A/c train From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 501 posts, RR: 4 Posted (12 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 1165 times:
Many Teckys I speak to refer to flight engineers as gauge watchers ,but did they ever get there hands dirty ,Im sorry if this has offended any F E's ou there!
Oldman From United States of America, joined Sep 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0 Reply 1, posted (12 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 1106 times:
Yes they did get their hands dirty. Years ago the Engineers were not in the same Union as the other cockpit crew. Most had a Maintenance background in order to have a wrench spinner onboard at outline stations. Later they became "Pilot Qualified" and that is where we are today. I think this will answer your question but there will be another that will expound on more inane facts. Keep the tail behind you.
A/c train From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2001, 501 posts, RR: 4 Reply 2, posted (12 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 1090 times:
Cheers oldman , my Gramps was an FE and we dont often see him but he always comes down and teaches me 'a thing or two' every once in a while, he was at Northwest Flight training division back in the 70's , little chance of you knowing him but his name was Alan Ainsworth or Alfred as he sometimes called himself.
Feret From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 3, posted (12 years 2 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 1076 times:
A/c train,
I was a professional FE for over 32 years. By professional, I mean that I came from the "ground" and have never held a pilot's licence. For the first 15 years I not only had to operate but had to fix the things as well. Many a time the pilot's would be in the bar and I would be otherwise occupied. They soon learned to keep the supplies coming my way! I thought it was heaven when I finally got into a freight airline where I didn't have to get my hands so dirty and could go to the bar with the pilots. Then I went to a major and they gave me white shirts, good pay, there were pretty girls, good food, top hotels, somebody else did all the work so my fingernails grew back and the callouses went. Woohoo! True heaven even if I had become a "clock watcher". Now I miss the old days!
Chdmcmanus From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 374 posts, RR: 2 Reply 4, posted (12 years 2 months 1 week 1 hour ago) and read 1039 times:
Hello, I'm a USAF Flight engineer, I also hold a FAA PFE and A&P. The level of grease worn by FE's basicly depends on the ACFT manufacturer and operator. The varios quals create a great deal of good natured ribbing, ranging from "Gucci Boys", "SMOE Picker" and "Side Sitting Switch B****"; to "Wrench Spinner", "Grease Gunner" and "Tire Kicker". I agree with Oldman, through a twisted history involving technology, money and unions, FE's have had to stick together to survive. As of late with the newer airframes out there we have been relegated to one of two choices; Don't change and and become extict with the aircraft we love, or follow the path of SO, FO, and finally Captain. The days of an all-purpose aviator, mechanic and mathmatician are drawing to a close, but the love of the job is still there!
PS- Did you know the Space Shuttle has a Flight Engineer Position? Talk about the ultimate outline station!
XFSUgimpLB41X From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 3958 posts, RR: 36 Reply 5, posted (12 years 2 months 1 week ago) and read 1033 times:
Hahahha!! ive never heard the Side Sitting Switch B**** name... thats the funniest thing ive heard all day. Ive got a friend that is an engineer in the air force who is looking to get out, but has no clue what to do b/c he isnt pilot certified and wants to keep flying. I hear the airlines will still hire you to be an SO only..but like Chdmcmanus said... the engineers will become extinct with the airplanes. I know the pilots definitely appreciate the engineers getting all the V speeds and fuel flows and the numerous other things calculated... not to mention the extra assistance in checklists.
JETPILOT From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3130 posts, RR: 32 Reply 6, posted (12 years 2 months 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 1040 times:
Most airlines, except the majors, only hire proffesional FE's to fill the seats.
Very rarely will an airline fill a seat with a second officer as Oldman would like you to believe.
A proffesional FE can sign off any work done to the airplane. The work is usually not performed by the FE. It is only overseen by the FE who can then sign off the log book when the work is done.
"Keep the tail behind you" Is that somekind of annecdote were all supposed to chuckle at after reading Oldman?
DE727UPS From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 814 posts, RR: 15 Reply 7, posted (12 years 2 months 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 1027 times:
I was a 727 F/E for three years at UPS. The only times I got my hands dirty was if I touched anything on the walk around....which I tried not to do....since the mechanics like their scope clause. I did have the strange habit of checking the dump nozzles to see if they actually worked....not in the book. I would only do this with the dump valves closed and the boost pumps off.....but I would still get a couple of drops out the nozzles. That way I knew the thing worked. No one ever noticed in three years and I never found one that didn't work right. Anyone else do that? or was I crazy?
Oldman From United States of America, joined Sep 2006, 0 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (12 years 2 months 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 1025 times:
Were you asking about major airlines and promotions? If you were then my original post will stand. All majors do in fact fill their "seats" as positions become available thru the almighty "Senority List".
"Jet"
The expression "Keep the tail behind you" was not supposed to make you chuckle. They were words of wisdom given to me years ago by the FAA when I was typed on the DC-3. Anyone that has experience in a larger tail dragger would understand immediately. Why is it you seem to have nothing better to do than attempt to be cynical towards me? You are still in my prayers,guess I will have to try harder. You are the only one on this forum that calls me a (ass hole)???? Your words. Is it that you are jealous of a 61 year oldman that was fortunate to have a wonderful career and now enjoys the farm? I wonder if there are any others reading this that perhaps share my opinion of your posts? If so I hope they will come forward and express their views. Thanks, just a nice Oldman. Would it help if I said to you "try to have a nice day"?
JETPILOT From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3130 posts, RR: 32 Reply 9, posted (12 years 2 months 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 1029 times:
I guess what goes around comes around.
I'm willing to call it quits since this constant hit and run stuff is getting older than the hills.
Oldman: "I think this will answer your question but there will be another that will expound on more inane facts." As if I wan't the intended target of this.
Maybe it's you who are jealous of a 29 year old just begining his career and wish to only be sitting where I am once again.
So shove the smiley face up your ass.
The forum would be better of if we just ignored each other and kept taunting to a minimum.
JETPILOT From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3130 posts, RR: 32 Reply 11, posted (12 years 2 months 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 1006 times:
This is generally my attitude. You gotta know the history here.
There's no denying the information we could learn from each other. But it doesn't look like were on the grounds for a cheerful exchange of info does it genious?
Widebody From Ireland, joined Aug 2000, 1150 posts, RR: 9 Reply 12, posted (12 years 2 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 1002 times:
Not knowing all the history, the problem seems to be in your quarter.......I ain't seeing any animosity on Oldman's part.....live, let go and learn....two experienced professionals.....where the **** would CRM go if yis were flying together??!!!
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