Blackened From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Posted (12 years 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 4258 times:
Does anybody know what kind of manoevers there have been with big airliners maybe during test flights or airshows? I have heard somewhere that a 747 did a looping once and that another 747 broke the sound barrier in a very fast descent.
Geebar From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 7, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 5 days 5 hours ago) and read 3796 times:
I have a university lecturer that claims to have experienced barrel rolls in a 707. It was a night near Melbourne
I tend to have different thoughts about breking the sound barrier in a DC-8. We were taught that a 727 as the example that having cruise capabilities for planning purposes of Mach 0.84, even if this aircraft were put into a decent directly vertical, with all thrust levers firwalledn the aircrfat would still not break the sound barrier. This is due to the air resistance and drag created by such an aircraft. When i thought about it it made sense. Huge amounts of thrust are required to break the sound barrier (the use of afterburner and four turbojet engines along with that superaerodynamic shape for the Concorde).
Would this DC-8 still be in one piece after breking the sound barrier. The aircraft would be past the strucural limits of Vmo and Vne and i would suggest breking up in flight
This is just what i think and may not be correct. Im simply trying to give quite a valid idea and am not criticisizing anyone elses response to the question
Max Power From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 9, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 23 hours ago) and read 3776 times:
Geebar you are correct in saying you may be incorrect..Musang is correct, and yes the 727 will have no problem going sonic as you describe. Even the man that holds the longest free fall a Air force Col. forget his name went sonic when he jumped from a balloon a number of years ago from near 60,000 feet or higher. Max
Pmk From United States of America, joined May 1999, 664 posts, RR: 2 Reply 16, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 14 hours ago) and read 3729 times:
1. A 747SP during a CAT did exceed the sound barrier, however the wings were bent up at a seven degree angle. The aircraft was recertified and flew for about 5 more years. It is currently at Las Vegas, McCarran waiting to be bought.
2.The 707 and Concorde were NOT barrel rolled! A barrel is a multi G maneuver. The maneuver performed in both cases is called a schondel(sp)roll. It is a 1 G maneuver and is not damaging to an airframe if the 1G limit is not exceeded.
Geebar From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 17, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 3718 times:
Another consideration when testing these aircraft at Mach 0.99 and the like is the fact that as the airflow over the wing will have accelerated and be beyond the speed of sound bringing a shock wave and massive drag penalties into the equation. This has to do with the critical Mach number (Mcrit) for the aircraft
IndianGuy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 18, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 4 days 7 hours ago) and read 3719 times:
A 747SP of China Airlines went into a steep dive and went supersonic while on a scheduled flight into LAX. The aircraft stayed intact though the wings were badly bent, and part of the tail structure was damaged.
Musang From United Kingdom, joined Apr 2001, 795 posts, RR: 7 Reply 19, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 3703 times:
Pmk - a chandelle is a max performance climbing turn combined with a 180 degree change of direction, speed starting at Va and reducing to just above Vs when the turn is complete. (See Kershner's Advanced Pilot's Manual, fifth edition, Iowa State University Press. Page 251)
It was included in the FAA commercial pilot checkride as a co-ordination/planning exercise.
In all my years I've never heard of a "chandelle roll", as you describe it.
Can't find a definition of Barrel Roll at this moment, but all the descriptions of the Dash 80 stunt over Seattle I ever read describe it as a barrel roll, and I'm convinced it is a 1 g maneouvre if done properly.
Cedarjet From United Kingdom, joined May 1999, 7808 posts, RR: 54 Reply 21, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 3687 times:
I have seen a TV interview with the 707 test pilot who did the roll, he described it himself as a Chandelle and said it was a 1g maneouvre.
Apparently the 744 has been taken through the sound barrier in a shallow dive. Some mild vibration was noted.
A DC8 was definitely taken through the sound barrier, in a shallow dive starting at FL410. The aircraft was later delivered to a customer.
Rumour has it the 777 was rolled during test flights.
A LH crew did a roll in a 707 during pre-delivery training. Obviously lacking the skill of the Boeing test pilot above, they did it a second time and the aircraft broke up. While most of LH's training was done in Arizona, I have a feeling this accident happened over Germany. Early 60s.
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
Lapa_saab340 From Spain, joined Aug 2001, 389 posts, RR: 5 Reply 22, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 3 days 1 hour ago) and read 3664 times:
The maneuver called 'chandelle' was correctly described by Musang. Perhaps Boeing's test pilot "Tex" Johnston was also performing chandelles the day he rolled the 707 prototype, or perhaps he was referring to another flight. But the maneuver in question was a 1G roll, performed over some stadium (I forgot which now ).
Pmk From United States of America, joined May 1999, 664 posts, RR: 2 Reply 24, posted (12 years 3 months 1 week 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 3658 times:
Not to start an argument but Johnson said it was a Chandelle, even had to explain to management what he did. Bob Hoover called the same maneuver a Chandelle. Do we need to call General Yeager for a ruling?
25 Doug_or: i think we may. I have perfoemed many a chandelle, as par the instructions of my instructors and my schools specifications. Max bank angle in this man
26 Southflite: I haven't heard that LH roll-crash story before, but a Braniff B707-200 (N7071) did crash during test flights in October 1959 - not as a result of bar
27 HeavyJet: The maneuver "Tex" Johnson performed was, without a doubt, a barrel roll. In a barrel roll, the aircraft rolls around it's longitudinal axis as if it
28 EDR 374: Is it possible that a 747 did a looping? I don't think so.
29 Staffan: I've heard of a 747 in a flat spin, the tail suffered heavy damage, anyone else heard of this? Staffan
30 Lehpron: If a 747 can break the sound barrier, was it the point of the SC?
31 Musang: The famous photo taken from the Dash-80 cabin during the "maneouvre" by an engineer clearly shows that the aircraft is inverted. By definition a chand
32 BadAsses: A DC-9-21 attempted a barrel-roll on a ferry-flight once, but the pilots did a lousy job, and the contents of the lav's was splattered all over the wa
33 FBU 4EVER!: The DC-9 incident referred to,did in fact take place.However,it wasn't discovered before the QAR (Quick Access Recorder) was examined! The Captain was
34 Mac: It was a long time ago, but if my memory serves me correctly, the Boing prototype was on a promotional/public relations/demonstration flight over lak