How do they get this plane back on the runway?. Is this the kind of push and pull work you see when someone tries to get a car out of the snow or mud. you know with the timber planks and branches. OK forget about the passengers pushing the plane. I am not in the mood today to give O'Leeary fresh ideas .
I'd figure just using a tug could damage the landing gear. Right?
Starlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 16719 posts, RR: 66
Reply 1, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 5893 times:
I guess it depends on the circumstances. I can imagine a few basic methods that can be combined.
- If it's just sitting there and has not sunk in, carefully check the terrain, then tow or power out.
- If it has sunk into soft ground, dig trenches for the gear and reinforce with wood or metal planks, then tow out. I guess you can tow from various attachment points.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - from Citadel by John Ringo
474218 From United States of America, joined Oct 2005, 6340 posts, RR: 9
Reply 3, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 5725 times:
They use "air bags" under the wings and fuselage to lift the aircraft off the ground then place steel plates under the wheels, and the bags are deflated. Then they will line steel plates up till the reach the runway. Tugs will be used with ropes or chines attached to the MLG to pull the aircraft backwards.
MD11Engineer From Germany, joined Oct 2003, 13742 posts, RR: 63
Reply 4, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 6 days 10 hours ago) and read 5707 times:
Just google "Aircraft Recovery Manual" (I´ve seen an Airbus one available on the WWW). This manual gives you all information about how and where to lift, pull or tow an aircraft stuck somewhere away from the usual operational surfaces.
Depending on the terrain, it's not too hard to mow down vegetation and do a very careful debris check on the intended path of taxi out. Probably not a good idea in a desert (where sand could get injested) or where there's lots of small stones and pebbles on the ground (which could also get sucked up).
Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
Thanks. It took a while to grasp that such manuals could be found on the web. I thought this was only for LG washing machines .
I read through a Bombardier "Aircraft Recovery Manual" on the net this morning which explains this. Not too complex for a layman like me to understand. https://customer.aero.bombardier.com/webd/BAG/bbad/custsupp/techinfo/CICOpenDocuments.nsf/vwWebPage/TechPubs_ARM_CCC/$FILE/arm_700.pdf
unattendedbag From United States of America, joined Oct 2003, 2308 posts, RR: 2
Reply 11, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 5 days 17 hours ago) and read 5332 times:
Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 8): Depends on the terrain I'm sure. As KELPkid says you can look for potential FOD before starting.
Judging from the terrain in the picture and the fact that the 777 didn't dig into the soil where it came to a rest, I would imagine a power-out would work just fine. Once emptied of its passengers and baggage, it shouldn't take much power to move that aircraft back onto the runway.
I learned from the Bombardier manual that the ropes are always attached to the main landing gear like in your picture. Since the main landing gear is close to the fuselage, to me this seems that the slightest difference in towing speed, the aircraft will swing its nose into one of the tractors?
rampkontroler From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 859 posts, RR: 6
Reply 15, posted (2 years 4 months 1 week 3 days 4 hours ago) and read 4799 times:
Quoting YokoTsuno (Reply 14): I learned from the Bombardier manual that the ropes are always attached to the main landing gear like in your picture. Since the main landing gear is close to the fuselage, to me this seems that the slightest difference in towing speed, the aircraft will swing its nose into one of the tractors?
They do a good job synchronizing the two trucks so that nothing like that has happened...at least not here in Cleveland. (They've had quite a bit of experience putting planes back on the pavement here in recent years!)
geezer From United States of America, joined Aug 2010, 1479 posts, RR: 2
Reply 16, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 3847 times:
I'm surprised this thread is still open for replies.................
The definitive answer to the original question is of course........it all depends........on a whole bunch of things !
Type of A/C, condition of soil, ( frozen, dry, saturated with rain ) how deep is MLG in ground, etc. etc. etc. etc.
I have not had much experience getting large airliners out of "the mud", but I have had a lot with some very heavy trucks and other things. In many cases, the principles involved are very similar.
Just as important as "what to do", is "what NOT to do"; For example..........
Years ago, while I was driving tank trucks for a company in Dayton, Ohio, we were delivering a lot of Jet fuel to "Old Wright Field" ( before it became part of Wright-Patterson AFB ) Anyway, we were hauling the fuel with "doubles"
( two single axle tank trailers, pulled by a single axle B-61 Mack tractor ) Two brothers who owned about 25 rigs, had them leased to a tankline company, and they had an "iron -clad" rule; if you get stuck in the mud, CALL JAKE ! DO NOT, under any circumstances, allow ANYONE to attach ANYTHING to my truck, prior to calling me up.
Where the fuel storage was located was always soft; this one driver got stuck, but not too bad.......it just happened that a guy with a D-7 Caterpiller Dozer was working nearby; he offered to "help"; the driver, not "anxious" to deal with Jake on the phone ( Jake was impossible to deal with ) accepted the dozer guy's offer; everything from that point was "down-hill" !
A big chain was attached to the front axle, ( terrible mistake no.1 ), attached to the dozer, ( terrible mistake No.2 ), and when "power was applied", ( and believe me, a D-7 has plenty of power ), the only thing that came out of the mud, was the front axle, front wheels, and front springs of the Mack; The Mack, ( now with no front wheels, and the two trailer loads of jet fuel remained "in the mud". ( I gained one notch in seniority that day, as the "former" driver was above me on the list. )
It's pretty much the same way with big Jet Airliners; except they cost more; ( quite a bit more ) Yeah, you always need power to move heavy weight; the devil is in where to ( and where not to ) apply that power. Not that many tow truck guys are real "up" on big airplane recovery.
Stupidity: Doing the same thing over and over and over again and expecting a different result; Albert Einstein
troubleshooter From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 423 posts, RR: 5
Reply 17, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 3570 times:
Quoting BE77 (Reply 2): Call Joe Petroni.
Although his expertise might be limited to 707's, the mix of tools he used (and Starlion's) are the same way we get anything big and heavy unstuck in mining as well.
HAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31525 posts, RR: 57
Reply 18, posted (2 years 2 months 2 weeks 22 hours ago) and read 3321 times:
Depends on the Situation.
Normally defuelling is carried out to lighten the weight.
If needed metal sheets are layed out aft of the gears to provide less friction during towing away if the surface is soft or uneven.
Air bags placed under the aircraft to raise it & lighten it in case gear needs to be affixed or weight needs to be reduced.
To be honest though. We have a pull bar that is a boeing fixture to pull aircraft out of the mud/muck/snow. I've never used it. I don't know how to post pics here or I would take a pic. of it. I would have to go to the maintenance manual to see how to use it.
HAWK21M From India, joined Jan 2001, 31525 posts, RR: 57
Reply 25, posted (2 years 2 months 1 week 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 2901 times:
Quoting cdekoe (Reply 22): To be fair to the ground crew - the plan was not to pull it, but to push it back onto the runway. Still, the lack of sophistication was quite popular with the crowd watching this...
Its Important to use the right equipment & the the correct procedures if the aircraft is to be flown again & maintenance expenses are to be kept low.....