AKiss20 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 529 posts, RR: 0 Posted (2 years 10 months 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 2227 times:
Hello all,
I have a quick question. The master switch in the 1966 C150 my club owns is a bit flaky in that it is hard to get it to actually kick on. Once it gets started, however, it runs perfectly. They are planning on replacing the switch this weekend, but I was hoping to do a flight today. My father suggested that we leave the master on while we refuel (we would obviously turn avionics off and of course be grounded using a grounding cable). My question for your collective intelligence is whether refueling with the master on but the aircraft grounded presents any risks? Is there something specific we should to do increase safety?
We really don't want to turn the master off to avoid the risk of getting stranded.
Thanks in advance
Change will not come if we wait for some other person or some other time. We are the ones we've been waiting for. We are
Having dealt with electrical smoke in the cockpit, my philosophy is - if there is any doubt, there is no doubt. Wait until the switch is replaced before flying it.
xero9 From Canada, joined Feb 2007, 148 posts, RR: 0 Reply 2, posted (2 years 10 months 22 hours ago) and read 2140 times:
My own personal opinion is I don't think it poses a risk. With that said, this is an uneducated answer, and I personally wouldn't do it myself.
I would either:
1) Not fly
2) Keep it a shorter flight that doesn't require refueling
3) Switch the master of when I went to refuel, hoping it turned back on.
DiamondFlyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1294 posts, RR: 3 Reply 4, posted (2 years 10 months 21 hours ago) and read 2119 times:
Quoting zeke (Reply 3): Write up the faulty switch so the aircraft is grounded and fly after it has been fixed.
I'd almost bet that the mechanic would get the plane, flip the switch, and it would work. Mechanic would then return the plane to service, having done nothing. That said, a switch is cheap, and should be easy to fix. Would I fly it once as it is, maybe. Would I keep doing it, no.
zeke From Hong Kong, joined Dec 2006, 7725 posts, RR: 73 Reply 5, posted (2 years 10 months 20 hours ago) and read 2087 times:
Quoting DiamondFlyer (Reply 4):
I'd almost bet that the mechanic would get the plane, flip the switch, and it would work. Mechanic would then return the plane to service, having done nothing.
I do not think so, if they are planning on replacing the switch anyway, in my experience, the would just get on and get the job done. The paperwork would look very silly if it was auditied to should that it was writted up, tested, nil fault found, returned to service, only to have it replaced withtin a few days.
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
DiamondFlyer From United States of America, joined Oct 2008, 1294 posts, RR: 3 Reply 6, posted (2 years 10 months 20 hours ago) and read 2084 times:
Quoting zeke (Reply 5): I do not think so, if they are planning on replacing the switch anyway, in my experience, the would just get on and get the job done. The paperwork would look very silly if it was auditied to should that it was writted up, tested, nil fault found, returned to service, only to have it replaced withtin a few days.
That's very true. But honestly, if the plane shows up to an A&P, and they test the switch and it works repeatedly, why fix it? Perhaps the switch contacts just need cleaned. The first thing to try isn't just fixing the switch.
AKiss20 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 529 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (2 years 10 months 18 hours ago) and read 2056 times:
Hello all,
Thanks for the advice. Ultimately I have decided to knix the flight as the master switch worried me. Shame to waste this weather but such is life I suppose.
Change will not come if we wait for some other person or some other time. We are the ones we've been waiting for. We are
Goldenshield From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 5443 posts, RR: 12 Reply 11, posted (2 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day ago) and read 1761 times:
I'd be more concerned with the engine starter turning accidentally. Granted, it shouldn't turn without the key turned to that position, but short circuits can and do happen.
Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
AKiss20 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 529 posts, RR: 0 Reply 12, posted (2 years 9 months 4 weeks 1 day ago) and read 1758 times:
Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 11): I'd be more concerned with the engine starter turning accidentally. Granted, it shouldn't turn without the key turned to that position, but short circuits can and do happen.
Actually with this old a C150 (1966) the starter isn't linked in with the ignition through the key. It is a completely separate circuit and has a pull handle (which ironically snapped when I was starting it up at KMSV, had to fly a guy up who knew how to handprop it because I sure as hell wasn't going to do it), so that wouldn't be a problem.
Switch is being installed saturday, hopefully it should be good to go so I can make this flight that has been put off 4 times already! Hamilton or bust
Change will not come if we wait for some other person or some other time. We are the ones we've been waiting for. We are
SEPilot From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 6258 posts, RR: 39 Reply 13, posted (2 years 9 months 4 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 1739 times:
Quoting AKiss20 (Thread starter): My father suggested that we leave the master on while we refuel (we would obviously turn avionics off and of course be grounded using a grounding cable).
A bit late to this discussion, but my . To fly safely, one must have lines one NEVER crosses. Refuelling with the master on, even though the danger is remote, is on my list. Others involve weather and mechanical ailments. Some are obvious, some are for each pilot to decide what risk he or she is comfortable with, but each pilot must make his own list AND STICK TO IT. Most of the ones who end up dead have not done this.
The problem with making things foolproof is that fools are so doggone ingenious...Dan Keebler
jetstar From United States of America, joined May 2003, 1524 posts, RR: 10 Reply 14, posted (2 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 1578 times:
As an A&P mechanic and an owner of a 1964 Cessna 150, I personally would not leave the master on when refueling, although the odds are real small that anything would happen Its just not a safe procedure.
The master switch is a sealed unit, so the contacts cannot be cleaned.
My airplane also has the mechanical pull starter and I also have had the cable break on me on more than one occasion, that’s why I carried a small toolbox in the airplane.,
As for hand propping an airplane, don’t do it unless you have experience in doing it, I have hand propped my airplane a few times because of a dead battery, but because I know what I am doing, I have no problem with it. Many years ago a friend of mine had a J3 Cub, and hand propping was the only whey you started the engine because the J3 had no electrical system, so I got the experience hand propping when we would go out flying together.
Every so often when I was working as a mechanic at an FBO, we would have someone come in who had a dead battery because they left the battery switch on overnight, and asked if someone would hand prop their airplane, I never would, I would tell them I would sit in the cockpit and they could hand prop their airplane, which no one ever took my offer. So it was either buy a new battery or wait an hour or so and we would charge up the battery for them.
AKiss20 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 529 posts, RR: 0 Reply 15, posted (2 years 9 months 3 weeks 5 days 19 hours ago) and read 1556 times:
Quoting jetstar (Reply 14):
As for hand propping an airplane, don’t do it unless you have experience in doing it, I have hand propped my airplane a few times because of a dead battery, but because I know what I am doing, I have no problem with it. Many years ago a friend of mine had a J3 Cub, and hand propping was the only whey you started the engine because the J3 had no electrical system, so I got the experience hand propping when we would go out flying together.
That is exactly why we spent the 250 odd bucks to fly up a guy who know what the heck he was doing to handprop. Even if I was taught how to do it, I would be very wary of trying it. I dont like getting anywhere near a propeller when it is spinning (I am even squirrely about getting out with the motor running, i'd sooner just shut it down before getting out)
Change will not come if we wait for some other person or some other time. We are the ones we've been waiting for. We are
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. To fly safely, one must have lines one NEVER crosses. Refuelling with the master on, even though the danger is remote, is on my list. Others involve weather and mechanical ailments. Some are obvious, some are for each pilot to decide what risk he or she is comfortable with, but each pilot must make his own list AND STICK TO IT. Most of the ones who end up dead have not done this.
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