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GA Exhaust System  
User currently offlineSprout5199 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1853 posts, RR: 2
Posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 2323 times:

Was outside having a smoke(I work near PBI) and a thought occurred to me:

How come there is no noise suppression on GA aircraft exhausts? I know it reduces HP, and add a little weight, but seems to me the benefits would out weight the minuses. A cirrus/cessna/piper on climb out is very loud.

Just a thought.

Dan in Jupiter

26 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 59
Reply 1, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2315 times:
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Quoting Sprout5199 (Thread starter):
How come there is no noise suppression on GA aircraft exhausts? I know it reduces HP, and add a little weight, but seems to me the benefits would out weight the minuses. A cirrus/cessna/piper on climb out is very loud.

Well, I believe the vast majority of the noise is produced by the propeller, followed by airframe noise. The engine itself probably makes no more noise than a Subaru with a Pep-Boys exhaust system.

2H4



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User currently offlineSprout5199 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1853 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2313 times:



Quoting 2H4 (Reply 1):
I believe the vast majority of the noise is produced by the propeller,

DUH, should have thought of that.

Is friday---brain fried till 1st beer.  drunk 

Dan in Jupiter


User currently offlineN353SK From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 822 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2215 times:

Newer Pipers actually do have a muffler and are pretty quiet on the ground or on approach.

User currently offlineLowrider From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 3220 posts, RR: 10
Reply 4, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 2189 times:

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 1):
Well, I believe the vast majority of the noise is produced by the propeller, followed by airframe noise.

Agreed. If you want a comparison, you can use two aircraft with the same (or similar) engines but vastly different props. A Cessna 206, for example, can have a 2 or 3 bladed prop, in terms of fly over noise, the 3 bladed one is quieter. If you want real prop noise, go find a Seabee, or a 207 with a 2 bladed prop. What a great way to piss off the neighbors.

[Edited 2008-02-09 03:40:30]


Proud OOTSK member
User currently offlineBoeingOnFinal From Norway, joined Apr 2006, 476 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 2180 times:

You want REAL noise, try the contra-rotating props the Russians are so fond of. I can hear them take off in Moscow right now, and I live in Southern Norway.

Any who, there are some muffler fit small aircraft out there. ( Click )



norwegianpilot.blogspot.com
User currently offlineN231YE From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (6 years 7 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 2113 times:

The Cessna 172 has a muffler, in fact, the cabin heat comes from shrouding that surrounds the muffler.

Pipers have what may be smaller mufflers...I don't know. But at least they're loud...what a real airplane should be  mischievous  *cough* *cough* 2H4 *cough*


User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 59
Reply 7, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 2066 times:
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Quoting N231YE (Reply 6):
Pipers have what may be smaller mufflers...I don't know. But at least they're loud...what a real airplane should b

Loud/cool Cessnas are easily found - particularly those with radial engines. Radials must have been deemed too hardcore for the nancies at Piper.  mischievous 

2H4



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User currently offlineN353SK From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 822 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 2063 times:



Quoting BoeingOnFinal (Reply 5):
You want REAL noise, try the contra-rotating props the Russians are so fond of. I can hear them take off in Moscow right now, and I live in Southern Norway.

Mitsubishi MU-2 anybody?


User currently offlineATCT From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 2293 posts, RR: 38
Reply 9, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 2045 times:



Quoting 2H4 (Reply 7):
Radials must have been deemed too hardcore for the nancies at Piper.

Amen my brother. Only wish I could put a radial on my RV-8 project!!!

Clint
(Radials dont leak oil, theyre just marking their territory.)



"The way to get started is to quit talking and begin doing." - Walt Disney
User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6388 posts, RR: 3
Reply 10, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 2033 times:



Quoting N353SK (Reply 8):
Mitsubishi MU-2 anybody?

Aah, the Hoover model  Wink Like I've said before, between the MU-2 and the 20-series Learjets, these are the reasons that lineboys must wear hearing protection .



Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently offlineN231YE From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 2031 times:



Quoting 2H4 (Reply 7):
Radials must have been deemed too hardcore for the nancies at Piper.

From Encyclopædia Britannica Online:

Quote:
Cessna and Beechcraft still used radial-piston engines, but Piper relied on a horizontally opposed four-cylinder engine that allowed engineers to design a more streamlined engine nacelle. This type of engine became the preferred style for modern light-plane.

http://www.britannica.com/eb/article...0589/history-of-flight#943744.hook

I guess Piper was so advanced for their time, Cessna seems to have copied Piper after they realized who the leader was  biggrin 


User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 59
Reply 12, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2028 times:
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Quoting N231YE (Reply 11):
who the leader was

Cessna:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Michael Haefner
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Mario Andreya






Piper:




.....and, the prosecution rests.  biggrin 

2H4


P.S. - In terms of recips, a radial is to a horizontally-opposed what Chuck Norris is to Barry Manilow.  yes 



Intentionally Left Blank
User currently offlineN231YE From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 13, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 2021 times:



Quoting 2H4 (Reply 12):

That's what happens when bad management runs a company for many years, kinda like the Apple Computer of the 1990s.

Its too bad when people think of a bush pilot, the aircraft that often comes to mind is:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Stuart Haigh - topjetpix
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Randy Rallo



Yup, not a Cessna  wink 


User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 59
Reply 14, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2016 times:
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Yep, I'll freely admit the Cub is extremely cool. The PA-48 also scored extremely high on the coolness scale.

That's where the coolness ended, though. The important thing is that the aviation community welcomes the poor, misguided single-engine low-wing Piper fans into the world of good taste.  Smile

2H4



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User currently offlineATCT From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 2293 posts, RR: 38
Reply 15, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 2012 times:



Quoting N231YE (Reply 13):
Its too bad when people think of a bush pilot, the aircraft that often comes to mind is:

Besides the DHC-2, the best bushplane of all times. (Though they have different missions)



"The way to get started is to quit talking and begin doing." - Walt Disney
User currently offlineN231YE From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 16, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 1969 times:



Quoting ATCT (Reply 15):
Besides the DHC-2, the best bushplane of all times.

That's a nice airplane, fortunately, its not a Cessna  mischievous 


User currently offlineSprout5199 From United States of America, joined Feb 2005, 1853 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 1954 times:

Damn, this went from a stupid friday question to a knockdown drag out between Cessna(2H4) and Pipers(N231YE) real quick. Not that I mind it though.

I vote for Cessna. Thats what I fly, if a 152 can be counted as an airplane. More like a large dragonfly with seats. But a dragonfly has more horsepower.

Dan in Jupiter


User currently offline2H4 From United States of America, joined Oct 2004, 8955 posts, RR: 59
Reply 18, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 1936 times:
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Quoting Sprout5199 (Reply 17):
Damn, this went from a stupid friday question to a knockdown drag out between Cessna(2H4) and Pipers(N231YE) real quick. Not that I mind it though.

Just to be clear, my pro-Cessna position is based entirely on the sheer ugliness of Piper's counterparts. I'd still buy N231YE a beer any day of the week.  biggrin 

2H4



Intentionally Left Blank
User currently offlineKELPkid From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 6388 posts, RR: 3
Reply 19, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 21 hours ago) and read 1931 times:



Quoting 2H4 (Reply 18):
Just to be clear, my pro-Cessna position is based entirely on the sheer ugliness of Piper's counterparts. I'd still buy N231YE a beer any day of the week.

2H4

As to the C vs. P wars, I just ask the person who is behind each manufacturer's product to do the following: Get established on final, and cut the power to idle. Which one still makes the runway, and which one drops like a rock?  eyebrow  HINT: the Hersheybar winged-one develops a really high sink rate  Wink



Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
User currently offlineATCT From United States of America, joined Mar 2001, 2293 posts, RR: 38
Reply 20, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 1906 times:



Quoting KELPkid (Reply 19):
HINT: the Hersheybar winged-one develops a really high sink rate

So do Bonanza's but no one is saying theyre crap :P

Anywho I like Piper Archers, but at the same time I really like the straight tail 172/182's from 57-58ish, but as I get older...im rapidly becoming a Beech fan lol. (also as I start hanging out in wealthier circles lol...I cant afford a bonanza haha)

Clint
(soon to be...sometime in the next 2-7 years....an RV-8 flyer)



"The way to get started is to quit talking and begin doing." - Walt Disney
User currently offlineScooter01 From Norway, joined Nov 2006, 1204 posts, RR: 8
Reply 21, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 5 days 16 hours ago) and read 1895 times:
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Well, spring must be in the air...

As I was cooking dinner yesterday with a wide open kitchen window, I noticed a "snaring" sound from outside, not the usual "Piperfart". Looking out and up I saw Norway's only L-19 or O-1 flying by .


Scooter01  biggrin 



"We all have a girl and her name is nostalgia" - Hemingway
User currently offlineN231YE From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 22, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 1798 times:



Quoting Sprout5199 (Reply 17):

I apologize for partially derailing the thread, but it sure was fun  wink 

Quoting ATCT (Reply 20):
but as I get older...im rapidly becoming a Beech fan lol. (also as I start hanging out in wealthier circles lol...I cant afford a bonanza haha)

Whatever you do, don't become a doctor  wink 

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 18):
I'd still buy N231YE a beer any day of the week.

...that was, after N231YE gave 2H4 a flight in a Piperjet. Unfortunately, I have not passed that magic age of 21, and I don't drink  smile .

...maybe I could get 2H4 a ride in the real N231YE.


User currently offlineSCCutler From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 5520 posts, RR: 28
Reply 23, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 1769 times:

Most all GA aircraft have mufflers, they just don't do that much to "muffle."

As for the whole Cessna vs. Piper thing, I have a simple answer: Beechcraft!

I am quite fond of the short-wing Cherokees, though. I love that sink rate, when I need it.



...three miles from BRONS, clear for the ILS one five approach...
User currently offlineTod From Denmark, joined Aug 2004, 1725 posts, RR: 3
Reply 24, posted (6 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 1757 times:



Quoting SCCutler (Reply 23):
Most all GA aircraft have mufflers, they just don't do that much to "muffle."

That's a shame because after the noise nazis are done cracking down on the powerboats and dike bikes planes will follow.


25 Post contains links and images KELPkid : Don't worry, the Swiss have us covered (STC-wise). You should see some of the elaborate mufflers that common American GA planes have applied in Switz
26 Tod : Doh - dirt bikes Tod
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