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Pilot Requirement For Charters?  
User currently offlineairtechy From United States of America, joined Dec 2006, 520 posts, RR: 0
Posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 14 hours ago) and read 3922 times:

What are the experience requirements....if any..... for pilots to fly charters into airports that the carrier doesn't normally fly into? Let's say I wanted to charter Delta to fly a group of skin divers into Pago Pago for lack of a better example. Would one of the pilots have to have flown into the airport without passengers before?

9 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineflymia From United States of America, joined Jun 2001, 7279 posts, RR: 6
Reply 1, posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 3877 times:

Quoting airtechy (Thread starter):
Would one of the pilots have to have flown into the airport without passengers before?

No, I am not certain but I highly doubt it. That is what all the charts are for anyway. An experienced airline pilot should have no problem flying into a new airport. Maybe need some extra time taxing the plane and look over procedures and charts more carefully but I do not know of any requriements.



"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
User currently offlinemaxpower1954 From United States of America, joined Sep 2008, 1159 posts, RR: 7
Reply 2, posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 3770 times:

No extra qualifications are required to operate a charter, if the airport meets all FAR 121 specs, at least for U.S. carriers.

Last fall, I was offered a trip to fly the Carolina Panthers into Cleveland Lakefront Airport, which I've never seen in my life, in a Airbus 321. The runway is short, the weather wasn't great and an easy trip to San Juan was also available so I took that one. I must be getting old (plus SJU paid quite a bit more!)


User currently offlineBMI727 From United States of America, joined Feb 2009, 15831 posts, RR: 27
Reply 3, posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 3764 times:

Quoting airtechy (Thread starter):
What are the experience requirements....if any..... for pilots to fly charters into airports that the carrier doesn't normally fly into?

In almost all cases, none. Some airports might be designated by airlines as "captains only" but that is up to them and not regulating bodies.

Quoting airtechy (Thread starter):
Would one of the pilots have to have flown into the airport without passengers before?

I vaguely recall a reference to something like that somewhere, but suffice to say, such airports are extremely few and far between.



Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
User currently offlinemaxpower1954 From United States of America, joined Sep 2008, 1159 posts, RR: 7
Reply 4, posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 3725 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 3):
I vaguely recall a reference to something like that somewhere, but suffice to say, such airports are extremely few and far between.

That's something I've never heard before, and hardly seems practical. If I flew my 1957 Cessna 172 into such an airport, would that count?


User currently offlineHNLPointShoot From United States of America, joined Feb 2007, 322 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 11 hours ago) and read 3695 times:

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 3):
I vaguely recall a reference to something like that somewhere, but suffice to say, such airports are extremely few and far between.

I think that's an internal procedure certain airlines have for airports with unusual conditions such as SAN, TGU, and FNC.


User currently offlinetheginge From United Kingdom, joined Oct 2006, 1136 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3591 times:

For one off charters to 'difficult' airports the pilots might go in to the simulator to review the approach but I very much doubt they would take an empty aircraft there to practice.

User currently offlineBellerophon From United Kingdom, joined May 2002, 585 posts, RR: 59
Reply 7, posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 3535 times:

airtechy

...What are the experience requirements....if any..... for pilots to fly charters into airports that the carrier doesn't normally fly into?...

There are in fact some airfields, around the world, where special restrictions, imposed by the civil aviation authority of the state in which that airfield is situated, apply.

These airfields may be relatively few in number but they do exist and the restrictions imposed by the state apply to anyone operating in and out of that airfield. In my (very limited) experience, such conditions are generally imposed for two reasons:

Firstly because of the existence of some particularly difficult or dangerous local factors which may affect the approach, landing, or go-around. These factors could include a curved final approach path, prohibited airspace very close to the runway, very short, very steep, very slippery runways, very high altitude airfields, lack of any over-run or undershoot area, high terrain very close to the airfield or approach path or dangerous local wind conditions.

Secondly because the state involved became fed up with having a few pilots who, despite being provided with briefing documents for that airfield, still remained rather complacent or unaware about the gravity of the particular problems at that airfield and who then caused problems by messing up badly - sometimes fatally - on arrival.

One such restricted airfield is Madeira (LPMA) where the Portuguese civil aviation authority impose conditions - and monitor compliance - on anyone operating in there in an aircraft capable of carrying more than 10 passengers.

Very broadly, amongst the Portuguese requirements for a Captain to operate into LPMA are:
  • * Completion of a Portuguese CAA approved initial training course.

  • * 200 hrs P1 on the aircraft type concerned.

  • * One T/O and LDG there in the last six months.
Interestingly, for Madeira, the Captain's approval to operate there is aircraft type specific, so an approved Captain who later changes to another aircraft type loses approval and must regain approval on the new aircraft type by satisfying the initial training requirements again.

Finally, don't forget that there are many airfields that will not allow a particular aircraft type to operate there (as I repeatedly found out some years ago   ) so whenever operating to a new destination it is always prudent to look at the National or State documentation for the airfield concerned, as well as that airfield's own local regulations, before setting off.

Something that charter pilots, particularly those who fly internationally - and who fly to new destinations much more frequently than I ever did as pilot with a scheduled airline - are actually well aware off.


Best regards

Bellerophon


User currently offlineNorthwest727 From United States of America, joined Jul 2005, 491 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 21 hours ago) and read 3351 times:

On a side note, are charters that are operated by a normal 121 carrier (using the OP's example, Delta) still operating under 121 rules? Or are they now a 135 operation, since it is a non-scheduled charter to an airport they may normally not fly into?

User currently offlineMaverick623 From United States of America, joined Nov 2006, 5736 posts, RR: 6
Reply 9, posted (3 years 4 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 3338 times:

Quoting Northwest727 (Reply 8):
On a side note, are charters that are operated by a normal 121 carrier (using the OP's example, Delta) still operating under 121 rules?

Yes.



"PHX is Phoenix, PDX is the other city" -777Way
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