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Stretching The AN-225. HOW?  
User currently offlinespantax From Belgium, joined Nov 2004, 323 posts, RR: 1
Posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 2 days 5 hours ago) and read 4734 times:

Just a theoretical exercise:

1. Forget about any kind "87 x 84 box" or whatever limitation
2. Use only real/existing components
3. But you can modify wing and/or engines or ad engines
4. Forget about economics, of course

Would it be possible a sort of An-225 with 750-800 t/MTOW "just" by adding a couple of sections 6-7 meters long fore and aft the wing and with new engines? How long can the fuselage be stretched before it relly breaks down?

Engineers warmly welcome!


A300.10.19.20.21.30.40,AN26,ATR42,AVR146,B717.27.37.47.57.77,B1900,C130,C212,CH47,CRJ200.700,DC9,DHC4,ERJ135.190,F27
12 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineWingscrubber From UK - England, joined Sep 2001, 848 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 4508 times:

The stretch could be easily achieved with the addition of a lifting canard and tail to alleviate bending loads...

With runways and infrastructure being the key limiting factor for very large aircraft, the sea presents itself as a potential solution. The Beriev Be-2500 is worth a look.

http://www.beriev.com/eng/Be-2500_e/Be-2500_e.html



Resident TechOps Troll
User currently offlineetherealsky From United States of America, joined Apr 2010, 328 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 4498 times:

Quoting Wingscrubber (Reply 1):

Does a seaplane require larger engines than an wheeled equivalent? I would think more thrust would be needed for T/O & landing to overcome water resistance?



"And that's why you always leave a note..."
User currently offlinecanoecarrier From United States of America, joined Feb 2004, 2839 posts, RR: 12
Reply 3, posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 4492 times:

Quoting Wingscrubber (Reply 1):
With runways and infrastructure being the key limiting factor for very large aircraft, the sea presents itself as a potential solution.

Welcome to the thread Mr. Hughes.



The beatings will continue until morale improves
User currently offlineglen From Switzerland, joined Jun 2005, 224 posts, RR: 2
Reply 4, posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 4490 times:

Quoting spantax (Thread starter):
Would it be possible a sort of An-225 with 750-800 t/MTOW "just" by adding a couple of sections 6-7 meters long fore and aft the wing and with new engines?

Increasing the size (length) of an aircraft does not help to increase its MTOW. It only helps to increase the possible volume to be loaded.
To increase the MTOW you need to increase thrust (you mentioned engines) and lift (higher speeds or different wing). Besides this you have to strengthen the structure, especially wing and its fixation and the gear (which is already quite impressive on the AN-225!)



"The horizon of many people is a circle with zero radius which they call their point of view." - Albert Einstein
User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 17039 posts, RR: 66
Reply 5, posted (3 years 4 months 3 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 4370 times:

Quoting etherealsky (Reply 2):
Quoting Wingscrubber (Reply 1):

Does a seaplane require larger engines than an wheeled equivalent? I would think more thrust would be needed for T/O & landing to overcome water resistance?

Yes. That's why many larger ekranoplans have several engines used just for take-off. For example the Caspian Sea Monster. I believer the front eight were used for take-off and the aft two for cruise.




"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlinemanzoori From UK - England, joined Sep 2002, 1516 posts, RR: 33
Reply 6, posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 4 days 2 hours ago) and read 3922 times:

Something like this perhaps?

Aviation-Design.Net:
Click here for bigger photo!
Design © Rez Manzoori
Template © Olaf Jurgensmeier



  

Rez



Flightlineimages DOT Com Photographer & Web Editor. RR Turbines Specialist
User currently offlinespantax From Belgium, joined Nov 2004, 323 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 3 days 6 hours ago) and read 3741 times:

Hi, Thank you to all for your wise (as always) comments, and specially to Rez, who catched really my thoughts with his design (although he forgot the canard mentioned by Wingscrubber....   ). In any case, let's hope that sometime/somehow the second AN-225 will be completed and will fly and be admired as it deserves.

Regards,



A300.10.19.20.21.30.40,AN26,ATR42,AVR146,B717.27.37.47.57.77,B1900,C130,C212,CH47,CRJ200.700,DC9,DHC4,ERJ135.190,F27
User currently offlineWingscrubber From UK - England, joined Sep 2001, 848 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 3517 times:

Rez - only 8 engines? Here's another, but I can't take credit for it.

http://www.cardatabase.net/modifieda...earch/photo_search.php?id=00000367



Resident TechOps Troll
User currently offlinemanzoori From UK - England, joined Sep 2002, 1516 posts, RR: 33
Reply 9, posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 3509 times:

Oh come on... now we're just being plain silly!  

Rez



Flightlineimages DOT Com Photographer & Web Editor. RR Turbines Specialist
User currently offlineSchorschNG From Germany, joined Sep 2010, 500 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 3177 times:

The key issue isn't length but width and height. Lengthening the aircraft will not make it more attractive.
The loading options are severely limited anyways.
There is simply no point ...

If you want to have a huge aircraft, I would think what you can do on A380 basis (thinking for a moment that you can Beluga-rize the fuselage, meaning everything over the wing box is free for change).



From a structural standpoint, passengers are the worst possible payload. [Michael Chun-Yung Niu]
User currently offlinebond007 From United States of America, joined Mar 2005, 5417 posts, RR: 8
Reply 11, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3156 times:

I guess the big question, is why? Is there a market for it?

It would seem there isn't much market, else we'd see the other AN225 being finished and more on the way.

Companies are building equipment to fit the available freighters, not the other way round. Everything shipped in the AN225 could have been broken down into smaller pieces and/or shipped another method (albeit more expensive perhaps).

If the costs of building them could be justified, we'd have more than one flying.

Jimbo



I'd rather be on the ground wishing I was in the air, than in the air wishing I was on the ground!
User currently offlinefuelfool From United States of America, joined Feb 2011, 138 posts, RR: 0
Reply 12, posted (3 years 4 months 1 week 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 3113 times:

Quoting bond007 (Reply 11):

Totally agree. The AN-225 is a one off plane. It was designed and built to haul something that doesn't exist, anymore. Why would they make a bigger one, when they have not built another like the original?



I love the smell of jet fuel in the morning...Smells like victory!
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