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Joining The Army?  
User currently offlineUnited737522 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (9 years 2 months 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1261 times:

Hi all,

I am at the point where I have been really looking into college and what I want to do in life. I really want to be an airline pilot. I have been looking into the ways to achieve that. There is of course, the civilian route. I see this as really expensive, and I am not sure that I could build up the time needed to get me hired anywhere within the industry. Then there is the military route. Not only is it free, but I hear airlines prefer people from the military.

So here is my predicament.

-I could go to college, a place such as Embry Riddle or Metro State here in Colorado, both of which offer flight programs. I am not sure of the cost, but I am sure it is not cheap.

-I had an army recruiter approach me at school, he was just talking to me about what I wanted to do. He brought up that the army had an area in aviation. Really surprised me. He told me that I could become a warrant officer and fly helicopters and said it would be great for a future pilot career at the airlines. I could be reserve or active duty. There is also Air Force, Coast Guard, Marines, etc.

Here is the thing, I want to do what it takes to become an airline pilot. I need to know what I should do. Can anyone give me advice? Any is appreciated.

Best Regards,
Ryan Richter

38 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinePacificjourney From New Zealand, joined Jul 2001, 2734 posts, RR: 8
Reply 1, posted (9 years 2 months 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 1241 times:

The guy's telling porkies. If you really want to be an airline pilot via the military then join the air force or navy and fly something big with 4 engines.

Conversion to airliner from rotary is not something airlines are interested in providing thereby defeating your whole plan.



" Help, help ... I'm being oppressed ... "
User currently offlineDLKAPA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (9 years 2 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 1233 times:

Quoting United737522 (Thread starter):
-I could go to college, a place such as Embry Riddle or Metro State here in Colorado, both of which offer flight programs. I am not sure of the cost, but I am sure it is not cheap.

There are others, what I found in my search is that UND is the cheapest compared to ERAU, Metro, and Kansas State Salina.

Quoting United737522 (Thread starter):
-I had an army recruiter approach me at school, he was just talking to me about what I wanted to do. He brought up that the army had an area in aviation. Really surprised me. He told me that I could become a warrant officer and fly helicopters and said it would be great for a future pilot career at the airlines. I could be reserve or active duty. There is also Air Force, Coast Guard, Marines, etc.

Ryan, don't give the recruiters that come to Ponderosa any of your time. They will preach to you all day long about how good the travel benefits and you get to go to exotic places and such and such and how you'll be put right into a flight program... It's all bullshit. One day in Auto shop senior year they were really hamming in up about "oh I went to italy and rome and france and all over europe" so I asked them what it was like to have their legs blown off by machine gun fire...ended their thunder righ there. They aren't out to make you happy ryan they just want to boost their recruitment numbers.


User currently offlineCaptOveur From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (9 years 2 months 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 1219 times:

Quoting Pacificjourney (Reply 1):
Conversion to airliner from rotary is not something airlines are interested in

PJ is actually right here.. Sometimes you can luck out and it happens, but not often..

However, to fly with the AF or Navy you need to be an officer, and that means college.


User currently offlineTWAMD-80 From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 1006 posts, RR: 4
Reply 4, posted (9 years 2 months 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1207 times:

I have a friend that is in the U.S. Air Force Reserves. He is using that to pay for his college tuition and flight courses. Good Luck and keep at it.

TW



Two A-4's, left ten o'clock level continue left turn!
User currently offlineStall From Switzerland, joined Apr 2004, 257 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (9 years 2 months 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 1201 times:

Ryan,

If you want to join the armed forces think carefully.

You might very well end up in a war with people trying very hard to kill you and you doing all you can to kill them.

You might consider the civilian route to get your airline job.



Flying is fun
User currently offlineAirWillie6475 From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 2448 posts, RR: 1
Reply 6, posted (9 years 2 months 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 1196 times:

Quoting United737522 (Thread starter):
He told me that I could become a warrant officer and fly helicopters and said it would be great for a future pilot career at the airlines.

I nearly fell of my bed when I read this. Please tell me you didn't believe him. I don't remember any U.S airlines flying helicopters do you? I remember my local Marine recruiters in high school, I hear Marines Recruits tell even more BS than other branches. He was telling me how Marines have aviation. I asked him don't I have to go through the navy to learn to be a Marine pilot,(I already knew the answer) He said no you don't. That's when I bid him good day and left. I don't think he was trying to lie it was just that he was so ignorant in the field of Miliatary aviation and he was trying to sound like he knew what he was talking about.

Don't go to the military so you can train to be an airline pilot. That's already the wrong mindset. Next thing you know you will be up there in the middle of the night on a bombing mission with fighters trying to blow you out of the sky. I guarentee you that todays military pilots aren't there because they want to go to the airlines.


User currently offlineVikkyvik From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 10258 posts, RR: 26
Reply 7, posted (9 years 2 months 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 1183 times:
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Ryan,

My only advice is to post this topic in the Tech/Ops forum (perhaps with a title that would gain the notice of current airline pilots). I know some of them over there have had military experience, and their experience might help you.

That's all. Good luck.

~Vik



How can I be an admiral without my cap??!
User currently offlineGocaps16 From Japan, joined Jan 2000, 4355 posts, RR: 19
Reply 8, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1148 times:

Quoting AirWillie6475 (Reply 6):
I guarentee you that todays military pilots aren't there because they want to go to the airlines.

Oh, you'll be suprised in the squadrons here where I work. Not all fighter pilot go directly into the airline pre-9/11, but most do and this is directly with the major airline, not regional airlines.

Military route is the best way to go for an airline pilot's career. Training is free, it's competitive, and it's GUARENTEED if you have a slot. Think Air Force or Navy if you want to fly. How many naval aviators do you know that's been shot down during OIF? Very few.

Kevin

[Edited 2005-09-29 23:52:22]


SIX T'S!......TURN. TIME. TWIST. THROTTLE. TALK. TRACK.
User currently offlineAGM114L From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1134 times:

Mr. Ritcher,

Like you I wanted to be an airline pilot. The plan was to get my ratings at an FBO, instruct, then get into the regonial airlines, ect. I started flight lessons in the late 90s at a local FBO becoming Multi-engine commerical rated. Then my flight instructor delivered me pizza and I realized how brutal of a career path that would be for me and decided it wasn't what I wanted. I then joined the Army through the Warrant Officer Flight Training program and have been flying helicopters ever since.

- Most regional airlines only count rotor wing time as 1/2 and then only up to 500 hours, not really competitive if that's all you have going for you.

- If you do go active duty, the GI bill can pay for 60% of your flight training beyond the private rating.

- If you go Guard or Reserve you will recieve money for your education but I'm not familiar with the specifics.

Quoting Stall (Reply 5):
If you want to join the armed forces think carefully.

You might very well end up in a war with people trying very hard to kill you and you doing all you can to kill them.

Yes, this is something you should think about carefully. When I signed up the world was a different place. Times have changed and flying a helicopter in hostile territory is a very real possibility.

Quoting AirWillie6475 (Reply 6):
Don't go to the military so you can train to be an airline pilot. That's already the wrong mindset. Next thing you know you will be up there in the middle of the night on a bombing mission with fighters trying to blow you out of the sky. I guarentee you that todays military pilots aren't there because they want to go to the airlines.

Absolutely. After flying the Apache, I have no desire to trade that in for a B737. Flying in Iraq was like being in the Wild West, and will be the most memorable expirence of my life. I would be bored stiff as an airline pilot, unlike the military you always work with different people, only fly from point A to B, and not to mention the innitial pay cut it would be for me.

Anyway I hope this helps,
Good Luck


User currently offlineBlackbird1331 From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 1894 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 1128 times:

Go for the USAF. You will be in touch with flyers regadless of what role you serve. If you do not get to fly for them, then you will have to finish your obligation, finance the private pilot portion in civilian life, out-of-pocket, and then use the G.I.Bill to go to flight school. That is a government- backed, student loan program.


Cameras shoot pictures. Guns shoot people. They have the guns.
User currently offlineBahadir From United States of America, joined Oct 2001, 1824 posts, RR: 10
Reply 11, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 11 hours ago) and read 1116 times:

Go to a school where you can get loans and use the money for the training. Go to college and a get a degree in something other than an aviation Support yourself with that degree while you are building flight time part time, most of the UND, ERAU , etc. graduates are broke with boat load of loans unless they have rich mom/dad/wife/hubby covering for themselves.

Don't listen to ERAU recruiters about how you can get your first job in less than the conventional routes. Don't believe in Delta Academy when all they gurantee is an interview , not a job.

Go to a local FBO. Make connections. If you can work there as a line guy to get employee rates on the aircraft.

Of course, none of these options are as bad as joining Army and getting killed or being wounded in war. You cannot get a first class medical if you are dead or have one leg left.

Good luck..



Earthbound misfit I
User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 1108 times:

Quoting Pacificjourney (Reply 1):
If you really want to be an airline pilot via the military then join the air force or navy and fly something big with 4 engines.

PacificJourney is absolutely correct. Wanna fly big jets, the Army is not the place. If flying big planes is your sole ambition, and nothing else will suffice, then check out the Air Force.

You'll have to get a college education first, because enlisted folks don't do the flying . . .

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 2):
They will preach to you all day long about how good the travel benefits and you get to go to exotic places and such and such and how you'll be put right into a flight program... It's all bullshit.

No it's not all bullshit. For the record I visted 67 foreign countries in my 24 years. . . . and most of them were during my off duty time. Easier to get to some place like say, Poland because you're living in Germany. Easier to get to some place like say, Hong Kong because you're living in South Korea.

Quoting Stall (Reply 5):
If you want to join the armed forces think carefully.

You might very well end up in a war with people trying very hard to kill you and you doing all you can to kill them

He's got a point. It is the military afterall . . . not a college education benefits program.


User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 8 hours ago) and read 1079 times:

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 2):
and you get to go to exotic places

Like Iraq.

If you want to do a Service, and fly, and convert it into airline flying someday, choose the Air Force or the Navy.


User currently offlineSATL382G From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1068 times:

Quoting United737522 (Thread starter):
Here is the thing, I want to do what it takes to become an airline pilot. I need to know what I should do. Can anyone give me advice? Any is appreciated

First off, don't believe everything you hear, find out for yourself. Recruiters have a quota to meet and may not have your best interests in mind. Many of the people who will post/have posted in this thread simply have no idea of what they are talking about.

If the Army is of interest to you, keep in mind that Army aviators also fly fixed wing. Gulfstreams, Lears, Dash-7s, KingAirs, SD330s, & Swearingen Metros are all in the current inventory and Warrant Officers fly them. Also at least one of the big jet pilots on this board flew Helos in the Army, maybe he'll chime in.

Going to the Navy or Air Force doesn't necessarily guarantee you'll fly fast jets. You could end up in turboprops, helos, drones, or (soon) tilt-rotors. They have additional duties as well, you could end up being a F-16 pilot serving a tour as a combat controller with an Army ground combat unit.

Another thing, aviation isn't all airline flying. Don't be like an inner city kid who sets his sights on being an NBA star without considering the alternatives.

If you like the idea of military flying but being shot at does not appeal to you, you might want to consider the Coast Guard. They fly Gulfstreams, Dassault Falcons, C-130s, Jayhawks, and Dauphins. I believe they require a degree like the Navy and Air Force.

regards


User currently offlineDL021 From United States of America, joined May 2004, 11447 posts, RR: 75
Reply 15, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1064 times:

Don't join the military just to be able to fly fast jets.

Join because you want to serve....join if you feel it's your duty to give back to your country for all that freedom you've been enjoying.

Don't do it if you aren't committed to making the sacrifices necessary.

If you just want to go to school on the government dime then perhaps you should look into financial aid at ERAU.



Is my Pan Am ticket to the moon still good?
User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1063 times:

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 13):
Like Iraq.

One of my 67 foerign countries visited  biggrin 

Quoting SATL382G (Reply 14):
If you like the idea of military flying but being shot at does not appeal to you, you might want to consider the Coast Guard.

I wouldn't be so quick to short sheet the USCG here . . . ever seen them work in the Caribbean or Gulf of Mexico on Counterdrug Operations . . . they take plenty of incoming fire . . . .


User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1062 times:

Quoting DL021 (Reply 15):
Don't join the military just to be able to fly fast jets.

Join because you want to serve....join if you feel it's your duty to give back to your country for all that freedom you've been enjoying.

With all respect, Ian, he can join for any reason he wants to. If he wants to fly jets, learing to do so in the Navy/Air Force is a smart way to go.

Not everyone gets teary-eyed when The Colors are presented. I'd bet a large number of our troops are in not due to patriotism, but economic necessity, or to try and learn a skill.


User currently offlineSATL382G From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1061 times:

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 17):
With all respect, Ian, he can join for any reason he wants to. If he wants to fly jets, learing to do so in the Navy/Air Force is a smart way to go.

Going into the military with your intended sole purpose being to fly aircraft is a sure way to make yourself and everyone around you miserable and unhappy. Pilots like this will spit on the people working for them on their aircraft. Air Force pilots will get entire tours in non-flying jobs, nobody wants to have anything to do with a spoiled brat "I just wanna fly" pilot in a job like that.


User currently offlineSATL382G From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1057 times:

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 16):
I wouldn't be so quick to short sheet the USCG here . . . ever seen them work in the Caribbean or Gulf of Mexico on Counterdrug Operations . . . they take plenty of incoming fire . .

Taking accurate fire in a CG C-130 or Dassault is, ah, unlikely. The CG helos doing intercepts, I believe, are special units with their own ROE and heavy weapons.


User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 20, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1052 times:

Quoting SATL382G (Reply 18):
Going into the military with your intended sole purpose being to fly aircraft is a sure way to make yourself and everyone around you miserable and unhappy. Pilots like this will spit on the people working for them on their aircraft. Air Force pilots will get entire tours in non-flying jobs, nobody wants to have anything to do with a spoiled brat "I just wanna fly" pilot in a job like that.

Your opinion. If he wants to join to fly, he still has to follow all rules, regulations and standards of a given service, put in a certain amount of time, and, if called upon, serve in combat.

And it's amazing you can tell that ANYONE who does this will spit on people. I find that remarkable.


User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1053 times:

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 17):
I'd bet a large number of our troops are in not due to patriotism, but economic necessity, or to try and learn a skill.

Damn you sound like Superfly, or PacificJourney! Did you dip into the wrong Koolaid Jug this morning?

Why don't you take a poll (silly) and ask them why they're in uniform.

Quoting SATL382G (Reply 19):
Taking accurate fire in a CG C-130 or Dassault is, ah, unlikely.

I agree, but you don't chase down "cigarette boats" making a run from the Dominican Republic to Puerto Rico with a Herky Pig do you? The CG units doing the intercepts are not always special units, but are obviously in receipt of special training . . . more and more of that training since 9/11 increased their roll.

Quoting SATL382G (Reply 18):
nobody wants to have anything to do with a spoiled brat "I just wanna fly" pilot in a job like that.

"Brown Leather Jacket Club" . . . my former spouse being a member thereof.


User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1045 times:

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 21):
Damn you sound like Superfly, or PacificJourney! Did you dip into the wrong Koolaid Jug this morning?

Why don't you take a poll (silly) and ask them why they're in uniform.

Did I say all of them, ANCFlyer? I don't think I did. I said many do it for ot her reasons than patriotism. I think that's a very fair statement.


User currently offlineSATL382G From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1044 times:

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 20):
And it's amazing you can tell that ANYONE who does this will spit on people. I find that remarkable.

It comes from having dealt with such people for many years. Something it seems you have no experience with whatsoever yet have no problem commenting on. Of course this is Non-av so I guess I should expect that.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 21):
The CG units doing the intercepts are not always special units

The ones expecting to receive and return fire are......


User currently offlineDLKAPA From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 24, posted (9 years 2 months 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 1045 times:

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 12):

No it's not all bullshit. For the record I visted 67 foreign countries in my 24 years. . . . and most of them were during my off duty time. Easier to get to some place like say, Poland because you're living in Germany. Easier to get to some place like say, Hong Kong because you're living in South Korea.

Easier to get to hell when you're already in Purgatory I guess.


25 Post contains images ANCFlyer : Actually, spent the last 12 years of my time - immediately after Desert Storm - running around the Caribbean, South America and a few other interesti
26 11Bravo : If he wants to fly jets in the USN of USAF, he better consider one of the service academies or an engineering degree from a very good school in combi
27 DLKAPA : This is what I hate about military recuiters. They only advertise the good parts of being in the military, the travel "perks" if you will. Sure, you
28 ANCFlyer : No agrument, mostly. I took issue with your commentary that places we could go were all bullshit. That's simply not true. You are the anti-thesis of
29 DLKAPA : I believe we're talking around each other here, I was calling bullshit on the tactics the recruiters use in that they use the travel benefits line to
30 Post contains images ANCFlyer : More or less . . . Every sales person uses BS . . . but I did get to travel to some pretty cool places . . . and usually at a discount . . . and I di
31 United737522 : Hey all, Thanks for your replies. I talked with the recruiter today. Army is not the way to go. I will look into CG and also Air National Guard. It ha
32 AGM114L : To be truthful I don't think I would have joined the Army if I couldn't fly. And I believe this to be the norm among military aviators. However I don
33 ANCFlyer : They've got plenty of training area and ranges up here. But it's light grunt and now Stryker Bridge units . . . How does an Apache do at -40F? Not an
34 DL021 : Yes, he can join for any reason he wants, but he was asking for advice and I offered my opinion and advice based on experience and judgement built on
35 Post contains images DLKAPA : You should see some of the people that ran through my high school. A kid told a security guard he was gonna kill her (After she broke up a fight in w
36 Mir : As has been said before, if you want to fly for the airlines someday, the Army is not the way for you to go. From what I've heard, the airlines are be
37 AGM114L : There's a rumor about adding 64's to a Stryker Brigade's MTOW but again who knows with Stryker guys. Can't say from expierence, but quite well. After
38 DL021 : Dude, it was designed to bust tanks in Europe. They're moving toward having independent units that can be attached to the deployed brigades. It's sti
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