Piper aircraft also has a single engine version of the Navajo on the paper somewhere. The engine will be located on the tail DC-10 style... looks weird...
N231YE From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 2, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 13550 times:
Quoting Francoflier (Reply 1): Piper aircraft also has a single engine version of the Navajo on the paper somewhere. The engine will be located on the tail DC-10 style... looks weird...
Its good that you brought that up...it was all over the cover of the last Flying Magazine.
Starlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 13570 posts, RR: 68 Reply 3, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 5 days ago) and read 13539 times:
Sure looks neat, but I bet the calculations for that combined nacelle/tailcone will be a bitch. Also, you are cutting off quite a bit of airflow to the engine.
Tact Is For People Who Aren't Witty Enough To Be Sarcastic
Francoflier From France, joined Oct 2001, 1917 posts, RR: 10 Reply 6, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 13479 times:
Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 3): Sure looks neat, but I bet the calculations for that combined nacelle/tailcone will be a bitch. Also, you are cutting off quite a bit of airflow to the engine.
Now that you mention it...
From an amateur glance, there sure might a problem provding the ONLY engine with enough undisturbed airflow in high angle of attack & high power scenarios (the very scenarios that are already critical enough).
Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit posting...
FutureUApilot From United States, joined May 2004, 1365 posts, RR: 24 Reply 10, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 13427 times:
Pilotpip From United States, joined Sep 2003, 2619 posts, RR: 13 Reply 11, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 13422 times:
I assume you mean that it had a diesel engine installed under an STC?
ATCme From United States, joined Dec 2005, 304 posts, RR: 0 Reply 12, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 13414 times:
Don't forget the Cirrus Jet, which is yet to be unveiled (mock-up or prototype), but is supposedly a single engine 4 place jet (couldn't you tell by the name- Jet?).
Also the Piper Jet was featured in Flying.
ATCme
I'm from the FAA, and I'm here to help. Really. Yes I'm serious, I'm here to help you.
BHMBAGLOCK From United States, joined Jul 2005, 2693 posts, RR: 6 Reply 13, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 13383 times:
Quoting Pilotpip (Reply 11): I assume you mean that it had a diesel engine installed under an STC?
Probably a Garrett turbine actually. There are several STCs out there for Cessnas. Much more common in a 206 & up but there are some smaller Cessnas that have been modified as well.
Blackbird From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 16, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 13213 times:
What I was thinking of to be absolutely honest, would be a very simple, very basic Cessna 152 / Cessna 172 / Piper PA-28 Archer type of airplane, with simple old dials and gauges, cable controls, and a lightweight, basic, yet sturdy design, with speed equal to that of an MD-80/B-737.
The idea would be to keep it nice and simple, basic, easy to hand-fly, and a reasonable auto-pilot.
SCCutler From United States, joined Jan 2000, 4006 posts, RR: 35 Reply 18, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 13186 times:
Quoting Blackbird (Reply 16): What I was thinking of to be absolutely honest, would be a very simple, very basic Cessna 152 / Cessna 172 / Piper PA-28 Archer type of airplane, with simple old dials and gauges, cable controls, and a lightweight, basic, yet sturdy design, with speed equal to that of an MD-80/B-737.
The idea would be to keep it nice and simple, basic, easy to hand-fly, and a reasonable auto-pilot.
Andrea K
While I would dearly love to see an affordable jet airplane, what you suggest sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. There is a reason why single-pilot-certified jets are required to have operational autopilots and FMS.
It's not just the aircraft that are complicated and demanding in the flight levels, it's the environment. A certain degree of complexity is necessary to have a reasonable chance at a good safety record.
Just MHO.
...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
Dougloid From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 19, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 13107 times:
Gulfstream had a single engine executive jet project a while ago that never got built. It was going to be powered by a single JT15D4, which is as close to dead ass reliable as you can get.
Tito mentions the Visionaire project, and there is a prototype but the company's defunct. They built a pretty good sized building in Ames Iowa to build the thing but the project went wayyyyyyy over budget and out of time. There is a guy named Matt Eller around here who bought up everything out of the bankruptcy for about $450,000.
Here's an interesting article on what's now known as Eviation. There are plans to build it in Brazil.
SlamClick From United States, joined Nov 2003, 9996 posts, RR: 79 Reply 20, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 13069 times:
I posted the L-39 because whatever the factories come up with will have to compete on a cost-per-seat basis. Besides it is cool. I see one about once a month, all year long.
I still like my idea for the T-37. While it is not real pretty, I can picture it with a strong, reliable single fanjet, the two ejection seats replaced with four Recaro buckets, a modern panel, topped with a smoked canopy and a killer stereo.
Life is good!
Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
You'd have a killer of a time converting that from a twin to a single...
And seeing how all the frames are now pretty old and all had a nice looooong life as trainers, it'd be like buying an overhauled driving school car.
Quoting SlamClick (Reply 20): topped with a smoked canopy and a killer stereo.
Ok, NOW we're talking!
Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit posting...
SlamClick From United States, joined Nov 2003, 9996 posts, RR: 79 Reply 22, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 13053 times:
Quoting Francoflier (Reply 21): You'd have a killer of a time converting that from a twin to a single...
Yes, as I typed that I realized that part - the whole interior design back there around the engines it had. Maybe a pair of smaller, more modern engines. Don't know what might work.
And yes, I'd guess they've had a hard life.
Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
2H4 From United States, joined Oct 2004, 8098 posts, RR: 65 Reply 23, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 13057 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW DATABASE EDITOR
Quoting SlamClick (Reply 20): I still like my idea for the T-37. While it is not real pretty, I can picture it with a strong, reliable single fanjet, the two ejection seats replaced with four Recaro buckets, a modern panel, topped with a smoked canopy and a killer stereo.
SlamClick From United States, joined Nov 2003, 9996 posts, RR: 79 Reply 24, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 3 hours ago) and read 13047 times:
Quoting 2H4 (Reply 23): Have you seen the Cessna 407 concept?
Pretty much what I had in mind except for the solid roof, dog whistle engines, and those crappy 172 seats.
The plane appears to have a tail number of 60407. According to Baugher that would make it a canceled KC-135 or a Canadian built Helldiver.
Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
2H4 From United States, joined Oct 2004, 8098 posts, RR: 65 Reply 25, posted (2 years 10 months 2 weeks 3 days 2 hours ago) and read 13037 times:
AIRLINERS.NET CREW DATABASE EDITOR
Quoting SlamClick (Reply 24): that would make it a canceled KC-135 or a Canadian built Helldiver.
...Or a far more elaborate conversion than I initially thought.
2H4
Intentionally Left Blank
26 Blackbird: I have nothing against a plane having a flight-management system. I'm thinking though sticking to mostly regular gauges and such would be better for s
27 SlamClick: Just spent more time looking at that C-407. That thing was so fifties! Not surprising that they dreamed it up, or that it never saw production. I reme
28 ATCT: The Cessna 407 project was nothing more than a 4 seat Cessna T-37 Tweet. Also along the same theme, though a twin, was the Moraine-Saulnier Paris Jet.
29 2H4: Reminds me of the old fifties-era paint schemes used by Mooney and Piper back in the day. I love those. Blackbird, be sure to check this site out whe
30 KBFIspotter: I have always had a fantasy about converting some random GA aircraft to jets. It could fun, although extermely impractical. Now my idea of placing a R
31 2H4: You've seen the turboprop Luscombe, haven't you? 2H4
32 KBFIspotter: I have... There is just something about the A250 in a 150 that gets to me, though... Now, I like this even more... Kris
33 2H4: Yeah, that's a beaut. I'd better stop now before this turns into one of those threads.... 2H4
34 KBFIspotter: Ah, come on now, 2H4. You know you miss it... Kris
35 N231YE: I have no idea what you are talking about. Could you give us an example?
36 KELPkid: The scary thing is, from all accounts I've heard, that thing actually exists. That is a real locomotive horn on the nose gear Wonder what happens if
37 KELPkid: Here's a question for you: could such a plane be made that would cost not much more than a factory new Cessna 172 or Piper Warrior? Would the fuel co
39 Blackbird: 2H4, That is *so* totally the idea I was thinking of regarding simplicity and ordinary gauges. However I don't know if I would have used the same exac
40 KELPkid: What's the fuel consumption like? How about an engine overhaul? Could you imagine transitioning into one of these as a 100 hour PPL? You'd probably b
41 SlamClick: I think I overstated the tradeoff. Probably more like several hundred hours rather than a thousand. I've been told on some authority that less than a
42 KELPkid: AFAIK, all of them in the US are registered as experimentals...however, you need a LOA (letter of authorization) to fly one. I think you can get the
43 2H4: Oh, you'll see plenty of examples in the next contest this spring or summer.... Until then, I'm getting my fix gathering devious photos.... I'd be mo
44 ATCT: Gotta love the Helio Stallion, a beautiful aircraft. Gets off the ground in no time! Isnt there a Czech company making a single engine turboprop and j
47 ATCT: The Bede 5 "J" (not the prop shown above) was a very simple machine mechanically, but a very complex machine to fly due to its characteristics. Very f
48 BHMBAGLOCK: GAD is where a lot of people train on the L-39. They also do lots of maintenance and sales on them as well. $750/hr plus fuel at GAD for flight train
49 Pilawt: Don't forget the Gulfstream American Peregrine from 1983. -- Pilawt
50 2H4: Well, we can't allow a tie, now, can we? I present the Cri-Cri jet...all 374 pounds of it: 2H4
51 CRJonBeez: i'm surprised nobody has mentioned the cirrus jet, fitting into the PLJ category. personal light jet... one step up from the SR22, it looks quite simi
53 KBFIspotter: That aircraft actually started out as a stock Courier... There was an excellent article about it in Sport Aviation about 2 years ago, and the owners
55 BHMBAGLOCK: Some of this sounds like BS to me. For example, the Stallion is considerably larger than a Courier. Also, the Stallion pre-dates the Hummer by about
56 N231YE: Exactly, a jet powered Ultralight!: ...or if you're really dedicated, a jet powered hang glider!
57 2H4: Your BS meter needs to be calibrated. KBFIspotter knows what he's talking about. It's not a Stallion. What does it matter whether an aircraft pre-dat
58 2H4: Ok, I didn't want to have to do this, but you've forced me: 2H4
59 N231YE: I see, about time for a variation of the "Identify This" do you say?
60 SlamClick: Not exactly sure where you are headed with this but I will state with certainty that the plane depicted in reply #32 is NOT a Helio Stallion, never w
61 BHMBAGLOCK: I stand corrected - for some reason I read Stallion when it said Courier. I also missed #32 - ugly beast! My apologies, I'm getting over the flu and
62 Blackbird: In regards for such a plane's use, I would think it would be predominantly for student pilots, however being a jet, and able to be pressurized, it cou
63 KELPkid: Yeah, but the question is: could you make a FADEC unit cheap enough for the low quantities of mass production that a light GA plane would see? FADEC
64 Blackbird: Well, could you use a relatively regular, fairly old-fasioned fuel-control system (1960's era), fitted with a series of relatively simple sensors whic
65 SlamClick: Maybe, provided the instructors had substantial recip and jet experience. The problem I see is the difference between these airplanes. Even if we had
66 Blackbird: Well, at least initially, yeah I see no problems with the instructors needing both recip and jet experience. There are some fast responding turbojets/
67 DEVILFISH: What about this?..... http://www.x-jets.com/velocity_jet.html Did it ever progress to a reliably safe, flyable prototype?
68 SlamClick: A friend of mine checks people out in warbird jets including the L-39. His students are mostly businessmen who are low-time (two thousand hours or so
69 Starlionblue: Would a couple of dozen hours of glider time help these people? Sounds like energy management is key.
70 2H4: I think a couple of dozen hours of glider time would help any pilot! 2H4
71 N231YE: Would killing the power on a C172 and gliding it as long as you can count?
72 2H4: With that much drag, I'm not sure the principles of momentum can be very clearly illustrated... 2H4
73 N231YE: Oh sure they can...just read my signature!
74 SlamClick: Well not a couple dozen hours but I do have a bit of glider time. Hated it! Something about having a useless O-470 or R-985 bolted on out front of me
75 Crjonbeez: AFAIK, yes. now that you mention it, i saw one up at osh kosh this year on the flight line by all the EZs
76 Francoflier: I NEED to know where that guy gets his life insurrance from....
77 Marcus: What about this one?.......... http://www.the-jet.com/infobase.html
78 Mir: Yes, please. Can we say "getting behind the airplane"? Student pilots sometimes can't even keep up with a 152 - how the hell are they supposed to kee
79 DEVILFISH: A few models more came out after this thread's start. Eclipse ECJ - The Ultimate Personal Jet? (by DEVILFISH Jul 23 2007 in Civil Aviation)
81 Dw747400: And most are designed with ceilings between FL250 to FL350. The Eclipse ECJ is supposed to be capable of FL410, but a number of engineers have commen
82 Blackbird: Well, here's what I would have thought up... (Be prepared to cringe) The idea I was thinking of was kind of a cross between these two aircraft primari
83 Blackbird: By the way, what's the story behind that jet-powered hang-glider... I could imagine lots of adrenaline-junkies loving something like that. Andrea Kent
84 Mir: You too, eh? You might like this video then. -Mir
85 Blackbird: That body-suit that produces lift... not such a fan of it-- it's not powered. I'm not a huge fan of gliders. The jet hang-glider really does fly. Andr
86 Dougloid: I see the prototype sitting out on the ramp every week or so when I'm up in Ames. One of the biggest problems is that the cost of maintaining a turbi
87 Blackbird: How much harder is maintaining a turbine vs a piston? Andrea Kent
88 KELPkid: From everything I've read, turbines have the advantage, however, due to the exotic metallurgy and high fuel consumption of the engines that go "tweet
89 Blackbird: How much would a turbine engine plus maintanence cost over a recip plus maintenance over the same time period? Is it possible to design turbofans with
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