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Unusual Take-Off In AMS On 04/27  
User currently offlinespeedbird217 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2012, 337 posts, RR: 0
Posted (2 years 5 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 3639 times:

I was flying from AMS to BGO on KL1185 last Friday on B737-700. We were taking off from runway 24, entering via taxiway S7. While we were approaching the runway, an Easyjet A319 was holding in position on 24, he entered on S6 before and was waiting on the runway. Now, the distance between S7 and S6 is not that much, probably 100 meters or so (if you consider that the U2 stayed as close to S6 as possible on the runway to have as much TORA as possible).

What really surprised me was the fact that we didn't hold short of 24 at S7, but entered right away. While aligning with the runway heading, I could see from my window that the Easyjet was still holding in position and didn't start it's take-off run yet. He actually started its take-off, when we were already holding in position right behind him on the runway. The distance between the two planes was only a little less than that of S6 to S7.

I know that when a plane in front of you starts its take-off roll, you usually enter the runway as quickly as possible. Also that sometimes you cut the line via an earlier taxiway to enter the runway, when you are losing your slot and there's a large queue at the main entry point. But I have never heard of 2 aircraft holding behind each other on the runway, before the first one even started its take-off roll.

So, I hope you understand the scenario I'm describing. This was something I never experienced or heard of before, so can somebody please shed some light onto this? Is this a common practice?

9 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineairbuster From Netherlands, joined Mar 2007, 444 posts, RR: 0
Reply 1, posted (2 years 5 months 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 3345 times:

Yep, at least it's common at AMS. I don't know of any ground distance seperation minima. And it's still about 100-200m between S6 and 7.

AB



FLY FOKKER JET LINE!
User currently offline9MMPQ From Netherlands, joined Nov 2011, 315 posts, RR: 0
Reply 2, posted (2 years 5 months 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 3339 times:

To call it common practice might be a bit much but i'm seeing it happen frequently. The intersection take-off information shows a 200m difference between S7 & S6.


I believe in coincidences. Coincidences happen every day. But I don't trust coincidences.
User currently offlinespeedbird217 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2012, 337 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (2 years 5 months 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 3262 times:

Okay, thanks for the info guys! Never heard of such thing before. But I guess AMS is special in a lot of ways when it comes to operations. I'm really wondering how the ATC keeps track of all the different runways in use, it's like 2 planes are taking off and landing simultaneously all the time. Really interesting to witness. Had a KLM 747 approaching parallel to us during final, what a view! Could even see him lower his gear next to us.
And the taxi from the Polderbaan to the terminal takes almost as long as the flight itself. 


User currently offline9MMPQ From Netherlands, joined Nov 2011, 315 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (2 years 5 months 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 3173 times:

Quoting speedbird217 (Reply 3):
And the taxi from the Polderbaan to the terminal takes almost as long as the flight itself.

And some of us jokingly call it Haarlem International Airport, after the city which may lie closer to the runway then the actual airport center 



I believe in coincidences. Coincidences happen every day. But I don't trust coincidences.
User currently offlineairbuster From Netherlands, joined Mar 2007, 444 posts, RR: 0
Reply 5, posted (2 years 5 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3160 times:

Actually someone at KLM once had the idea to plan the Polderbaan Rwy 18R/36L as alternate for Schiphol because it is so distant from the Main airport area!


FLY FOKKER JET LINE!
User currently offlinespeedbird217 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2012, 337 posts, RR: 0
Reply 6, posted (2 years 5 months 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 3150 times:

Quoting 9MMPQ (Reply 4):
And some of us jokingly call it Haarlem International Airport, after the city which may lie closer to the runway then the actual airport center
Quoting airbuster (Reply 5):
Actually someone at KLM once had the idea to plan the Polderbaan Rwy 18R/36L as alternate for Schiphol because it is so distant from the Main airport area!

Haha, that's really funny! 

But seriously, I connected from DUS and the flight time from DUS to AMS was pretty close to the actual taxi time. Yet KLM still served juice and a cookie on the 30 minute flight, great service! Really enjoyed flying with them.
Also I liked AMS a lot. Heard terrible things about it before, especially about connecting there. But the airport park is a great thing, sitting outside in the sun on the terminal roof, while waiting for your connection is nice.


User currently offlinerlwynn From Germany, joined Dec 2000, 1088 posts, RR: 1
Reply 7, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 2856 times:

I think the Polderbaan is the only place that I have ever landed and nothing happend. No reverse thrust, no noticable braking action, nothing. I just seemed like the pilot let the F50 just coast down to the right speed to exit and drive across the countryside for 20 minutes to AMS.

[Edited 2012-05-02 16:50:16]

[Edited 2012-05-02 16:51:42]


I can drive faster than you
User currently offlinespeedbird217 From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2012, 337 posts, RR: 0
Reply 8, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 2731 times:

Quoting rlwynn (Reply 7):
think the Polderbaan is the only place that I have ever landed and nothing happend. No reverse thrust, no noticable braking action, nothing. I just seemed like the pilot let the F50 just coast down to the right speed to exit and drive across the countryside for 20 minutes to AMS.

Sounds like our landing. I just checked and from the piano keys to the taxiway we used it is 2,900 meters. That is a lot for an F70, and even for a B737-700.
They should've built the Polderbaan North-East of the existing airport, then at least you would get a tour of downtown Amsterdam during landing and taxi.  


User currently offlinegingersnap From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2010, 893 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (2 years 5 months 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 2682 times:

I've seen this done a few times at LGW.

For example a VS 744 enters 08R at J. At the same time a U2 A319 enters 08R at G or GR and they both hold. U2 A319 departs followed shortly behind by the VS 744.



Flown on: A306 A319/20/21 A332 B732/3/4/5/7/8 B742/4 B752 B762/3 B772/W C152 E195 F70/100 MD-82 Q400
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