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DC-9 Nosegear Question  
User currently offlineMr Spaceman From Canada, joined Mar 2001, 2787 posts, RR: 9
Posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 3393 times:

Hi There. My Question is. Why do some versions of the DC-9 have what appears to be some sort of horizontal apparatus attached to the back of the nosewheels? After decades of watching DC-9's taxi pass me at Toronto's Pearson International, I still have no clue. What is it!? Can you help me? There are some good photo's of this mysterious object in Photo ID#148184, #147736, #147092, #132829 Thank You....Chris


"Just a minute while I re-invent myself"
21 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineIainhol From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 23 hours ago) and read 3268 times:

I am pretty sure it is a gravel kit, however I might be wrong!
Iain


User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 3255 times:

If you go over to the NTSB website (http://www.ntsb.gov) and look for this accident, you can access a .PDF file of the accident report itself:

Title: Ground Spoiler Activation in Flight/Hard Landing, Valujet Airlines Flight 558 Douglas DC-9-32, N922VV Nashville, Tennessee, January 7, 1996 NTSB Report Number: AAR-96-07, adopted on 11/11/1996 [Abstract | PDF document]
NTIS Report Number: PB96-910407

If you scroll down to page 153, they have a diagram of the nose gear, and this is what the manual says about the item you're curious about:

Nose gear spray deflector..

Deflector minimizes water and/or slush ingestion during takeoff and landing. (If installed).

I'm not current on DC-9s or newer MD80/90 variants, and I don't know if these newer ones are so-equipped. Presumably, the longer fuselage length(s) of the newer ones (plus use of chined nosetires) made these spray deflectors obsolete.

AAR90, ya out there to confirm/deny?  Big grin

The appearance of this item on the DC9 is similar to that part of the 737 gravel kit, but the DC9 application appears to be due to its engines so close to the aircraft centerline, and thus the more common threat of water/slush ingestion...


User currently offlineAAR90 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3481 posts, RR: 46
Reply 3, posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 3240 times:

>I'm not current on DC-9s or newer MD80/90 variants,
>and I don't know if these newer ones are so-equipped.
>Presumably, the longer fuselage length(s) of the
>newer ones (plus use of chined nosetires) made these
>spray deflectors obsolete.
>AAR90, ya out there to confirm/deny?

Don't know what regulation or certification requirement(s) exist, but every AA MD80 & MD90 has spray deflectors installed on both main gear and nose gear struts. I'd have to check an MEL to see if operation is permitted without spray deflector(s) installed and if so, with what limitation(s). Spray deflector installation was strongly emphasized during my initial MD80 training in 1988.



*NO CARRIER* -- A Naval Aviator's worst nightmare!
User currently offlineJt8djet From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 214 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 3223 times:

I think the shorter versions of the DC9 have chined tires and the longer versions & 80/90's use the deflector.

AAR90, Can you confirm that your A/C don't have chined tires?

For those that don't know what a chine tire is, it is a rubber edge that sticks out the sidewall of the tire. This would act as a deflector. All 727's have a chined tire on the nose gear.


User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 21 hours ago) and read 3205 times:

Thanks for the info on the newer versions. Wonder why MD had "(if installed)" in the older manuals...

User currently offlineAAR90 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3481 posts, RR: 46
Reply 6, posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 3191 times:

>Can you confirm that your A/C don't have chined tires?

Back when I flew the airplane, all MD80s had chined nose wheel tires. Don't recall if that was mentioned when I took the MD80 course a year ago because I was only in the course so I could get to the MD90 and all instructors knew that and tailored their instruction toward MD90 systems rather than MD80 systems (as much as they could). MD90 nose wheel tires do _not_ have chines.





*NO CARRIER* -- A Naval Aviator's worst nightmare!
User currently offlineMr Spaceman From Canada, joined Mar 2001, 2787 posts, RR: 9
Reply 7, posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 3155 times:

Hi guys. This is Chris. I can't thank you enough for your feedback on my question. I am "Very" impressed by the amount of knowledge that you gave me so fast. I hope it makes you feel good inside to be able to help a fellow aviation nut! Believe me it is really, really appriciated. Once again...Thank You!


"Just a minute while I re-invent myself"
User currently offlineA/c train From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 501 posts, RR: 4
Reply 8, posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 3138 times:

Hydraulic steering cylinders?

User currently offlinePanman From Trinidad and Tobago, joined Aug 1999, 790 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 3142 times:

No A/c train. Steering cylinders are higher up on the oleo and not aft of the nosewheels

User currently offlinePHLyBoy From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 70 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 3136 times:

Delta's MD-88's have the splashguards on the front gear, no "chined tires like our 727's however. They told us in training that the MD's splashguard costs upwards of $10,000, and make sure we don't chock it!!!!!

User currently offlineWilcharl From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1168 posts, RR: 3
Reply 11, posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3142 times:

Another question for yout hat I havent gotten a straight answer for. ON a few -9s (chinned tires of course) i have noticed a 3/4 inch wide rubber staraped that is attached within 3 inches of the top of the tire to the aft of the strut. It has a nut there, and its it is a strip of rubber hanging verticaly down approximently 8-10 inches 3" inch wide. Almost looks like a piece of electrical tape... Pilot had no idea what it was just knew it was suppose to be there on some a/c. Same thing for MX... Im sure its insignifigent since even MX wasnt sure as to why the guys in long beach stuck it there.. Ive seen it only on a few -9s

User currently offlineTomh From United States of America, joined May 1999, 960 posts, RR: 2
Reply 12, posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3126 times:

I always thought the aft-mounted engines FOD suseptability (especially at high angles of attack) was the reason for those kits on the DC-9 series-but I'm probably telling you something you know quite well.

Say, what's a chined tire?
TomH


User currently offlineExcelsior767 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 3106 times:

the DC-9's have chined tires...the MD-80's have splash guards. I work for Midwest Express...that's all we fly and I'm pretty sure it's that way for all -9's and -80's.

User currently offlineMilo From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (13 years 8 months 2 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 3090 times:

Excelsior767
It is not that way for all -9. I work for SAS and all our dc-9, md-80 and md90 have spray deflectors on all 3 gears.


User currently offlineMr Spaceman From Canada, joined Mar 2001, 2787 posts, RR: 9
Reply 15, posted (13 years 8 months 1 week 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 3064 times:

I decided to add these shots for those who might still read this question.

----Now that I know how to do it!

Chris


Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Pierre Lacombe



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Jason Whitebird



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Bruce Highland



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Marlo Plate




"Just a minute while I re-invent myself"
User currently offlineSrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (13 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 3045 times:

The 717 also has the spray deflector. I was working as a ramper at AirTran when they the 717, and remember them in the 717 training class (lasted all of 15 minutes during my shift one day) telling us to be careful when attaching/removing the towbar from the nosegear, so that the deflector would not get damaged. Here are some photos that show the deflector:









User currently offlineSrbmod From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 17, posted (13 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 3043 times:

Sorry about the photos. Here they are:


Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Scott Leazenby



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Rob Simmons



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Stephen Tornblom



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Rob Simmons



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Michael Carter



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Michael Carter



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Michael Carter



User currently offlineL-188 From United States of America, joined Jul 1999, 29813 posts, RR: 58
Reply 18, posted (13 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 3037 times:

Tomh. it isn't the distance aft of the nosegear that gets you it is the angle that the tire throws the spray up at that gets it. I have seen footage of the 727 prototype going through a spray track first without chined tires and then with the chined tires. The chines sent the spray much further outboard.

All of the MD-80's at Alaska when I worked there had the spray guards. It is cheaper to have them then chined tires.

Chined tires from my understanding are much more expensive then standard tires.



OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
User currently offlineExcelsior767 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 19, posted (13 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 6 hours ago) and read 3024 times:

I stand corrected. At Midwest Express anyway, all the -9's have chined tires, the -80's have spray guards.

User currently offlineMr Spaceman From Canada, joined Mar 2001, 2787 posts, RR: 9
Reply 20, posted (13 years 8 months 1 week 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 3007 times:

Hi there. I just wanted to say "Thanks!" for the great photos. That's the closest view I've ever had of these objects that "were" a Mystery to me.

Chris



"Just a minute while I re-invent myself"
User currently offlineSoku39 From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 1797 posts, RR: 9
Reply 21, posted (13 years 8 months 1 week 17 hours ago) and read 3002 times:

anyone have any pics of chinned tires.


The Ohio Player
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