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CO`s Winglet 757s. Problems With Autoland  
User currently offlineJuventus From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 2835 posts, RR: 2
Posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3275 times:

My friend is a CO mechanic, based in IAH. I asked about the 757-winglet project that CO has undertaken. He said they are having problems, ``the winglets and autoland are not getting alone``. Is this true? Is it a speed, or a flare problem? anybody...

13 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineBapilot2b From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2001, 927 posts, RR: 21
Reply 1, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3229 times:

Is there even a CO 757 with the winglets attached yet?? Suprised nobody has not shot it yet if there is one!


Jason Nicholls - v1images
User currently offlineCPH-R From Denmark, joined May 2001, 6055 posts, RR: 3
Reply 2, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 3161 times:

Perhaps they're still in the test phase? IIRC, the 757 winglet programme is only just gearing up.

User currently offlineSolnabo From Sweden, joined Jan 2008, 859 posts, RR: 2
Reply 3, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 3101 times:

....and are there to be wing-lets on CO B753 too?

Micke/SE



Airbus SAS - Love them both
User currently offlineDrerx7 From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 5209 posts, RR: 8
Reply 4, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 3044 times:

Not on the 753s--not yet at least. The 753s role at CO is different from the 752s.


Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
User currently offlineGigneil From United States of America, joined Nov 2002, 16347 posts, RR: 85
Reply 5, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 7 hours ago) and read 3008 times:

The test phase just began a few short days ago, so I would imagine some problems are to be expected.

N


User currently offlineSinlock From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 1652 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 2930 times:

I recall reading that in the early in the 737 (BBJ) winglet program that the center of lift on the wing moved forward a small %. Now that caused the Trim characteristics to change, in this case it made the 737 tend to over trim.
If an aircrafts center of lift moved aft then it would tend to under trim.
The 737s was having this issue at cruise and the autopilot was updated with a the changes.

A 757 in a landing configuration is very different from a 737 in cruise, but the principal of center of lift would basically be the same. A trim issue would certainly show up with the autopilot in an autoland mode, as most of the flight down the glideslope is done with trim, with the flare being done with elevator input.





My Country can beat up your Country....
User currently offlineAeroWeanie From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 1610 posts, RR: 52
Reply 7, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 2733 times:
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Only the baseline (winglet off) flight tests have been completed. No flights have been made of any 757 with winglets. Hence, this report is nonsense.

User currently offlineSinlock From United States of America, joined Dec 2000, 1652 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 2652 times:

My post was made with the assumption that information was based results found during simulation.


My Country can beat up your Country....
User currently offlineCalpilot From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 999 posts, RR: 13
Reply 9, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 2585 times:

Well From what I heard from a IOE Captain this is not nonsence Aero.

After the engineering came out, they discovered that the airplane would lose Cat3 because the Auto flight system softwear, did not recognize the changes during the "flare mode". They relized that the increased lift during ground effect, was going to produce a unacceptable over shoot in the touchdown zone.

I suspect the computer experts will solve this soon...?


User currently offlineAeroWeanie From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 1610 posts, RR: 52
Reply 10, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 18 hours ago) and read 2514 times:
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Until the aircraft is flown with winglets, this is all speculation. The flare might change and it might not.

User currently offlineCdfmxtech From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1341 posts, RR: 26
Reply 11, posted (9 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 2357 times:

The aircraft is being flown with the winglets if I am not mistaken.

User currently offlineAeroWeanie From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 1610 posts, RR: 52
Reply 12, posted (9 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 2200 times:
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Just checked - the winglets have not been installed yet, so it hasn't flown with them.

User currently offlineMax Q From United States of America, joined May 2001, 4782 posts, RR: 19
Reply 13, posted (9 years 11 months 2 weeks 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2160 times:

Even if this was true, it's a non event, the NG 737's had the same problem, it will just require some refining and software changes, that's what a flight test program is for.

The bs that float's around airlines is endless but baffling in it's number of believers, before our 764's were delivered such priceless one's as 'there's no tail clearance so you'll have to rotate at 200kts' or 'with the new windows and the weight saved in the structure it bend's too much and will have to be redesigned' or 'it's so underpowered it will barely make NY-LA'

I wouldn't put much stock in ANYONES opinion until the flight test program is complete, as noone would know until then.



The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.
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