Goblin211 From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1209 posts, RR: 0 Posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 9475 times:
Who comes up with the call signs for airlines in the first place? And in the case of UA/CO or now officially united, what will the call sign be? Just united, or some random name? For example, US airways is Cactus.
DeltaRules From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3623 posts, RR: 11 Reply 1, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 9459 times:
US' callsign isn't exactly random, as there's a story behind it. Cactus was America West's callsign & remained the callsign for US after the two merged. Even though the US name survived, there's still a tip of the hat to HP on the radio.
Goblin211 From United States of America, joined Jun 2010, 1209 posts, RR: 0 Reply 3, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 9419 times:
Yes but will United's call sign remain United or will they use Continental?
B6JFKH81 From United States of America, joined Mar 2006, 2767 posts, RR: 7 Reply 4, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 14 hours ago) and read 9374 times:
Quoting Goblin211 (Thread starter): Who comes up with the call signs for airlines in the first place?
There are parameters and rules that need to be followed when creating your call signs (radiotelephony designators) and 2 and 3 letter identifiers. I remember having to do the research when the college I attended got their new fleet of planes and the tail numbers were in complete numerical order and were going to cause confusion in the local tower. So I did the research to file the request for official raiotelephony designators from the FAA, with the guidance of the tower manager at FRG and the (at the time) Regional Administrator of the FAA Arlene Feldman. Unlike the airlines, the call sign "flight number" was directly attached to the tail number, and the "flight numbers" were also sorted out to help identify the aircraft type (for example, the new Warriors that the college bought all were batched together based on the last number in their tail number and that was doubled...so when you heard Farmingdale State 33 or 44 or 55, etc., it was a Warrior.). It is kinda cool to think a student can now fly anywhere around the country and use that call sign LOL. But anyway, the rules dictate how many syllables the call sign can be, its relevance to the airline, how close it can sound to another airlines call sign, how easy it is to pronounce, etc.
I can't go digging through the internet right now since I am at work, but on the FAA's site and IATA's site I am sure you can bring up the actual regulations for it. My primary research (since my college isn't crossing any international borders) was through the FAA and was on an advisory circular which laid everything out.
~H81
"If you do not learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it"
timf From United States of America, joined Mar 2003, 954 posts, RR: 1 Reply 5, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 11 hours ago) and read 9160 times:
Quoting qb737 (Reply 2): US Airways even use "AWE" as their ICAO code.
This was not intentional. They had planned on keeping USA as their ICAO code, but it was confusing too many controllers so they opted to switch back to AWE since that was associated with the "Cactus" callsign.
AirFrance744 From United States of America, joined Aug 2009, 76 posts, RR: 0 Reply 7, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 8482 times:
Quoting B6JFKH81 (Reply 4): ut anyway, the rules dictate how many syllables the call sign can be, its relevance to the airline, how close it can sound to another airlines call sign, how easy it is to pronounce, etc.
Then why is FL "Citrus". Because they have a hub at MCO which is in Florida?
kbpilot5 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 192 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 8345 times:
GoJet's callsign used to be "Gateway" (which I really liked) but they either had to or willingly changed it because it was easily confused with "Getaway" which is USA 3000.
Quoting AirFrance744 (Reply 7): Then why is FL "Citrus". Because they have a hub at MCO which is in Florida?
Just a guess, but I would think it's because ATA Airlines callsign was "Amtran" which could be confused with "Airtran" over the radios. But again I don't know for sure on this.
amwest2united From United States of America, joined Jun 2006, 378 posts, RR: 0 Reply 9, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 4 hours ago) and read 8261 times:
Quoting mcdu (Reply 6): It will be United for the call sign for all flights once the company achieves SOC.
Really, Where did you get that info?
We are going to use Continental's operating certificate and United's Repair Station certificate.
Life is what happens to you while you making plans to live it!
JBirdAV8r From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 4459 posts, RR: 22 Reply 10, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks 1 hour ago) and read 7299 times:
Quoting amwest2united (Reply 9): We are going to use Continental's operating certificate
Acquisition of a particular operating certificate doesn't mean you have to adopt a particular callsign.
FlyDeltaJets87 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 11, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks ago) and read 7296 times:
Quoting kbpilot5 (Reply 8): Quoting AirFrance744 (Reply 7):
Then why is FL "Citrus". Because they have a hub at MCO which is in Florida?
Just a guess, but I would think it's because ATA Airlines callsign was "Amtran" which could be confused with "Airtran" over the radios. But again I don't know for sure on this.
I think it has to do with FL Headquarters being in Florida (even though their largest hub is ATL).
FX1816 From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1400 posts, RR: 5 Reply 12, posted (2 years 7 months 3 weeks ago) and read 7156 times:
Quoting amwest2united (Reply 9): Quoting mcdu (Reply 6):
It will be United for the call sign for all flights once the company achieves SOC.
Really, Where did you get that info?
Why would it not be United I mean Northwest became Delta and even changed the to the DAL ICAO. If the planes say United I doubt it would be any different than UAL and "United" call sign.
BMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 14316 posts, RR: 26 Reply 13, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 6962 times:
Quoting kbpilot5 (Reply 8): GoJet's callsign used to be "Gateway" (which I really liked) but they either had to or willingly changed it because it was easily confused with "Getaway" which is USA 3000.
Lindbergh is cooler anyway. I think that the Mercury callsign for Shuttle America is a good one too. My guess is that they couldn't use one with shuttle in it because of Mesa.
Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
Antoniemey From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 1504 posts, RR: 4 Reply 14, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 6888 times:
Quoting FX1816 (Reply 12): Why would it not be United I mean Northwest became Delta and even changed the to the DAL ICAO. If the planes say United I doubt it would be any different than UAL and "United" call sign.
I could see if CO had a catchy callsign that wasn't the airline's name keeping that, but they don't, so it will be United.
The other option is Air Mike, which doesn't really make sense for the callsign of a global carrier.
Make something Idiot-proof, and the Universe will make a more inept idiot.
ThirtyEcho From United States of America, joined Dec 2001, 1634 posts, RR: 1 Reply 16, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 6455 times:
A lot of the time, it has to do with whatever thingy they paint on the vertical stabilizer that then sticks with them for decades. Remember "Widget"?
USAir330 From United States of America, joined Mar 2002, 788 posts, RR: 1 Reply 17, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 6297 times:
Quoting cyxuk (Reply 15): Does anyone know the origin of the "Speedbird" callsign for BA?
Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the call sign "Speedbird" comes from the merger with BOAC.
planesmith From United Kingdom, joined Jun 2009, 139 posts, RR: 0 Reply 19, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 6 days 21 hours ago) and read 6182 times:
Quoting cyxuk (Reply 15): Does anyone know the origin of the "Speedbird" callsign for BA?
BOAC's aircraft and paperwork carried the "speedbird" logo for many, many years, pictures of the flying boats show it being used, and that continued after the merger with BEA, the new airline, British Airways simply couldn't drop such a brilliant callsign...
flyingalex From Germany, joined Jul 2010, 997 posts, RR: 1 Reply 20, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 5687 times:
Quoting Airvan00 (Reply 18):
I think it dates back a lot longer than that, the speedbird logo has been used since 1932 and has always been used in ATC communications.
One of my favourite callsigns is "Stardust", which is XL Airways Germany. They started life as a subsidiary of the British XL Group, and operated under the name Star XL for the first few years.
Oh, and a good one that is sadly no longer with us: SkyEurope used the callsign "Relax".
Public service announcement: "It's" = "it is". To indicate posession, write "its." Looks wrong, but it's correct grammar
skymiler From United States of America, joined Aug 2007, 469 posts, RR: 0 Reply 21, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 5264 times:
Pan Am was "Clipper" ..... a nod to the flying boats
71Zulu From United States of America, joined Aug 2006, 2736 posts, RR: 0 Reply 22, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 6 days 17 hours ago) and read 5126 times:
Quoting FX1816 (Reply 12): If the planes say United I doubt it would be any different than UAL and "United" call sign.
The company has said they will use the CO op certificate so the post merger call sign might indeed be "Continental". Really won't be a big deal as many airliners have a call sign different from what is painted on the side of the plane.
mcdu From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 1275 posts, RR: 17 Reply 23, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 4619 times:
Quoting amwest2united (Reply 9): We are going to use Continental's operating certificate and United's Repair Station certificate.
Hate be harsh but we have beaten this horse to death in previous threads. The operating certificate is the NOT the call sign. It is the book of allowable rules for operating the flights. CO flies ETOPS on the 737 and a few other approach and operational changes that would have required the UAL certificate to gain approval for the modifications. The easier path was to adopt the CO certificate as far as the FAA was concerned. This is does not affect the call sign.
26point2 From United States of America, joined Mar 2010, 665 posts, RR: 0 Reply 24, posted (2 years 7 months 2 weeks 6 days 15 hours ago) and read 4443 times:
I remember "Gopher"? Perhaps from Minnesota?
Clever using a ground burrowing rodent as an airline callsign.
25 einsteinboricua: It would seem really strange calling United flights "Continental" on the ATC. Though call signs are indeed different they don't use the name of an ai
26 1stfl94: Is British Airways the only carrier to have more than one callsign? They have Speedbird as their main one, Shuttle for UK domestic flights and Santa f
27 xtoler: I always liked Waterski. No offense to the Lindberghs, even though I thought Gateway was pretty good. Either way it's a nod to STL. Some of these call
28 SSTsomeday: Canadian Airlines, originally C.P. Air and Candian Pacific AIrlines, used the call sign "Empress" which, as a boy, I thought was cool since "Air Canad
30 ktrick45: And I remember hearing that this was because "Pan Am" sounded too much like "Panpan" on the radio.
31 BMI727: American carriers will sometimes fly charters for DoD under the AMC "Reach" callsign. Also, a civil flight with the President or the President's fami
32 nra-3b: I always liked China Airlines "Dynasty" callsign. Also from the the same era, Civil Air Transport (CAT) used "Mandarin". Cheers, Bob
33 EHAM: Amsterdam Airlines (AAN) uses the callsign 'Amstel', always reminds me of a nice cold beer
34 FX1816: Well being an ATC I'm pretty familiar with the different call sign's however I seriously doubt that they will keep the call sign Continental because
35 noelg: Speedbird is from the old BOAC logo and refers to the bird on the logo. Citrus (and code FL) refer to the fact AirTran originally were based in and ar
36 doug_Or: That is the case, after Shuttle America began flying all over the US (as opposed to their old NE stomping grounds) they changed because shuttlecraft
37 Viscount724: Not entirely correct. CP Air (legal name Canadian Pacific Air Lines) used the callsign Empress. When Canadian Airlines was created when regional carr
38 SSTsomeday: I'm not sure if I agree with this protocol. If I was a pilot looking for traffic, and it was designated "Speedbird," then I would be looking for an A
39 RobK: Reach callsign has been dead for some time on the CRAF aircraft. They use Camber these days.
40 ORDFan: Anyone know of any other callsigns that haven't been listed? A few airlines seem like they could use them: Lufthansa, Singapore, Aerolineas? Continent
41 etherealsky: 'Brickyard' is Republic's callsign. (Reference to the Indianapolis Motor Speedway) A fair point, but it's been my experience that ATC usually goes by
42 CPH-R: Not to mention "Executive Eagle" for the ATR72 ops out of SJU. Or was that just a 'paper callsign'?
43 faro: "Kestrel" and "trojan" were previously used by the old British Airtours. Don't know if this continued with their transformation into MyTravel and subs
44 BMIFlyer: Mytravel continued with Kestrel yes. Thomas cook was TopJet, but is now Kestrel
45 opso1: One Harrier Squadron I was on toyed with the idea of "Upper" for a while- it made for an interesting frequency check-in for a 2 ship formation : "Uppe
46 oly720man: Air 2000 used to have "Air 2000" as the callsign but it soon became apparent that the number could cause problems so they hit upon "Jetset".
47 pilotpip: We were also "crossroads" for about a day and a half (literally). They changed that one because it sounded similiar to a 135 operator or something. I
48 calpilot: In case you haven't got the word in the last 5days; yes we are using United callsign. You can reference the flight ops bulletin post transaction.
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