Galilee From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Posted (12 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 22 hours ago) and read 2725 times:
I am extremely curious as to why Honeywell cannot get their crap together. I am really anxious to see the EMB-170 fly as well as the Falcon 900, neither of which is doing so because of the same problem with the Avionics. Can somebody fill me in as to what the problem is?
P.S. It probably serves them right to be looking like such fools. They need to stay in the electronics buisness and stay out of the braking buisness.
TechRep From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (12 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 2646 times:
Maybe you are refering to the Falcon900EX? This aircraft will incorporate the Honeywell Primus 2000 and Primus II. This package is already in use in many Biz-jets. Maybe the problem is Dassault and not Honeywell. This is basicaly an off the shelf package or retrofit option.
The ERJ170 will use the Epic Primus 2000, intragrating an advanced package such as this is not as easy as it sounds. Again I do not think Honeywell can be to blame, in fact Honeywell is a risk Sharing Partner in this venture.
You need to be more specific in your question, "can't get thier crap together" is not specific enough sorry.
GALILEE From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (12 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 2618 times:
O.K. I'm really not as angry with Honeywell as I seemed to be earlier. No, GE should not stay out of the engine buisness and I guess Honeywell shouldn't have to stay out of the braking buisness. It's just that I work for a aircraft braking company and I hate seeing Honeywell get some of the jobs that our company would probably be better suited for. Besides, Honeywell is a great electronics company-heck, I love my Honeywell digital thermostat. Saves me a bit of money every month in gas charges.
But back to the issue. The Falcon 900 is not flying, has not for years, will not untill Honeywell fixes their problem. Basically, it is a brand new plane. It's first flight is not even scheduled for another 10 days, but it doesn't look like it's going to make it.
The EMB-170 was of course supposed to make it's maiden voyage on 12/15/01, but as I said before is being delayed for apparently the same reason the Falcon 900 is.
Tech-Rep: First of all, thank you for your response. It was certainly intresting. And there is no need to appologise for a little constructive criticism. From what the engineers here are telling me, it is definitely a Honeywell problem. You say that the system going into the Falcon900 is basically an off the shelf system. How similar is it to the new Epic Primus 2000. Is it likely that the two systems are infact very similar and experiencing the same problem? I really want to know what the problem is and if it is a problem that has come up before in aircraft already flying with this system.
Although Honeywell is a risk sharing venture in the EMB programs, are they going to pay the fees due to Embrear when they can't make the final deadline for the first flight?
TechRep From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (12 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 2611 times:
We use the Primus 2000 package in our D0328 and have been for 9 years. The very system that the Falcon900EX will use. I love Honeywell avionics and have become quite knowledgable with Primus 2000 package.
The Epic Primus is much more advanced, incorporating 5 8X10 inch Display units, Dual FMS, trackballs to use GUI interface with the EICAS, The IAC's are now interchangable and you can now remove and replace the internal cards, instead of replacing the whole unit.
I do not think your getting good information sometimes the OEM's and engineers use excuses for prodcution shortfalls.
Squigee From Canada, joined May 2001, 652 posts, RR: 4
Reply 5, posted (12 years 10 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 2606 times:
Funny story- GE wanted to buy Honeywell at one point. However, the European regulators, fearing (righfully so) a horizontal monopoly, decided that to allow the deal to go ahead, GE would have to sell of their aircraft engines business unit. You can guess GE's response.
Someday, we'll look back at this, laugh nervously, and then change the subject.
Aaron atp From United States of America, joined Mar 2000, 533 posts, RR: 2
Reply 6, posted (12 years 10 months 1 week 4 days 4 hours ago) and read 2575 times:
The Falcon 900 is not flying, has not for years
You might want to research that statement... Or perhaps those are just really big falcon 50's I see every day -no I don't think so. Could be 3-engined Falcon 2000's? No, not that either.
Now, I don't know everything about Falcon's but there are over 70 registered 900 B and 900 EX models in the US. I don't know exactly what you are talking about, but these models fly...
You must be talking about the new Falcon 2000 EX variant with the "EASy" [sic] cockpit. Now that I've said all this, I do believe they are testing this new cockpit in a Falcon 900EX. This must be what you are talking about.
Metwrench From United States of America, joined Aug 2001, 750 posts, RR: 2
Reply 7, posted (12 years 10 months 1 week 4 days ago) and read 2560 times:
The Europeans wanted Honeywell/GE to spin off the avionics division, (previously known as Bendix King). There was no validity in breaking up the engine divisions as Honeywell and GE have had an established partnership in engine development.
Considering the European States practice of government subsidies in the Airbus program the GE/Honeywell merger plans were exactly what they have been doing for years.
During the planning stages of the merger Honeywell had to divest themselves of middle management, office space and production capabilities. When it all came to screeching halt, Honeywell was left holding the bag.
Now, I'm done defending them!
They are in absolutely in total disarray right now. I deal with that company for 331, 731, & avionics. On a daily basis contacts there are laid off or reassigned.
They are on a daily basis not shipping parts because their accounting is so screwed up they put established customers on CIA, (Cash in Advance).
They recently voided all contracts with vendors that provided SOAP programs, (Spectrometric Oil Analysis Program), oil and oil filter analysis. They want to do it all by themselves. Guess what? They don't have the resources to do it! They fired some of the techs in their lab, and they don't have the kits available for distribution. The price went from $45.00 per sample to $85.00. We have been on Back Order for six weeks for kits, and they won't ship them. I hope my Company sues the ever-living shit out them if we cancel flights!