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Runway Numbers And GPS Approaches  
User currently offlineF35 From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 65 posts, RR: 0
Posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 4341 times:

I am coming up on my checkride(tomorrow) for my instrument rating. Any help with these two questions would be amazing. Thank You in advance.

First Question: What does U mean if it follows a runway number. For example at X21(Arthur Dunn Arpk) there is a runway titled 22U.

Second Question: Because X21 is my alternate and it only has 2 GPS approaches, do I need an alternate. I know that if your primary airport only has GPS approaches you must file an alternate to another airport with an approach other than GPS. Does this apply all the time or just when weather is outside of the 1-2-3 rule/alternate requirements?

8 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineDiamondFlyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1536 posts, RR: 3
Reply 1, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 4322 times:

Quoting F35 (Thread starter):
First Question: What does U mean if it follows a runway number. For example at X21(Arthur Dunn Arpk) there is a runway titled 22U.

Its an ultralight runway. After looking in the A/FD, it says ultralight/STOL aircraft only, which is logical considering its surface and length.

Quoting F35 (Thread starter):
Second Question: Because X21 is my alternate and it only has 2 GPS approaches, do I need an alternate. I know that if your primary airport only has GPS approaches you must file an alternate to another airport with an approach other than GPS. Does this apply all the time or just when weather is outside of the 1-2-3 rule/alternate requirements?

I'd use the 1-2-3 rule to decide if I need an alternate. If it turns out you need one, you've got to pick another airport. Depending on the GPS setup you've got (TSO 129 vs 146) you might need an airport with something other than a GPS approach, or you may not. You'd also need to make sure the approach/airport you want to use as an alternate is approved as an alternate.

-DiamondFlyer


User currently offlineadipasqu From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 238 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 4313 times:

Quoting DiamondFlyer (Reply 1):
Quoting F35 (Thread starter):
First Question: What does U mean if it follows a runway number. For example at X21(Arthur Dunn Arpk) there is a runway titled 22U.

Its an ultralight runway. After looking in the A/FD, it says ultralight/STOL aircraft only, which is logical considering its surface and length.

It's also unpaved (turf).



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User currently offlineMir From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 21571 posts, RR: 55
Reply 3, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 4264 times:

Quoting F35 (Thread starter):
Second Question: Because X21 is my alternate and it only has 2 GPS approaches, do I need an alternate.

If X21 has only GPS approaches, it cannot be your alternate. Take a look at AIM 1-1-19-g (the note at the bottom). That's true whether your primary airport has only GPS approaches or not.

You'll also note that both approaches to X21 are not authorized as alternates. So you can't file that airport as an alternate (if a filed alternate is required - use the 1-2-3 rule for that). Were you instructed to use that airport as an alternate?

-Mir



7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
User currently offlineDiamondFlyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1536 posts, RR: 3
Reply 4, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 4258 times:

Quoting Mir (Reply 3):
If X21 has only GPS approaches, it cannot be your alternate. Take a look at AIM 1-1-19-g (the note at the bottom). That's true whether your primary airport has only GPS approaches or not.

Not always. If your equipped with a TSO 146 GPS, it is possible to use a field with GPS only as an alternate, as it is possible to operate in the IFR environment with nothing more than a GPS receiver for navigation.

-DiamondFlyer


User currently offlineF35 From United States of America, joined Dec 2008, 65 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 12 hours ago) and read 4231 times:

Sorry for the confusion. I meant to ask "Because X21 is my destination, and it only has GPS approaches and the aircraft i am flying does not have WAAS, do i need an alternate?" I believe no is the answer but am not confident in my answer.

User currently offlineN353SK From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 821 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 4215 times:

You've been studying too much lately and all the rules are blending together.

If your destination has an IAP you don't need to file an alternate unless the destination's weather doesn't satisfy the 1-2-3 rule.


User currently offlineIAHFLYR From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 4790 posts, RR: 22
Reply 7, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 5 days 11 hours ago) and read 4201 times:

Just stop!!!!!!!!!!!!! Rely on your training and what you have studied.

Get your flight plan, check the weather and NOTAM issues, file the flight plan that you know how to file, and pre-flight the aircraft......AND BE COMFORTABLE.

Be confident in your knowledge and training.

DONE!  



Any views shared are strictly my own and do not a represent those of any former employer.
User currently offlinehighflyer9790 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 1241 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (4 years 1 month 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 3951 times:

Quoting F35 (Reply 5):
Sorry for the confusion. I meant to ask "Because X21 is my destination, and it only has GPS approaches and the aircraft i am flying does not have WAAS, do i need an alternate?" I believe no is the answer but am not confident in my answer

IF the 1-2-3 rule indicates you need an alternate, and you have looked at whether or not there are alternate minimums, (found on the approach plates with an "A" in a black triangle) then YES, you NEED an alternate with an approach other than GPS. the alternate can have a GPS approach, however it must have another type of approach as well such as a VOR or ILS. You answered the first half of your question when you said you are not WAAS capable, otherwise your alternate could have a WAAS approach and youd be fine.

If you weather is above the 1-2-3 rule, you technically only need an alternate if the airport has no published IAP.



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