cvbcbcmv From United States of America, joined Jun 2011, 4 posts, RR: 0 Posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 3 days 16 hours ago) and read 3667 times:
So, a pilot is taking off. How does he know when v1 is? I know what v1 is, but how would the pilot know when it is? Also, for example, if your on a really long runway, and doing a lightweight takeoff, would it be possible to takeoff before hitting v1?
longhauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4281 posts, RR: 36 Reply 2, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 3625 times:
On older aircraft, a take-off chit is made up and displayed.
On newer aircraft, it is entered into the FMS and will be displayed on the digital airspeed indicator.
Depending on the airline's SOPs, the PNF will call V1 during the take-off roll.
Quoting cvbcbcmv (Thread starter): Also, for example, if your on a really long runway, and doing a lightweight takeoff, would it be possible to takeoff before hitting v1?
No, when the runway length is not limiting, V1 will be the same as Vr. (this is entering into a grey area, as because V1 is the same as Vr for the take-off, theoretically the aircraft will still have room to stop after V1/Vr)
Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
cvbcbcmv From United States of America, joined Jun 2011, 4 posts, RR: 0 Reply 3, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 3 days 15 hours ago) and read 3616 times:
Thanks for the answers guys. And sorry if I posted in the wrong place, I'm new here. Before I spent a long time typing out a long version of this question, when it told me I had to buy a premium membership. I figured I'd just buy a first class membership since I'll be spending a lot of time here. I wasn't used to having to pay, I'm a moderator over on a high powered laser forum and it's free lol. Lol high powered lasers and planes are my hobby, kind of weird. Don't worry, I don't point lasers at planes. You spend time on my forum and you will learn that very quickly.I will do so illegal things to people who point lasers at planes.
FlyASAGuy2005 From United States of America, joined Sep 2007, 6520 posts, RR: 11 Reply 4, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 2 days 6 hours ago) and read 3218 times:
Quoting longhauler (Reply 2): No, when the runway length is not limiting, V1 will be the same as Vr. (this is entering into a grey area, as because V1 is the same as Vr for the take-off, theoretically the aircraft will still have room to stop after V1/Vr)
I see that a lot with the CR7s and CR9s. V1 and VR is many times withing 1 or 2 knots of each other, if not the same. I don't know why that is though.
CAM2:"Lightning coming out of that one." CAM1: "What?"
jetpilot From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3130 posts, RR: 32 Reply 6, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3177 times:
tb727 From United States of America, joined Jun 2005, 1375 posts, RR: 4 Reply 7, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3147 times:
It's when the other guy says "V1" of course.
Quoting jetpilot (Reply 6): In the 727 V1/VR are always the same speed.
I want to say I saw a split V1/VR only once on the 727 a few months back, I can not however remember why we did it, or really if we did it, I vaguely remember asking why because I had never seen it. Never mind, I can't remember lol.
jetpilot From United States of America, joined May 1999, 3130 posts, RR: 32 Reply 8, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 3141 times:
I think on the rare occasion of an unbalanced field V1 and VR can be different. But I have never experienced an unbalanced field TO in a 727.
longhauler From Canada, joined Mar 2004, 4281 posts, RR: 36 Reply 9, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 3134 times:
Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 4): I see that a lot with the CR7s and CR9s. V1 and VR is many times withing 1 or 2 knots of each other, if not the same. I don't know why that is though.
If you work it backward, start with V2 ... your safe climb out speed on one engine, under the conditions you are presently flying. Now, think about at what speed do you need to rotate so your initial climb speed is V2 ... that will be Vr. Clear enough so far. Vr and V2 are related to altitude/obstacle/ climb performance.
As you know though, V1 is a ground performance speed. Maximum speed at which a rejected take-off is possible, and (likely) stay within the confines of the runway.
But ... what is the airplane is very light, or the runway is very long? It is very possible that V1, could be higher than V2, and thus Vr. But that can never be, obviously, so V1 is set to the same as Vr. But as pilots we know that when V1 and Vr are the same, the aircraft could conceivably stop on the runway from a speed higher than V1.
Now, we would never do that. Mostly because we don't know how far above V1/Vr the aircraft could be stopped. But it gives one an "impression" the aircraft ground performance capability exceeds current conditions. Conversely, think about a contaminated short runway, in a heavy aircraft, and V1 is far lower than Vr. You then know that aircraft ground performance only equals current conditions.
Never gonna grow up, never gonna slow down .... Barefoot Blue Jean Night
113312 From United States of America, joined Apr 2005, 537 posts, RR: 1 Reply 10, posted (1 year 11 months 1 week 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 3134 times:
Firstly, in many planes such as the 727, V1=VR in most but not all cases. An example of a V1 prior to VR will be contaminated runway.
V1 is a decision speed based upon indicated airspeed. There can be a V1 based upon rejecting a takeoff and stopping and a different V1 for electing to continue a takeoff after an engine failure and being able to achieve the minimum required climb gradient. While these two considerations might result in a different V1 for each, the most restrictive is used for the point where the decision must be made and action taken.
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