Sponsor Message:
Aviation Technical / Operations Forum
My Starred Topics | Profile | New Topic | Forum Index | Help | Search 
Avro C.102 Jetliner Hyd. Systems Question  
User currently offlineBlackbird From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 1985 times:

To the best of my knowledge, the Avro C.102 Jetliner featured hydraulic boosting on all control surfaces. My question is did it feature artificial-feel (something the Comet didn't have until after an accident or two) or not?

Andrea Kent
"Private Cowboy, Private Joker -- As soon as you finish your bunks, I want you two turds to clean the head. I want that head so sanitary and squared-away that the Virgin Mary, herself, would be *PROUD* to go in there and take a dump!"
- Gunnery Sergeant Hartman / Full-Metal Jacket (1987)

10 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineBlackbird From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 1933 times:

Nobody has any answers?

Andrea K


User currently offlineArrow From Canada, joined Jun 2002, 2676 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 1925 times:

Quoting Blackbird (Reply 1):
Nobody has any answers?

Pretty obscure airplane, Blackbird. My father did some of the engineering work on that bird and if he was still alive I'd ask him. I saw it fly many times, and I know it was well-advanced technologically, but that's the extent of my knowledge. I think Larry Milberry may have written a book about this plane -- try a google on that. I'm also quite sure that Jim Floyd, the designer of the jetliner (and the Avro Arrow) wrote a book on it, too.

Good luck



Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
User currently offlineBlackbird From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 1892 times:

Thank you for your help Arrow,

Andrea Kent


User currently offlineJetlagged From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2005, 2572 posts, RR: 25
Reply 4, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 1871 times:

With boosted controls you don't normally need artificial feel. Some control hinge moment gets fed back to the pilot's control.

Quoting Blackbird (Thread starter):
something the Comet didn't have until after an accident or two

Steady. From what I've read the Comet I used springs for artificial feel. Not as good as hydraulic q-feel but better than nothing. The takeoff accidents were due to over-rotation and the symmetrical aerofoil the Comet had. Artificial feel is not much use at low speed.



The glass isn't half empty, or half full, it's twice as big as it needs to be.
User currently offlineBlackbird From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 5, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 1870 times:

Jetlagged,

I had no idea that the Comet featured a symmetrical airfoil. I just knew that it stalled at a lower AoA than advertized. I thought the Comet was classified as having boosted-controls too... yet it had almost no feel.

Hmmm,
Andrea Kent


User currently offlineJetlagged From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2005, 2572 posts, RR: 25
Reply 6, posted (7 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 1867 times:

And no leading edge devices of course. Takeoff in a Comet must have been tricky.

Quoting Blackbird (Reply 5):
boosted-controls too... yet it had almost no feel

Boosted controls are like a car's power steering. Some systems give you lots of force feedback, others very little. It's analagous to a lever. I don't know how much feedback the Comet had, but it did use spring feel to add to the centreing force, with the datum shifts so the neutral point could be moved.

Fully powered controls give you no feedback at all.



The glass isn't half empty, or half full, it's twice as big as it needs to be.
User currently offlineTwinOtter4Ever From Canada, joined Feb 2008, 213 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (6 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 1682 times:

I believe the comet (4c at least) had 60 degress flaps. so they weren't too bad. But that would have been used more on landing.

User currently offlineBlackbird From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (6 years 8 months 2 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1656 times:

Most pictures of the comet I've seen had low deflections on the flaps during takeoff... deflections were very high during landing

User currently offlinePrebennorholm From Denmark, joined Mar 2000, 6515 posts, RR: 54
Reply 9, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 1562 times:



Quoting Blackbird (Reply 5):
I had no idea that the Comet featured a symmetrical airfoil.

It was not symmetrical.

But as a consequense of the March 1953 disaster in Karachi the Comet 2 had the profile modified to become "less symmetrical".

The leading edge was drooped somewhat in order to increase take-off performance at a minor expense of slightly increased cruise drag.



Always keep your number of landings equal to your number of take-offs, Preben Norholm
User currently offlineBlackbird From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 10, posted (6 years 8 months 1 week 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 1506 times:

I thought the Comet 1's wing was modified to the Comet 2's design, which was already flying in 1952...


Andrea


Top Of Page
Forum Index

Reply To This Topic Avro C.102 Jetliner Hyd. Systems Question
Username:
No username? Sign up now!
Password: 


Forgot Password? Be reminded.
Remember me on this computer (uses cookies)
  • Tech/Ops related posts only!
  • Not Tech/Ops related? Use the other forums
  • No adverts of any kind. This includes web pages.
  • No hostile language or criticizing of others.
  • Do not post copyright protected material.
  • Use relevant and describing topics.
  • Check if your post already been discussed.
  • Check your spelling!
  • DETAILED RULES
Add Images Add SmiliesPosting Help

Please check your spelling (press "Check Spelling" above)


Similar topics:More similar topics...
CRJ-200 HYD SOV Question posted Sun Sep 4 2005 16:02:46 by UAL Bagsmasher
Pre And Post Flight Systems Question posted Sun Sep 28 2003 07:05:04 by Sxmarbury33
Avgas Question... posted Sun Jul 1 2007 12:53:40 by Pipo777
UND Podcast Question posted Sun Jul 1 2007 12:08:15 by Bablackpilot
Question On A330 Engines posted Sun Jul 1 2007 07:49:35 by Kaitak744
ELT Question (737) posted Wed Jun 27 2007 04:04:04 by CanadianNorth
777 Tailcone Question posted Tue Jun 26 2007 16:19:51 by WithaK
B-707/DC-8 Self-Start Systems posted Sun Jun 24 2007 22:25:05 by Blackbird
747-400 Auto Brake Question. posted Sat Jun 23 2007 23:38:21 by Bobbidooley
Question About TZ's New DC-10 posted Wed Jun 20 2007 22:53:00 by RyDawg82

Sponsor Message:
Printer friendly format