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Too Hot To Land?  
User currently offlineAa777jr From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 5170 times:

Was coming home from business DCA-DFW-AUS and I overheard a AA flight attendant that was deadheading home from DFW talking about a EWR trip she just worked and she was really upset over the delays she had on her segments. She mentioned to the other f/a deadheading home that it was too hot to land on the runway at LGA and there were all sorts of problems. I've never heard of this potentional problem for a/c landing. Comments?

Regards.

16 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineFlyingTexan From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 5141 times:

Possibly the ‘too hot to land' was not referring to meteorological factors. The venerable ‘ATC delays’ comes to mind.

User currently offlineLTBEWR From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13197 posts, RR: 15
Reply 2, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 5 hours ago) and read 5138 times:

Is it possible that the heat (and it's suddeness) may have cause heat heaving of the concrete slabs or problems with the paving materials on the runways. I know that this can happen on some roads when the tempatures get hot in short order or well above normal tempatures. Remember that on Sunday through Tuesday this week, the NYC area tempatures were about 88-90 degrees F. (30-32 C). These problems may have limited the use of one of the runways, requiring all traffic on only one runway, then causing limited access in and out of LGA those days.

User currently offlineJBLUA320 From United States of America, joined May 2002, 3180 posts, RR: 19
Reply 3, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 5074 times:
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I could just imagine LGA on 1 runway ops. It's a nightmare with 2...

JBLU


User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 29
Reply 4, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 5060 times:

Maybe there was a danger to the tires of landing planes if the pavement becomes too hot.

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineGoldenshield From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 6118 posts, RR: 14
Reply 5, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 5046 times:

I have to call bull on the heat theory; especially at that termpurature.

PHX, TUS, and LAS, to name a few, can get up into the 120's (F)/ 40's(C) in the summer. SNA can even see some days like this, and yet is has no major issues.



Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
User currently offlineOPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 5037 times:

>>>She mentioned to the other f/a deadheading home that it was too hot to land on the runway at LGA and there were all sorts of problems. I've never heard of this potentional problem for a/c landing.

I have no idea what the heck she was talking about...

The only time it's truly "too hot" is when an airport's temperature exceeds the aircraft's max operating temperature (MOT). The MOT at PHX for a -9 powered 737-200 is 122F, and some years ago when it hit 123F for a couple of hours we had to stop operating. I can't see MOT as any factor at the NYC airports, especially this time of the year...


User currently offlineYZ717 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 6 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 4997 times:

Further, what about Dubai or anywhere in the middle east? This recent heat is nothing compared to there.

User currently offlineNudelhirsch From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 1438 posts, RR: 19
Reply 8, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 4981 times:

I know what happened. The captain thought the FA was too hot to just land and let her go...


Putana da Seatbeltz!
User currently offlineCessnapimp From Canada, joined Oct 2001, 1320 posts, RR: 19
Reply 9, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 4929 times:

"Too hot" may have been meant metaphorically. "This place is too hot" can mean that the place is dangerous/rough/bad weather etc... etc...

There has been some bad weather at LGA yesterday and as a result many flights have been cancelled.

She either knew what she was talking about and was speaking metaphorically (knowing it was bad weather) or she overhear her pilot talk and took it litterally.


User currently offlineGothamSpotter From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 586 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 4816 times:

LGA was averaging 4 hour delays Monday due to a couple of massive lines of thunderstorms barrelling through and severe wind shear as they approached.

User currently offlineAa777jr From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 4735 times:

I didn't think it would be possible for the runway to heat up enough to effect the rubber on the a/c tires...

User currently offlineNewark777 From United States of America, joined Dec 2004, 9348 posts, RR: 29
Reply 12, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 4520 times:

I was just throwing an idea out there, guess I'm wrong.  Smile

Harry



Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
User currently offlineXXXX10 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2000, 777 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 4453 times:

AFAIK The only effect the temp might have is on the aircraft's go around performance but I doubt that would be a problem at LGA at 90 F if it were at a higher temp and an airfield surrounded by terrain then you may have a problem

User currently offlineZvezda From Lithuania, joined Aug 2004, 10511 posts, RR: 64
Reply 14, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 4431 times:

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 5):
PHX, TUS, and LAS, to name a few, can get up into the 120's (F)/ 40's(C) in the summer. SNA can even see some days like this, and yet is has no major issues.

40C=104F
45C=113F
48.8889C=120F
50C=122F
Did you mean 120s Fahrenheit or 40s Celsius? There is not much of an overlap.


User currently offlineSlamClick From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 10062 posts, RR: 68
Reply 15, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4382 times:

Personally I think the "too hot" story was just an excuse from a captain who did not care to go into a long complicated explanation, or explain a company decision that would have gotten angry letters from passengers.

That said, it can be "too hot" to land at a given airport.

Heat affects aircraft performance adversely. You cannot begin a landing approach unless you have the performance to do a rejected landing with one engine inoperative. Not likely to be a factor at LGA ever but it does happen at high elevation airports. Also the company might not want the plane landing there if it will not be able to take off until the weather cools down.

Also you cannot land if the ambient temperature is above 50oC or 122oF if your engines are flat-rated to that temperature. The airplane will do it, but you just don't have the charts for it.

Finally, no, the tire temperature is not going to be the limiting factor. The tires are serviced with dry nitrogen and there are fuse plugs to blow and relive the pressure if it gets too high. I'd be interested in hearing from someone who knows, approximately what kind of temps it takes to blow the fuse plugs.



Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
User currently offlineGoldenshield From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 6118 posts, RR: 14
Reply 16, posted (9 years 6 months 2 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 4351 times:

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 14):
Did you mean 120s Fahrenheit or 40s Celsius? There is not much of an overlap.

I did it as a general statement. I didn't have the formula in front of me to make an exact conversion.



Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
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