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Bush Teleconference With Soldiers Staged  
User currently offlineRsmith6621a From United States of America, joined Aug 2005, 194 posts, RR: 2
Posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 1970 times:

WASHINGTON - It was billed as a conversation with U.S. troops, but the questionsPresident Bush asked on a teleconference call Thursday were choreographed to match his goals for the war inIraq and Saturday's vote on a new Iraqi constitution.
"This is an important time," Allison Barber, deputy assistant defense secretary, said, coaching the soldiers before Bush arrived. "The president is looking forward to having just a conversation with you."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051014/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush_iraq



Could it be that the pressure that Karl Rove is under with the impending multi indictment that are coming down that he has lost his touch in regards to setting up the perfect camera photo-op for bush.

This is a sad day for america when the president will use our soldiers as political pawns. This is the most disguting event that this president and his administrators have setup in both of his terms. I would hope that the familys of thoses soldeirs will be seeing them home(alive) soon it is the least that can be done.

America is in its saddest days.


Did You Ever Think Freedom Could Be this Bad
69 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineTheCoz From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 1957 times:



User currently offlineDfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 977 posts, RR: 51
Reply 2, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 1951 times:

Quoting Rsmith6621a (Thread starter):
the questionsPresident Bush asked on a teleconference call Thursday were choreographed to match his goals for the war inIraq and Saturday's vote on a new Iraqi constitution.

Ooohh, scandalous  eyebrow 

Quoting Rsmith6621a (Thread starter):
This is a sad day for america when the president will use our soldiers as political pawns

It's a sad day when a President can't come up with something original. When have you not seen the President "meet the troops," especially in a time of war:







Quoting Rsmith6621a (Thread starter):
This is the most disguting event that this president and his administrators have setup in both of his terms.

Oh please, and the fraud, deception, and thievery on their watches all take a back seat to a staged press conference? Give me a break.

Move over Watergate and Iran Contra, answers were fed to the troops in a press confrence  Yeah sure

Quoting Rsmith6621a (Thread starter):
America is in its saddest days.

Whatever... your priorities are so out of whack if this pisses you off.

We invaded a country on the pretense of WMDs, which turned out to be completely false, failed to build international support against terrorism, and have failed to suppress a continued insurgency. But oh, a press conference, what has the world come to these days?  Yeah sure

Disgruntled in Dallas,
Ryan


User currently offlineNavymidn From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 188 posts, RR: 1
Reply 3, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 1934 times:

Guys, answers were not fed to the soldiers. It was just prearranged what questions President Bush would ask, and who and in what order they would be answered. I see no problem with this, as you would want the expert on a certain situation to answer that question.


Law is a major base of civilized society
User currently offlineJetjack74 From United States of America, joined Jul 2003, 7410 posts, RR: 50
Reply 4, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 18 hours ago) and read 1916 times:
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Quoting Rsmith6621a (Thread starter):
It was billed as a conversation with U.S. troops, but the questionsPresident Bush asked on a teleconference call Thursday were choreographed to match his goals for the war inIraq and Saturday's vote on a new Iraqi constitution.
"This is an important time," Allison Barber, deputy assistant defense secretary, said, coaching the soldiers before Bush arrived. "The president is looking forward to having just a conversation with you."

So this is the best you can come up with?



Made from jets!
User currently offlineCaptOveur From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 1907 times:

I am still waiting on Rsmith to start a thread saying Bush is awful because of what he ate for breakfast that morning.. Give it time, we will see it.



Unless Ted beats him to it.


User currently offlineB744F From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 1854 times:

least amount of press conferences in history. All staged in one way or the other. Be proud, your President is pure genius

User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29799 posts, RR: 58
Reply 7, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 1853 times:

Question:

If (Blank) is standing out in the middle of the woods and says something bad about G.W.....Does anybody care any more?

Insert who you want for blank.
Streisand
Carvell
Radcliff
Clinton
Rsmith6621a



OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
User currently offlineOldeuropean From Germany, joined May 2005, 2091 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 1842 times:

It reminds me on the propaganda in the USSR, China or North Korea.

"Mr. President (or they used perhaps "Great Leader"), everything is ok! Everythink works as expected!"

Do you really believe these faked statements?

Axel

[Edited 2005-10-14 09:26:24]


Wer nichts weiss muss alles glauben
User currently offlineANCFlyer From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 9, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 10 hours ago) and read 1809 times:

Well, Smitty, of course it was staged . . . . the President doesn't take a shit without a meeting of the White House Inner Circle . . . .

What's your point?

Or more to the point . . . so frickin' what?


User currently offlineOly720man From United Kingdom, joined May 2004, 6737 posts, RR: 11
Reply 10, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 1795 times:

Quoting Rsmith6621a (Thread starter):
This is a sad day for america when the president will use our soldiers as political pawns.

That's what they're there for. To carry out whatever duty is asked of them.

http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Henry_Kissinger

Quote #2

"Military men are dumb, stupid animals to be used as pawns for foreign policy."



wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
User currently offlineTedTAce From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 9 hours ago) and read 1788 times:

Quoting CaptOveur (Reply 5):
Ted beats him to it.

See this once again makes my point I'm NOT Rsmith... Randy goes from the obviously staged media event(who cares?), to Karl Rove?!?!?! At least I complain about the stories I post and stick to the subject at hand.. If I post a Bush story I flame Bush, If I post a Clinton story I flame Sandy Berger....ooooppss.. that didn't seem right..


User currently offlineJaysit From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 12, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 8 hours ago) and read 1776 times:

Quoting L-188 (Reply 7):
If (Blank) is standing out in the middle of the woods and says something bad about G.W.....Does anybody care any more?

Actually, luv, if GWB is standing out in the middle of the woods and says ... uhhh... anything.....Does anybody care any more?


User currently offlineTbar220 From United States of America, joined Feb 2000, 7013 posts, RR: 25
Reply 13, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 1755 times:

I'd like to see an honest interview with soldiers by the president. No coreography, no briefing. Just let the soldiers speak their mind to the president. I wonder what we would really hear...

Probably not what we heard in this "teleconference".



NO URLS in signature
User currently offlinePope From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 14, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 1751 times:

This is really getting scary. I can accept an occassional press mistake or a subordinate screwing up. But it seems that on a fairly regular basis, this administration is being caught manufacturing the news.

Bush is definitely on the ropes.


User currently offlineUsnseallt82 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 4891 posts, RR: 52
Reply 15, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 1743 times:

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 2):
Whatever... your priorities are so out of whack if this pisses you off.

 checkmark   checkmark   checkmark 

Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 13):
I'd like to see an honest interview with soldiers by the president. No coreography, no briefing. Just let the soldiers speak their mind to the president. I wonder what we would really hear...

Guess what? He has had several honest, private interviews with soldiers, both on the battlefield and off. And guess what? They weren't publicized because they were exactly what you want them to be.....private. You know what he heard? An occasional 'why the hell are we here?' but a strong majority voice of 'we support you, sir, wherever you lead us.' I wish that people could see inside much of what isn't publicized. I strongly believe that most of the hatred of Bush comes from media outlets not putting forth the full truth and only worrying about ratings.



Crye me a river
User currently offlineDaddiesSecret From Niue, joined Sep 2005, 270 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 7 hours ago) and read 1735 times:

Quoting Usnseallt82 (Reply 15):
strongly believe that most of the hatred of Bush comes from media outlets not putting forth the full truth and only worrying about ratings.

that WON'T be fox then...


User currently offlineSchoenorama From Spain, joined Apr 2001, 2440 posts, RR: 25
Reply 17, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 1732 times:

To those of us who have been critical of the whole Iraqi adventure, this really is nothing new. It is clearly part of a pattern of propaganda, something the neo-cons on this board just can't imagine their Government would use.

Two years ago, retired Air Force Col Sam Gardiner (who once taught at the National War College) and who is an expert on military strategy and strategic games, published a study titled "Truth from These Podia. Summary of a Study of Strategic Influence, Perception Management, Strategic Information Warfare and Strategic Psychological Operations in Gulf II". In this study, he described 50 news-stories which were in the media and which were deliberately either incomplete or completely false. For some of these stories the original sources were unknown, for others unanimous "government officials" were quoted.

On many occassions senior Administration Officials and high-ranking officers deliberately allowed imcomplete or false information "to linger" in the media and thereby reaching their primary objective. Such was the case, for instance, with the Jessica Lynch story which was allowed "to develop" in the media (with or without active interference) and absolutely the same can be said about the misunderstanding the US General Public had about Saddam being behind 9/11.

Mr Gardiner describes how a joint US/Uk misinformation campaign was carefully conducted long before the actual invasion and beyond. The objectives of this campaign were various: to gain public support at home, to weaken adversaries abroad (UN, Hans Blix, ElBaradei, France, Germany, Russia) and to weaken the moral of the enemy. The latter of these three is the less worrisome, in my opinion. But the other two can only be categorised as pure and simple propaganda.


"propaganda Show phonetics
noun [U] MAINLY DISAPPROVING
information, ideas, opinions or images, often only giving one part of an argument, which are broadcast, published or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions:" (http://dictionary.cambridge.org)


A perfect example described by Gardiner in his study is the story about Iraq executing prisoners during the first days/weeks of the invasion. The truth is that at that time, it was completely unknown whether two POW's were executed or just died because of their battle-inflicted wounds. But this didn't stop the US/UK propaganda machine to use the story. High-ranking officers, Blair, Bush and Rumsfeld, they all used the story as if the execution were a fact. In the UK, the story disappeared soon after one of the soldier's sister reported that his colonel had said he was not executed. Despite this, on April 3, 5 and 7 Bush, Blair and Rumsfeld repeated the story as a fact in numerous appearances before the national and international media.

Another example is the story on the Iraqis allegedly using US military uniforms. It first surfaced on March 7, 2003: "Iraq is acquiring military uniforms "identical down to the last detail" to those worn by American and British forces and plans to use them to shift blame for atrocities, a senior U.S. official said Thursday. Jim Wilkinson, Tampa Florida."

It re-surfaced a couple of weeks later on March, 26th: Soldiers in the U.S. 3rd Infantry moving north toward Baghdad say they believe they have been attacked by Iraqis wearing American uniforms. And they say they’re worried that some of the uniforms were stolen several weeks ago while the U.S. troops were in Kuwait. David Bloom, NBC."

On that same day, the Pentagon's chief spokeswoman Victoria Clarke also picked up the story in her daily briefing and mentioned, when asked, she had in fact seen one report which suggested the story. Two days later, on March 28th, Rumsfeld used it as if it already were a proven fact: "They put on American and British uniforms to try to fool regular Iraqi soldiers into surrendering to them, and then execute them as an example for others who might contemplate defection or capitulation."

Another very effective tactic was to put out a story and simply "let it linger" without getting too much into detail. Such a story is the one about the French Roland Missiles. On April 9th, Brig. Gen. Brooks reported: ""...found an underground storage facility containing an abundance of food and also Roland-type air defense missiles. That’s a specific air defense missile system." When an A-10 was shot down near the Baghdad airport, a “Pentagon spokesman” pointed out they thought it was hit with a Roland missiles, something definately not mentioned in the CENTCOM Briefing. (Emphasis added in quotes)

Lt. Greg Holmes even went a little further in an April 21st Newsweek interview: "U.S. forces discovered 51 Roland-2 missiles, made by a partnership of French and German arms manufacturers…one of the missiles he examined was labeled 05-11 KND 2002 which he took to mean the missile was manufactured last year."

All these stories were part of the "Punish the French (and German)" Campaign to undermine both countries credibility regarding their posittion on Iraq. The Roland-2 production line was shut down in 1993 while the export of these missiles had already been stopped in 1990, something the US military certainly must have known.

The case of Joseph Wilson/Valerie Plame, although not mentioned in Gardiner's study, fits perfectly into the punishing-strategy as it was clearly aimed at undermining former Ambassador Wilson's credibility. And the celebration of pre-scripted & pre-screened Live Interviews also fits perfectly within this US Administration's policy of misinformation and deception.

As Gardiner points out, the name of Jim Wilkinson appears along with many of the stories he has investigated. In March 2003, Wilkinson was General Tommy Frank's Director of Strategic Communications, a euphemism for the Head of the Propaganda Apparatus. Since the end of 2003, Wilkinson is Deputy Assistant to the President and Deputy National Security Advisor for Communications and reports directly to Condoleezza Rica and White House Communications Director Dan Bartlett. In other words, the man who appears the be the prime source of so many false and/or incomplete stories, some of which even made it to Breaking News events prior, during and long after the invasion, now decides what news is important for the American General Public to be told about and what is not, when they hear about it and, above all, how they are informed about it.



___________
Sources: http://www.veteransforpeace.org/truth_from_these_podia.pdf, http://www.sourcewatch.org



Utinam logica falsa tuam philosophiam totam suffodiant!
User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 18, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 1721 times:

That's Bush, so why is it newsworthy? He never goes before anything but a scripted crowed, as he demonstrated during the election last year. It is kinda sad, but President's have been stage-managed from the dawn of mass-media. It's certainly not worthy of such comment.

Quoting Pope (Reply 14):
But it seems that on a fairly regular basis, this administration is being caught manufacturing the news.

The Pentagon and the WH are the best news managers in the world, Pope. It isn't a surprise, and goes all the way back to athe days of FDR. It's really no big deal.

Oh, I forgot, as a loathsome traitor, I'm suppoed to spew forth venom and "vitrol" towards this President towards everything he does!

My bad...


User currently offlineUsnseallt82 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 4891 posts, RR: 52
Reply 19, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 1708 times:

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 18):
Oh, I forgot, as a loathsome traitor, I'm suppoed to spew forth venom and "vitrol" towards this President towards everything he does!

That's right, you worthless piece of shit.  bigthumbsup 

What a horrible traitor you are!  Big grin



Crye me a river
User currently offlineUsnseallt82 From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 4891 posts, RR: 52
Reply 20, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 6 hours ago) and read 1706 times:

Quoting Usnseallt82 (Reply 19):
That's right, you worthless piece of shit.

By the way........how's it going?  Big grin



Crye me a river
User currently offlineFalcon84 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 21, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 1701 times:

Quoting Usnseallt82 (Reply 19):
That's right, you worthless piece of shit.

What a horrible traitor you are!



Quoting Usnseallt82 (Reply 20):
By the way........how's it going?

ROTFL. I sent a PM to ANCFlyer and told him that exact same thing about me.

Sorry, but I missed the last class of Traitors Against Bush, and must have missed the indoctrination on that one.  Silly

TGIF,man, TGIF. Been a busy week. Thanks for asking.


User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13115 posts, RR: 12
Reply 22, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 1679 times:

It is well documented that many Presidents have manulipated the media for both sound reasons of national interest and for strictly political reasons. With Bush, the 'political reasons' use has reached new heights and worse it that too many in the media have bought his bullstuff so they don't get excluded from access to him. While many soldiers do accept their responsibility, 'follow orders', and feel they are accomplishing something in Iraq, many do question our reason, policy and justification for being there. Some Reserverist and National Guard members have had their family finances ruined, lost marriages, lost jobs, as well as their lives, limbs and health. So what else can you expect except for a somewhat scripted and pre-ordaned teleconference with GWB. At least some in the press is telling the public the truth of GWB and his merry neo-cons.

User currently offlineLuv2fly From United States of America, joined May 2003, 12110 posts, RR: 48
Reply 23, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 1666 times:
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Quoting Jaysit (Reply 12):
Actually, luv, if GWB is standing out in the middle of the woods and says ... uhhh... anything.....Does anybody care any more?



Quoting Pope (Reply 14):
This is really getting scary. I can accept an occassional press mistake or a subordinate screwing up. But it seems that on a fairly regular basis, this administration is being caught manufacturing the news.

Bush is definitely on the ropes.

The only good thing to come out of GWB presidency is the fact that he showed us what Republican really are! And his 2 terms most likely have effectively killed Jeb's chance to run the Country.



You can cut the irony with a knife
User currently offlineDvk From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1058 posts, RR: 1
Reply 24, posted (8 years 11 months 1 week 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 1650 times:

W should have combined the teleconference with his hard hat and tool belt performance from earlier this week. That was another unnecessary and utterly transparent attempt on his part to pretend he has a clue. He could have saved everyone time by having a single multi-purpose performance. Better yet, he could have skipped both. It's interesting that even George Will, who tends to be anti-everything but in a very conservative manner, has now referred to the Bush administration as "insular","arrogant", and out of touch with the common people.


I'm not dumb. I just have a command of thoroughly useless information.
25 Jetjack74 : Staged and phoney. So it's a shock to you that a press conference is planned? Well how does FORGED DOCUMENTS sound to you about fake and staged? 1. H
26 Tbar220 : I really wish it were so. We will never hear private conversations from soldiers who don't want to be in Iraq, or *gasp* even have criticism of the p
27 SlamClick : Senator Lyndon Johnson flew to the South Pacific, elbowed his way aboard a bomber going out on a low-level mission against the Japanese. He served no
28 Jaysit : Drop the slamming of a man who served his country well. The shameful election is over, and the disgrace you call President won. There is no need for
29 Rsmith6621a : Back On topic This isnt about Clinton,Johnson,Regan,or Carter. This is a president who refuses to take questions from his oppisition. All of his campa
30 Post contains images NWA742 : -NWA742
31 Jetjack74 : You give it up. Thanks to Clintons marvelous foreign policy, North Korea was free and clear to pursue the nuclear weapons programme. and photo-ops to
32 SlamClick : I have seen the unedited footage. Yes there are crowds at such events but sometimes they catch him boarding the helicopter or some such thing and I h
33 EA CO AS : While driving in to work today I heard a radio report about this, followed by an interview with one of the soldiers who said (paraphrasing): We weren'
34 B744F : Of course, get the questions first so the President is told what to say
35 Post contains images EA CO AS : So now that the "THE QUESTIONS WERE SCRIPTED!!" allegation has been refuted, you'll now grasp at the "HE KNEW HOW TO ANSWER!!" straws? Why do you so
36 DfwRevolution : What are you talking about, he does so on a daily basis. What planet are you on ? Hello, it's called security. You have to disclose your SS# if you w
37 B744F : I never claimed the questions were scripted in the first place, but that is the next worst thing. Why? Because he is bankrupting our country to level
38 Jaysit : Great. You can take that vitriolic BS to your grave with you. We all know that BS brings the daisies up faster. For crying out loud. They told the Pr
39 EA CO AS : What's more insidious is when supposedly impartial journalists ask slanted questions - or worse, when these same journalists coerce OTHERS to ask the
40 Jaysit : You're saying that coercion from a random reporter is worse than coercion from the government? The latter has exponentially more power to affect your
41 AeroWesty : There's the money quote. It's perfectly acceptable to have someone warm up an audience, have those unfamiliar with the technology, or being on camera
42 Gilligan : You think this is the first President or Presidential candidate to do this? How long were you in a coma and welcome back. If he hates freedom of expr
43 Post contains images Dan-Air : But...but...but....Bill Clinton...did....something....fake..I'm not sure what but I'm sure it was fake. Ha-ha! I'm watching the clip now, I think my
44 SATL382G : Folks -- I worked the AF1 detail at Andrews for a number of years. It was not unusual for the President (regardless of party affiliation) to wave to
45 Post contains images Searpqx : I'm still trying to figure out why this is news. As mentioned, politicians have been staging events since day one, and since the invention of photogra
46 Post contains images Boeing7E7 : Bill Clinton's dick is stuck in a hooker... News at 11:00!!! Man, you really have to get over yourself. We really don't need a daily story on everythi
47 SATL382G : Actually I don't recall Clinton ever sleeping on the jet prior to a departure, though Bush Sr did. Ixnay on the imagay. If the press wasn't around to
48 Searpqx : What, you mean the folks that served as PotUS are human? What, no, couldn't be - I read on A.net that they were (insert one) evil incarnate, the the
49 SATL382G : More than you know..... Your comparison to Radar was, ah, fairly astute BTW I need to shut my pie hole now.....
50 Rsmith6621a : You call it security......I call it giving up your privacy...this is what happens in a Police State. Working at school as a volunteer is a different
51 B744F : Umm no, what's sad is the people who will go to great lengths to excuse the actions of corrupt politicians who push their crony capitalism on the mas
52 Gilligan : Thanks B744F for proving my point. At this point I won't try and defend either Bush or Clinton, both most certainly have their faults. But I will sta
53 Post contains images Mr Spaceman : Hi guys. >> Rsmith6621a, here's a photo of President Bush arranging for relief help for New Orleans. Look at how hard he's working! Chris
54 Post contains images Dan-Air : Do you remember what that question was? Let me remind you: "Why do we soldiers have to dig through local landfills for pieces of scrap metal and comp
55 Ctbarnes : Considering Dubya's handlers have strict orders to keep the President away from Koppel, Donaldson and any moderately taxing live interviews this comes
56 B744F : I didn't prove your point. I do not see any logic in any right wingers sad excuse for an opinion, especially on something like this. I am not a fan o
57 Post contains links and images Jetjack74 : You want to talk about staged? NBC reporter Michelle Kosinski was rowing around in water. She appears to be rowing around in a canoe, and makes you th
58 Post contains images ANCFlyer : Ha - Jaysit. No proof of that . . . if you're talking about Sen John F. kerry- the numbnut that refusesto release his entire military record. Why do
59 Post contains images Clipperhawaii : Still smarting huh? LOL You earned it.
60 Post contains images Dan-Air : Shorter ANC - Kerry: no proof of valor that meets my standard (although his commanders that awarded the medals may disagree) makes Kerry the coward.
61 ANCFlyer : Interesting how quickly you twisted words . . . and how ignorant you are of my position. I never claimed Kerry was a coward, and in fact have given k
62 Post contains images Usnseallt82 : I'm waiting for the Texas game today. What are you doing? (hint, I've had an epiphany over responding to asinine members)
63 ANCFlyer : NASCAR at Charlotte . . . Lowe's Motor Speedway.
64 Dan-Air : If I read you "out of context" then I apologize. I do my very best to collate and digest every post in every thread that everyone makes, before I das
65 Post contains images SlamClick : Also known as "The Charlotte Center for the Performing Arts."
66 Gilligan : Considering both those reporters/commentators are retired I don't see the revelance.
67 L-188 : Ah true progress of a civilization, seeing how efficently it can turn a precious non-renewable resource into recreational noise. Gotta love this coun
68 Post contains links AeroWesty : This Koppel? http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/News/story?id=128629
69 Gilligan : Yep, he is essentially retired. When he left the Nightline desk he became a sort of a reporter emmeritius which is what happens to virtually all of t
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