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How Often Does An Airliner Have Tech Problems?  
User currently offlineLY777 From France, joined Nov 2005, 2679 posts, RR: 2
Posted (6 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 22 hours ago) and read 3805 times:

My question may be silly, but I would like to know often modern airliners have technical problems before boarding: It is not rare that there is a 1, 2 or 3 hour delay before a flight due to technical problems.
Thanks


אמא, אני מתגעגע לך
18 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineN710PS From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 1166 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (6 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 3752 times:

So to continue with my spew of sarcasim today I will put it like this. JetBlue E190's count on it every time. ASA just show up an hour late and you will be right on time.

Seriously though. It depends on the plane. In our fleet ship 706 is the queen of the attention whores.



There is plenty of room for Gods animals, right next to the mashed potatoes!
User currently offlineFredT From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2002, 2185 posts, RR: 26
Reply 2, posted (6 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 3721 times:

We had a dispatch reliability on our aircraft which was in the upper percent. That's fleetwide, worldwide.


I thought I was doing good trying to avoid those airport hotels... and look at me now.
User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13999 posts, RR: 62
Reply 3, posted (6 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 18 hours ago) and read 3697 times:

Most airlines today have dispatch reliabilities of bigger than 95%, this means out of 100 departures the plane is delayed for technical reason for 5 departures or less.
[sarcasm]I hope that you prefer us to FIX the problem before the flight or do you prefer to fly on a plane with a known defect? [/ sarcasm]

Jan


User currently offlineTdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80
Reply 4, posted (6 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 3649 times:

Quoting LY777 (Thread starter):
My question may be silly, but I would like to know often modern airliners have technical problems before boarding: It is not rare that there is a 1, 2 or 3 hour delay before a flight due to technical problems.

It really depends on how you define "problem". A problem that leads to a delay (more the 15 minutes late) should happen about 1-2 times per hundred flights (on average). Less often on small single aisles, more often on large long-haul aircraft.

Probably about 95% of airplanes are flying with something not quite right about them...something deferred, deactivated, temporarily repaired, etc. That's not unsafe, just normal maintenance activity.

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 3):
Most airlines today have dispatch reliabilities of bigger than 95%, this means out of 100 departures the plane is delayed for technical reason for 5 departures or less.

Does dispatch reliability include all delays, not just technical ones? In other words, a 95% dispatch reliability might be 3% technical and 2% other stuff.

Tom.


User currently offlineMD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13999 posts, RR: 62
Reply 5, posted (6 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 3643 times:

Quoting Tdscanuck (Reply 4):
Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 3):
Most airlines today have dispatch reliabilities of bigger than 95%, this means out of 100 departures the plane is delayed for technical reason for 5 departures or less.

Does dispatch reliability include all delays, not just technical ones? In other words, a 95% dispatch reliability might be 3% technical and 2% other stuff.

Delays get split up based on the reason. It is also quite common to share a delay between several codes, e.g. a technical delay, which was fixed within ten minutes, but caused a plane to miss a slot and forced it to stay on ground for another hour.
We have to supply a written report for any delay where maintenance is involved (even if it is a baggage trolley which hit the plane, in this case we get called to assess the damage and to decide if the plane is airworthy, but the delay is not technical because it was caused by ground handling) if there is a delay of more than 5 minutes.
There are various delay codes, among them serious stuff like a personal delay, e.g. the mechanic is not at the aircraft on time. This can lead to an interview with the manager, no seat offered, no coffee served.
Originally the ideas of delay codes and delay reports were intended to be used as a tool to find shortcomings (e.g. to find out if a station was understaffed or didn't have enough supplies or equipment), but over time it developed into a blame game with one department pushing the responsibility to another. We have to watch like eagles that we don't get delays pushed on us for which we don't carry any responsibility, e.g. pilots causing finger trouble, which we have to sort out or a pilot being late at the aircraft and "inventing" a maintenance delay to cover himself. Our managers again just look at the statistics, where the different stations are being compared, with those managers with the highest dispatch reliability being given bonusses. At most airlines the dispatch reliability for maintenance reasons is somewhere around 98 %.

Jan


User currently offline411A From United States of America, joined Nov 2001, 1826 posts, RR: 8
Reply 6, posted (6 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 3643 times:

Having operated (personally) one L1011 last year for Hajj flights, the dispatch reliability of that particular airplane was 99%...not too bad for a twenty four year old airplane...it really depends on the type of maintenance received and the dedication of those operating and servicing the airplane.

User currently offlineCharlienorth From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 1120 posts, RR: 4
Reply 7, posted (6 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 12 hours ago) and read 3607 times:

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 5):
We have to watch like eagles that we don't get delays pushed on us for which we don't carry any responsibility, e.g. pilots causing finger trouble, which we have to sort out or a pilot being late at the aircraft and "inventing" a maintenance delay to cover himself.

I guess it's the same all over,at my co. the crew is supposed to be sitting with their hands in their laps ten minutes prior to push back,all checklist items should have been covered,the cabin crew also must have no gripes,if either do than it belongs to the crew(exception being a late ecam message) another culprit can be the ramp,they might report something "broke" in the pit to put it on mx if it looks like they will have a delay.


User currently offlineHAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31679 posts, RR: 56
Reply 8, posted (6 years 11 months 1 week 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 3512 times:

Depending if the snag is defferrable under MEL,or as stated above a damage caused by ground equipment would be termed as non technical delay.

Out here,A delay >15 mins duration due Technical would need detailed reporting to the regulatory authorities too.

regds
MEL



Think of the brighter side!
User currently offlinePilotboi From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 2366 posts, RR: 9
Reply 9, posted (6 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 3449 times:

If you talking about ASA - about 90% of the time.  Wink

User currently offlineN710PS From United States of America, joined Oct 2006, 1166 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (6 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 3387 times:

Quoting Pilotboi (Reply 9):
If you talking about ASA - about 90% of the time.

 checkmark   checkmark   checkmark 


Ha ha, you sir have hit the nail right on the head.



There is plenty of room for Gods animals, right next to the mashed potatoes!
User currently offlineTristarSteve From Sweden, joined Nov 2005, 4000 posts, RR: 34
Reply 11, posted (6 years 11 months 1 week 23 hours ago) and read 3276 times:

The technical delay rate for our airline as a whole is about 99.2 per cent. i.e. 99.2 pc of flights are not delayed for technical reasons. Due to the way the MEL is worded, you get slightly more delays at main base, and slightly less away from base. A tech delay is recorded if the plane is late. One minute is enough!. It is pretty constant over time.

User currently offlineNWA ARJ From United States of America, joined May 2001, 547 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (6 years 11 months 1 week 20 hours ago) and read 3243 times:

In Fargo with the Skywest CRJ-200's we would have one or two planes a day that would have mechanical problems.


Nightmare 68, Fargo Tower, Runway 36, Fly Runway Heading, Mantain 10,000, Cleared For Takeoff, Change To Departure
User currently offlineEx52tech From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 559 posts, RR: 1
Reply 13, posted (6 years 11 months 1 week 10 hours ago) and read 3184 times:

Quoting NWA ARJ (Reply 12):
In Fargo with the Skywest CRJ-200's

I was exiled to North Dakota by the USAF, and spent a year in Fargo also.........your dispatch reliability problems might have something to do with the fact that it gets so cold up there at times that nothing works.



"Saddest thing I ever witnessed....an airplane being scrapped"
User currently offlineNWA ARJ From United States of America, joined May 2001, 547 posts, RR: 1
Reply 14, posted (6 years 11 months 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 3118 times:

Yea but I am refering to this past summer. We had problems every day even when it was 90 degrees out. I just think that the CRJ-200's seem to be aging and the fact the SkyWest runs them non stop all day with little rest at night. But who knows


Nightmare 68, Fargo Tower, Runway 36, Fly Runway Heading, Mantain 10,000, Cleared For Takeoff, Change To Departure
User currently offlineEx52tech From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 559 posts, RR: 1
Reply 15, posted (6 years 11 months 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 3064 times:

Quoting NWA ARJ (Reply 14):
Yea but I am refering to this past summer. We had problems every day even when it was 90 degrees out.

Well then, maybe you guys just need a few good mechanics to keep them operating at their best.

But sadly that requires the expenditure of some money. So most airlines would rather "roll the dice", and hope that their aircraft will have a good dispatch reliability this quarter, than hire some good wrenches that could actually give them a good return on their investment.

The industry has gone in that direction, the airlines have adopted the idea, wrongly I might add, that "your job is your reward". Well all I can say is you get what you pay for.



"Saddest thing I ever witnessed....an airplane being scrapped"
User currently offlineCharlienorth From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 1120 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (6 years 11 months 6 days 1 hour ago) and read 3013 times:

Quoting NWA ARJ (Reply 14):
Yea but I am refering to this past summer. We had problems every day even when it was 90 degrees out. I just think that the CRJ-200's seem to be aging and the fact the SkyWest runs them non stop all day with little rest at night. But who knows

They're susceptible to bleed leaks,aggravated by hot weather.

Quoting Ex52tech (Reply 15):

Well then, maybe you guys just need a few good mechanics to keep them operating at their best.

But sadly that requires the expenditure of some money. So most airlines would rather "roll the dice", and hope that their aircraft will have a good dispatch reliability this quarter, than hire some good wrenches that could actually give them a good return on their investment.

The industry has gone in that direction, the airlines have adopted the idea, wrongly I might add, that "your job is your reward". Well all I can say is you get what you pay for.

 checkmark   checkmark 
As long as bean counters run things this trend will continue,for some reason the respect for maintenance personnel has dropped to zero,but they still send the work overseas where there is no drug testing or controls on who can work on the aircraft,oh well as long as you can fly coast to coast for $99 it isn't too bad  sarcastic 


User currently offlineNWA ARJ From United States of America, joined May 2001, 547 posts, RR: 1
Reply 17, posted (6 years 11 months 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 2975 times:

Quoting Charlienorth (Reply 16):
They're susceptible to bleed leaks,aggravated by hot weather.

And that may be but we never had problems with that in Fargo. And it was never the same stuff broken. It was alway something different. So then a contract maintenance worker would come out and try to fix it, and not be able to, and then they would end up ferrying the plane back to Chicago. What a waste



Nightmare 68, Fargo Tower, Runway 36, Fly Runway Heading, Mantain 10,000, Cleared For Takeoff, Change To Departure
User currently offlineCharlienorth From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 1120 posts, RR: 4
Reply 18, posted (6 years 11 months 5 days ago) and read 2927 times:

Quoting NWA ARJ (Reply 17):
And that may be but we never had problems with that in Fargo. And it was never the same stuff broken. It was alway something different. So then a contract maintenance worker would come out and try to fix it, and not be able to, and then they would end up ferrying the plane back to Chicago. What a waste

Back when ACA was flying the UAX flights into FAR I showed up for the midday flight,the agent rolled her eye and said the aircraft was broken,she than said this captain seemed to be afraid to fly with passengers and liked break the airplane at out stations and ferry back to ORD,I told her to tell the Junior Birdman that there was a UAL mechanic willing to look at the aircraft,suddenly the flight was re-instated and I never did find out what the "mechanical problem" was


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