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Super Tug  
User currently offlineFutureUApilot From United States of America, joined May 2004, 1365 posts, RR: 4
Posted (9 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 14253 times:

Hey everyone, just a quick question, what is the advantage to using a Super Tug as opposed to a regular tug. The only thing i could think of is to releave stress on the aircraft's front landing gear, but it's only a guess. I got to see one of these at IAH and was facinated by them! Thanks for the replys!
-Sam

 Big grin


The Pilot is the highest form of life on Earth!
54 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlineAir2gxs From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (9 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 14126 times:

Much more control over the whole towing operation.

Try searching the database.


User currently offlineDalMd88 From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 2542 posts, RR: 14
Reply 2, posted (9 years 9 months 3 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 14092 times:

SuperTug can tow faster than a towbar. Makes it better for long tows, like gate to hangar.

User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 17019 posts, RR: 67
Reply 3, posted (9 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 14042 times:

SuperTugs (which don't use a bar) also have better traction in slippery conditions, which explains why they are so prevalent in Scandinavia.


"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlineCancidas From Poland, joined Jul 2003, 4112 posts, RR: 11
Reply 4, posted (9 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 13915 times:

the supertugs are also faster, as mentioned before. that makes them better for use on longer distance tows. they are also of european manufacture, meaning that they are expensive here in the states. there are certain smalled one made here in the states, but not of the size needed for a full 747.


"...cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home."
User currently offlineHawk21m From India, joined Jan 2001, 31679 posts, RR: 56
Reply 5, posted (9 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 13910 times:

Wouldn't Pushback be more easier controlled with Towbarless Tugs rather than a tug with a towbar.Whereas Towing would be similiar apart from speed.
regds
HAWK



Think of the brighter side!
User currently offlineCancidas From Poland, joined Jul 2003, 4112 posts, RR: 11
Reply 6, posted (9 years 9 months 3 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 13909 times:

pushbacks are basically the same, with or without a towbar. it boils down to the comfort of the tug driver. those that use bars more often will be more comfortable with them. those who don't wont.


"...cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home."
User currently offlineSupraZachAir From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Feb 2004, 634 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (9 years 9 months 3 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 13800 times:

pushbacks are basically the same, with or without a towbar. it boils down to the comfort of the tug driver. those that use bars more often will be more comfortable with them. those who don't wont.

Well, not to nit pick they're actually the opposite of one another as far as steering, and tow bar setups needing a little more finesse. I will agree that someone who uses a tow bar more often will be more comfortable than someone like me who is used to a TBL pushback. I do think that TBL setups are easier to master though, they're pretty straight foreward (no pun intended).


User currently offlineEZYAirbus From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 2460 posts, RR: 52
Reply 8, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 13632 times:

These tugs are basically the nose wheel of the aircraft and can tug a 747 at speeds upto 20mph


MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © Glenn Eldridge



Here is a TBL400 taken at Heathrow about to be serviced, so much better to work on that the usual towbar tugs!

Glenn



http://www.glenneldridgeaviation.com
User currently offlineTiger119 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1919 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 13516 times:

"Here is a TBL400 taken at Heathrow about......."

- Are there "Super Tugs" that are smaller than this one? I seem to remember seeing one at MDW a week ago or so that was a smaller than this one?



Flying is the second greatest thrill known to mankind, landing is the first!
User currently offlineEZYAirbus From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2003, 2460 posts, RR: 52
Reply 10, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 13470 times:

Yeah there are smaller ones called TBL280s they usually only take aircraft no bigger than the 767.

Glenn



http://www.glenneldridgeaviation.com
User currently offlineSATL382G From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 13437 times:

Here's a sales video for one of these tugs. Found it while looking for something else...

Good video!

http://www.tld-gse.com/videos/


User currently offlineTiger119 From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1919 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 13357 times:

"Yeah there are smaller ones called TBL280s they usually only take aircraft no bigger than the 767."

- I may be off base here but the one I saw at MDW was pushing a S340B back (and pretty quickly as well) a distance farther than a normal push back would be. It was a pretty small tug.



Flying is the second greatest thrill known to mankind, landing is the first!
User currently offlineSrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 13290 times:

Super Tugs, and their smaller cousins only have one pivot point, and that's the nose gear itself; tow bars have two pivot points, the nose gear and where the towbar hooks up to the pushbag unit (be it a tug or a tractor). You end up having to do a lot more corrections using a towbar, and if you're not careful, you've got an accident.

User currently offlineSDFOH From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 74 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (9 years 9 months 2 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 13259 times:

Do they come smaller? Why yes they do, as seen here in SEA


View Large View Medium
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Photo © Chris Coduto
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Photo © Ben Wang




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Photo © Joe Corrigan



Just kidding. Same principle just alot smaller


User currently offlineSupraZachAir From Northern Mariana Islands, joined Feb 2004, 634 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (9 years 9 months 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 12993 times:

They come even smaller than that. In PDX they also use the stand up ones which are considerably smaller. We only use the larger ones in SEA. You can do killer doughnuts in them though.

User currently offlineTg 747-300 From Norway, joined Nov 1999, 1318 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (9 years 8 months 4 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 12821 times:

Another advantage with the Super Tug is that during daylight operations, there is no need for a "brake operator" in the plane. Therefore, one person is enough for moving a plane from lets say the hangar to the gate.

With a regular Tug and towbar, there is a slight posibility the plane will loosen, so a brake operator is required in the cockpit.

These are the rules at ARN (Stockholm), so i don't know if the Super tug has this advantage at other airports.

Anyway, for how long has the super tug been around?
Here in Norway, i belive it became common 4-5 years ago.

All this said, i personaly dislike the super tug. Maybe becaus its so tiny, and don't bring back the momories of the good old days. (not that i have experienced those days though).

tg 747-300



intentionally left blank
User currently offlineSATL382G From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (9 years 8 months 4 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 12804 times:

Tg 747-300,

How do you handle parking brake release in the aircraft with only one person?


User currently offlineTg 747-300 From Norway, joined Nov 1999, 1318 posts, RR: 0
Reply 18, posted (9 years 8 months 4 weeks 20 hours ago) and read 12790 times:

SATL328G: probably a good question, and honestly I don't know. I just read an interview with a towing guy from ARN who said that when using super tugs, there was no need for people in the cockpit.

Maybe because many planes just are resting on their chocks, and not using the p-brake. Just read something about that in another thread.

tg 747-300



intentionally left blank
User currently offlineKlaus From Germany, joined Jul 2001, 21442 posts, RR: 54
Reply 19, posted (9 years 8 months 4 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 12749 times:

SATL382G: How do you handle parking brake release in the aircraft with only one person?

Would it really be a problem?

- Pick up the nose wheel with the tug.
- Set the stopping brakes of the tug.
- Release the parking brakes of the aircraft.
- Remove chocks.
- Get into the tug and get moving.
- At your destination, reverse the sequence.

Looks like a little work, but probably not really difficult even for a single person.


User currently offlineAirbusA346 From United Kingdom, joined Dec 2004, 7437 posts, RR: 2
Reply 20, posted (9 years 8 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 12507 times:

For pictures of Towbarless Tugs go to:

http://www.airliners.net/discussions/tech_ops/read.main/104451/

airbusA346  Smile  Big thumbs up



Tom Walker '086' First Officer of a A318/A319 for Air Lambert - Hours Flown: 17 hour 05 minutes (last updated 24/12/05).
User currently offlineHAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31679 posts, RR: 56
Reply 21, posted (9 years 8 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 12419 times:

Another advantage with the Super Tug is that during daylight operations, there is no need for a "brake operator" in the plane. Therefore, one person is enough for moving a plane from lets say the hangar to the gate.

Woudn't it be mandatory to have someone in the Cockpt during a Towing/Pushback operation.It is out here.

regds
MEL



Think of the brighter side!
User currently offlineTg 747-300 From Norway, joined Nov 1999, 1318 posts, RR: 0
Reply 22, posted (9 years 8 months 2 weeks 1 day ago) and read 12321 times:

Nobody who knows when the first supe tug was deliverd?

tg 747-300



intentionally left blank
User currently offlineWbmech From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 23, posted (9 years 8 months 2 weeks 18 hours ago) and read 12286 times:

With the super-tug no brake rider is required. In fact, at CO they have an aircraft move team that performs all of the super tug moves independent of maintenance.

User currently offlineVenus6971 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 1442 posts, RR: 0
Reply 24, posted (9 years 8 months 2 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 12236 times:

Used one of these tugs for trial period on E-3's, we found it much easier to put the acft in a tighter space especially for rookie drivers who had a hard time parallel parking their own car. The only draw back was a low draw bar strength of the model we were using and it was worthless on snow and ice


I would help you but it is not in the contract
25 HAWK21M : at CO they have an aircraft move team that performs all of the super tug moves independent of maintenance. How many team members are required to move
26 ATLAMT : Hi Mel, Here in ATL Delta has several supertug crews. Each is a two man crew. One brake rider and one to operate the tug. At night after the ramp agen
27 Matt72033 : i find this very hard to believe!! so what happens when you get an APU fire?
28 A342 : Super tugs are also more economical as there´s no need to put weights on it, the nosewheel is enough. It saves you fuel.
29 HAWK21M : Currently out here Theres not a single SuperTug in the Entire country.Which I find Surprising. regds MEL
30 Charliecossie : How could the APU catch fire if it isn't running? Why can't a "towing crew" member be trained in APU operation? Why is it mandatory out there? Jobs f
31 Matt72033 : The APU does need to run though.....well i'm considering for the 747 here. you need hydraulic pressure to tow! therefore, you either need electrical
32 DC8FriendShip : They can still stop the plane-provided the brake pressure has not been exhausted.
33 Charliecossie : No you don't. Why would that person need to apply the brakes? You're still thinking "tow bar". The towbar-less tugs don't have that problem.
34 Matt72033 : yes you do! ever heard of body gear steering?
35 Charliecossie : More than you can imagine! Body gear steering not required for towing. Hydraulic pressure not required for towing. Don't argue when you don't know th
36 Airfoilsguy : How often do APUs catch fire when towing? I would hope it is a rare event.
37 Charliecossie : I've seen two APUs go "pop" in 21 years in the civil business. One was a 737 sitting at the gate with drivers in the cockpit and the other was a DC10,
38 HAWK21M : Agreed.If theres no power its a different thing.But Regulations out here insist that a person is in the cockpit during towing ops for Radio communica
39 Post contains links ReidYYZ : There a severe short term memory problem here, but what the hell, I'll play along. Yes, but more specifically: Tow Barless Attachment (by HAWK21M Oct
40 HAWK21M : Its def surprising.If there are so many benifits by using a Supertug then why wasn't it ever considered out here.Many AI could have. regds MEL
41 Matt72033 : ah ok, didnt realise this, our AMM states that hyd sys 1+4 need to be pressuriesed for brakes and body gear steering!
42 HAWK21M : Which Aircraft Type are you referring to. regds MEL
43 ReidYYZ : I remember the '47 has the Air Driven Pumps but does it have electric pumps/ptu that power 1 +4? A313 originally from LH, but not all A313 have it, i
44 Matt72033 : most only have an aux pump on system 4....but ours have it on 1 aswell....customer option
45 Post contains images LongbowPilot : I remember working with the wing walkers at night after work to get that little bit of over time. I put in a transfer request to the "Supertug" team
46 Matt72033 : but on the 747 that pressure would be used by the body gear steering, wouldnt it?
47 FutureUApilot : Ah, I when I saw my first Super Tug was in Houston about a year ago at Holloween time. Sense then I have been hired at MaxAir where we get to see tha
48 LongbowPilot : dunno know if the body steering is used in a towing situation. I worked with a lot of aircrat, but never the 47. Another perk i forgot to mention is
49 Matt72033 : The body gear steering arming circuit is deactivated whenever the gear is in tilted position, or when wheel speed is greater than 20 knots. but i gues
50 LongbowPilot : you can tow with out a break rider, but think about it.. Multi-Million dollar airliner that makes 100's of thousands a day in revenue is damaged becau
51 Matt72033 : depends how long the tow is, lights will run off the battery wont they?
52 Fr8mech : The B747 body gear steering system is powered by the #1 system. The brake accumulator is in the #4 system. The barke accumulator is also isolated fro
53 Matt72033 : fair enough! that surprises me a bit!
54 HAWK21M : They sure are a few. regds MEL
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