problem with that one site. No other sites create that problem.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 15):
Let me guess: That system had been "top of the line" about four or five years ago, still runs under Classic MacOS (not OS X) in order to not upgrade some specific applications and one of those applications crashes when it has to read Windows-generated EPS files (which are notoriously problematic - publishing houses use Macs exactly because of that, among other reasons).

She tells me it's 2 years old, and it has OS X. I create the EPS files on Corel Draw 11, and whenever she gets them open, they are perfect.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 15):
And just to be sure, you never bother to confront your "convictions" with actual reality...

Sounds like you are guilty of the same.


User currently offlineLOT767-300ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1182 times:

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 11):
They price what the market will bear... and they get outstanding yields as a result.

You also have to keep in mind that, for the time being, their cost base is much higher due to the components used. That will change next year and I think we'll get pleasant results.

The market is not bearing the results fast enough because Apple has HARDLY even touched the PC dominance.

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 13):
What's snobish about a system that works well? I don't enjoy spending my time obsessing about security, waiting for a sluggish opperating system to respond, or watching my performance degrade as my system registery becomes bloated, and that makes me.... a snob?

Because you can buy the same stable system, oh wait you can GET IT FOR FREE and if you work it right it will be probably more stable than OS X, can you say Linux. So your comment has no backup. A good solid OS can be free and as solid as OS X.

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 14):
I run XP, and every day or two I visit a website that doesn't like my firewall and antivirus, so I shut them off for about an hour. I have never once let in a virus or spyware that way. I think the whole thing is overblown in order to sell security software.

Agree 100% with that, I never even look twice at my security and anti-spyware and it runs automatically with me maybe just taking a look at the full system scan every week.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 15):
Your system is so crippled that you need to disable security to access the web properly? Wow! That´s pretty bad! Wow!

Yes system is crippled Klaus because one website doesnt display right....wonderful logic.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 15):
Quoting Cfalk (Reply 14):
Most people use Macs out of snobbery, I am convinced.

And just to be sure, you never bother to confront your "convictions" with actual reality... Big grin

Your living proof.  Silly

Say what you may Klaus but I will only get an Apple if they stop raping customers up the @$$ because they slapped on a white piece of plastic with round curves. I built a system in the last 2 days from tigerdirect.com with a 3.06ghz (From previous machine) 1.5GB RAM, DVD Burner, CD-Burner, 12 in 1 media card reader with front USB, Ultra Fanmaster 7 fan automatic LCD control, 2x250GB WD Hard Drives, a mad dog case for a 120GB External USB2.0, Wireless G, 8x USB, 19 inch LCD, ATI Radeon 9700 Pro 128mb, Asus Socket 478 Motherboard, and a Liquid Cooling system, and a custom Xion II Case for under $850. This computer looks LIGHT YEARS better than any Mac Desktop (hell its riced out) ive ever seen and as stable as a rock, using ZoneAlarm Pro and Norton Securities it is pretty untouchable. But the dagger here is it looks about 10x cooler than a freaking Power Mac G5 which is what $1999 w/o monitor at BASE MODEL.


User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 85
Reply 18, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1174 times:

Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 17):
The market is not bearing the results fast enough because Apple has HARDLY even touched the PC dominance.

Pointless. They don't need to.

Their profit margin is outstanding, as is their actual profit and their stock price.

They don't NEED to be any bigger. Quality v. quantity. They want to sell a better product, not necessarily more of it.

N


User currently offlineLOT767-300ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 1171 times:

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 18):
Pointless. They don't need to.

Their profit margin is outstanding, as is their actual profit and their stock price.

They don't NEED to be any bigger. Quality v. quantity. They want to sell a better product, not necessarily more of it.

Isnt the point of any company to get bigger? If quality is their main point why are they not like Ferrari, Lamborghini, Alienware etc. where they have no stupid ads or marketing to make their brand known. Is it recently then that Apple has changed this logic since the the well the mid-to late 90s when they were raped by PCs, and almost saw them go bye bye. Sorry Apple is no Ferrari, they are in the computer and electronics making business and they need to upkeep their marketing which obviously is aimed for helping them keep and gain market share.


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21442 posts, RR: 54
Reply 20, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1170 times:

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 16):
I create the EPS files on Corel Draw 11, and whenever she gets them open, they are perfect.

What you reported is quite implausible under OS X. She may be running the old application under the Classic sub-system which can in fact be crashed by an application, but won´t bring OS X down since it runs as an OS X application itself (it would then be necessary to re-start the Classic sub-system and the old application after a crash). This scenario has next to nothing to do with the user experience a normal user would have today. It´s strictly a legacy problem.

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 16):
I create the EPS files on Corel Draw 11, and whenever she gets them open, they are perfect.

Corel Draw? Well, that´s pretty much the worst one around when it comes to its data output. The professional printing and layout services I know refuse any fixed date or price arrangements when they´re being threatened with Corel Draw data... Corel Draw is strictly "we´ll see if we can get it to print - somehow".

You can be happy if the output is even mostly similar to what you had seen in Corel Draw itself.

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 16):
Quoting Klaus (Reply 15):
And just to be sure, you never bother to confront your "convictions" with actual reality...
Sounds like you are guilty of the same.

Contrary to you two, I actually use Windows, Linux and MacOS (and I´m occasionally asked to help people get their Windows machines back to work).

Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 17):
Because you can buy the same stable system, oh wait you can GET IT FOR FREE and if you work it right it will be probably more stable than OS X, can you say Linux. So your comment has no backup. A good solid OS can be free and as solid as OS X.

You didn´t get the point - as most people don´t who haven´t actually worked with the different systems. The difference is not primarily in the amount of crashes per hour. The difference is in the way the different systems constantly get in your way (Windows), require constant administrative effort to really do what you want (Linux) or just work with you (MacOS).

Most people are convinced that using a computer would always be full of difficult problems and obscure threats, fragile and unpleasant in general.

That explains the surprise when they´ve begun to use MacOS. It´s generally a feeling of great relief.

Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 17):
Yes system is crippled Klaus because one website doesnt display right....wonderful logic.

The point is that the system apparently can´t work properly and be safe at the same time. Which is pretty much the definition of a crippled system.

Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 17):
This computer looks LIGHT YEARS better than any Mac Desktop (hell its riced out) ive ever seen and as stable as a rock, using ZoneAlarm Pro and Norton Securities it is pretty untouchable. But the dagger here is it looks about 10x cooler than a freaking Power Mac G5 which is what $1999 w/o monitor at BASE MODEL.

I think that stands for itself. Not everybody sees a "riced out" plastic box with tacky neon lights and the same ugly and hostile Windows as everywhere else as the epitome of elegant design... Big grin


User currently offlineLOT767-300ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1168 times:

Quoting Klaus (Reply 20):
You didn�t get the point - as most people don�t who haven�t actually worked with the different systems. The difference is not primarily in the amount of crashes per hour. The difference is in the way the different systems constantly get in your way (Windows), require constant administrative effort to really do what you want (Linux) or just work with you (MacOS).

I dont think you got the point that 90% of consumers could care less if its Windows if its 2.5 times less expensive, and I know im right in that theory.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 20):

The point is that the system apparently can�t work properly and be safe at the same time. Which is pretty much the definition of a crippled system.

Stop being hypothetical, Norton is blocking 1 of his websites, whoopty doo pee ha...hopefully its apple.com though  Silly

Quoting Klaus (Reply 20):
I think that stands for itself. Not everybody sees a "riced out" plastic box with tacky neon lights and the same ugly and hostile Windows as everywhere else as the epitome of elegant design... Big grin

Neon lights? LMFAO sorry to disappoint you I dont have those. Im not one of those crazy Germans who plays conterstrike 24/7 and has 4 120mm case fans glowing with UV Green everywhere, neither is it plastic.

Ask yourself this quetion, why do you need your computer to look "elegant" and "sexy" for $2500 if your probably the only one looking at it. Is it because with a bit of fiberglass it shouts "I just got raped, but thats ok its got OS X"


User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21442 posts, RR: 54
Reply 22, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1163 times:

Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 21):
I dont think you got the point that 90% of consumers could care less if its Windows if its 2.5 times less expensive, and I know im right in that theory.

2.5 times is not realistic when you look at the whole package, not even in the notebook arena.

And sure, all too many people prefer cheap crap over quality - no doubt about it!

I for my part am not rich enough to afford the same kind of cheap crap over and over. I just buy quality which sticks with me over a long time and does what I need it to do.

Quoting LOT767-300ER (Reply 21):
Ask yourself this quetion, why do you need your computer to look "elegant" and "sexy" for $2500 if your probably the only one looking at it. Is it because with a bit of fiberglass it shouts "I just got raped, but thats ok its got OS X"

I need a tool that is powerful, reliable, flexible, requires practically no administration and system maintenance at all and is pleasant to use, both in hardware and software.

So why waste any money on a system that brings regular aggravation, system insecurity, an operating system that´s years behind and is clumsy and maintenance-intensive on top?

I simply prefer products that were created with more than just a passing thought to anything other than cost cutting and profit maximization. Apple products are generally well-designed, with considerable attention to detail, usability and overall user experience. And that extends to hardware and software alike.

The point is that a well-designed system is in the end more efficient than a cheap and sloppily-designed one. If the main application is the installation of the latest video game the difference may not be that noticeable; But the more you actually use it the more apparent it becomes.


User currently offlineLOT767-300ER From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1160 times:

Quoting Klaus (Reply 22):

2.5 times is not realistic when you look at the whole package, not even in the notebook arena.

And sure, all too many people prefer cheap crap over quality - no doubt about it!

I for my part am not rich enough to afford the same kind of cheap crap over and over. I just buy quality which sticks with me over a long time and does what I need it to do.

Sorry, maybe 2-2.25x then  Silly Ive had a Dell (which I canibalized for parts (read P4) 2 days ago) for over 3 years and NOT had 1 problem with it, hell I think I may only gotten 1 virus with it because of my stupidity. Honestly, I know your that guy with that 1991 Boxy Volvo Wagon, the definition of what I hate. Im not rich enough to spend $2000 for a 15 inch screen and no DVD burner, but wait whats the whole package? Hell CCity is throwing in a free bag, a free G router and a free Canon IP1600 printer with any notebook, cheap stuff? Yes, but it brings in customers like Gkirk seeing a flock of sheep.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 22):



Quoting Klaus (Reply 22):

I need a tool that is powerful, reliable, flexible, requires practically no administration and system maintenance at all and is pleasant to use, both in hardware and software.

So why waste any money on a system that brings regular aggravation, system insecurity, an operating system that´s years behind and is clumsy and maintenance-intensive on top?

I simply prefer products that were created with more than just a passing thought to anything other than cost cutting and profit maximization. Apple products are generally well-designed, with considerable attention to detail, usability and overall user experience. And that extends to hardware and software alike.

The point is that a well-designed system is in the end more efficient than a cheap and sloppily-designed one. If the main application is the installation of the latest video game the difference may not be that noticeable; But the more you actually use it the more apparent it becomes.

Let me break this down for you, most people dont need a powerfull tool like this, most people need an affordable laptop for their 18 year old daughter whos going to her local state school for $800-1000 bucks. People like YOU and ME are far and between when we shop for laptops or desktops. Im sure you know what you specifically need and so do I, and I have no problem with people like you spending the money for an Apple and then actually using it to its potential. The hell the average user is going to use all those video, and advanced photo editing software if they cant even learn Photoshop Elements or MS Picture It!

Is XP behind? Yes. Is XP more unstable than OS X? Yes. Can XP be just as stable as OS X? Maybe not PERFECTLY as stable but it can come 99% so, if you know how to use it right.

I think the downfall of your logic and Apple's in the market still is that you are convinced that everyone needs that sexy white fiberglass for $2000.

I am willing to admit that Macs are a hell lot more stable than Windows machines, and a hell lot easier smoother ergonoically and better looking. However, you have to admit that as long as Apples prices are where they are right now your dream of everyone having an Apple (kind of like Apple IIe) is not going to happen unless those prices come down or peoples per capita rises 2x as much. I actually have the same price feelings for a Sony Vaio machine, overpriced for the name.


User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 968 posts, RR: 51
Reply 24, posted (9 years 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 1152 times:

>> However, you have to admit that as long as Apples prices are where they are right now your dream of everyone having an Apple (kind of like Apple IIe) is not going to happen unless those prices come down or peoples per capita rises 2x as much. I actually have the same price feelings for a Sony Vaio machine, overpriced for the name.

As Gigneil subtly hinted at, their price structure could soon lower dramatically as they switch from the PowerPC architecture to an Intel platform. If the price of Apple notebooks and desktops drop $200-400 dollars and retain much the same performance, it is well within the realm of possibility that Mac market share could rise.


25 LOT767-300ER : I agree to this 100%, but Im not a psychic and no one knows for sure how much they will drop, because if they drop by $100-200 it will still be expen
26 Post contains images Springbok747 : Wow..this thread has turned into a real Mac vs Windows battle..hehe Thanks for all the replies guys...I think I'll just build a cheap Windows machine
27 LOT767-300ER : Of course it has, happens everytime me and Klaus enter a thread like this. Im not surprised you will buy a Windows machine, do yourself a favor and d
28 Gigneil : Windows is a low quality product. Period. It is unstable, insecure, and bloats with every application you install. You will not find a more powerful a
29 Klaus : You didn´t read anything I wrote, right? The constant virus/spyware/worm/trojan threat is an important issue, but it´s still just a side issue in t
30 LOT767-300ER : Sorry as a Windows user usability and effectivness comes naturally to me, i dont have to think twice about it like you Apple users.
31 Post contains images Klaus : That´s a rather feeble attempt at a comeback in unknown territory, you know...!
32 DfwRevolution : >> Sorry as a Windows user usability and effectivness comes naturally to me, i dont have to think twice about it like you Apple users. I actually tho
33 Gigneil : I'm a network architect. I require substantially more from my operating system than you ever will. Everything I need in terms of power is available o
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