CaptainKramer From United Kingdom, joined Feb 2012, 156 posts, RR: 0 Posted (7 months 3 weeks 23 hours ago) and read 6240 times:
Hi all,
Hope this is the right place to post, but I was on another av website that had a link to the following on youtube.
Jumbo Jet RB211-22B Backyard Run.
As the saying goes don't try this at home, unless your British. There are other clips from same location that show what happens when you enter jet efflux of a RB211 at full thrust. Who would have thought, the principles of physics are universal, even when in a backyard. Go figure!
But seriously, what regulations are out there for this sort of thing, if any? And what are the chances of getting sucked in, what is considered a safe distance, given there is no screen in front of this particular engine.
I'd say pretty decent, unless you know exactly what the proper stand-off distances are. In a typical backyard, you will probably do the engine some major damage by sucking in patio furniture, garden hoses, sprinklers, barbequeues, pets, tree branches, etc
Celebrating the birth of KELPkidJR on August 5, 2009 :-)
ak907 From United States of America, joined Mar 2012, 36 posts, RR: 0 Reply 2, posted (7 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 6147 times:
I was surprised he was able to stand behind it for so long. I've stood behind a 744's CF6 engine and the exhaust is very fast and hot even at idle. It expands at about a 20 degree angle behind the outlet.
Starlionblue From Hong Kong, joined Feb 2004, 15870 posts, RR: 66 Reply 3, posted (7 months 3 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 6119 times:
Quoting KELPkid (Reply 1): Quoting CaptainKramer (Thread starter):
And what are the chances of getting sucked in,
I'd say pretty decent, unless you know exactly what the proper stand-off distances are. In a typical backyard, you will probably do the engine some major damage by sucking in patio furniture, garden hoses, sprinklers, barbequeues, pets, tree branches, etc
While I'm all for mad scientists and their experiments, I must say these people are a bit, ahem, cavalier with safety. Walking around it while it is running. Standing at the inlet while it is shutting down. No concern for shed blades etc... The whole thing made me cringe.
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - from Citadel by John Ringo
tdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80 Reply 4, posted (7 months 3 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 6046 times:
Quoting CaptainKramer (Thread starter): But seriously, what regulations are out there for this sort of thing, if any?
None. It's not strapped to an airplane and will never fly again, so it's basically exempt from all relevant aviation regulations.
Quoting CaptainKramer (Thread starter): And what are the chances of getting sucked in, what is considered a safe distance, given there is no screen in front of this particular engine.
Not high as long as you don't go near it at power. At idle, as long as you stay outside the safety zone (about 20' for this one, I think), it should not be a problem.
I don't see that being such a big deal...it's not uncommon at all in test environments.
Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 3): Standing at the inlet while it is shutting down.
As long as it's really fuel-off and just spinning down from idle that's not such a big deal; the fan loses RPM very quickly without fuel (all that power extraction, no power input) and suction drops off by at least the square of RPM (maybe cubed, I can't remember).
They've got the full nacelle so they've got full containment...a shed blade should go out the pipe (bad if you're filming from the back, otherwise OK). In the event of a rotor burst you're screwed no matter what, but we don't worry about that for commercial flying so I'm not sure why it would be worse here.
hiflyer From United States of America, joined Nov 2004, 2118 posts, RR: 4 Reply 6, posted (7 months 3 weeks 10 hours ago) and read 5917 times:
First off I was expecting to look at a pretty ragged out 40 yr old turbine...instead it looks ready to hang! Now the benefits of having one in your back yard?
1 mosquito smoke sprayer on startup
2 Leaf blower
3 Snow removal
4 Drive 20 big windmills and power the community
5 Heck of a conversation piece at your next backyard bbq
Looks fairly rural so noise ordinances may be few. The obvious quality the team took in doing this...from test stand to pad to airstart and engine detailing indicates a professional operation and not backyard johnny chanting "light the fire". (That stand is not designed for thrust....and I fully believe that team understands it....backyard johnny woud yell "Let er rip")
Dreadnought From United States of America, joined Feb 2008, 7779 posts, RR: 22 Reply 11, posted (7 months 2 weeks 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 5085 times:
Viscount724 From Switzerland, joined Oct 2006, 21488 posts, RR: 24 Reply 12, posted (7 months 2 weeks 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 5052 times:
Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 4): Quoting Starlionblue (Reply 3):
No concern for shed blades etc...
They've got the full nacelle so they've got full containment...a shed blade should go out the pipe (bad if you're filming from the back, otherwise OK). In the event of a rotor burst you're screwed no matter what, but we don't worry about that for commercial flying so I'm not sure why it would be worse here.
A reader comment below the video questioned the safety aspect. The response was that he never operates it above idle speed.
Aircellist From Canada, joined Oct 2004, 1419 posts, RR: 9 Reply 13, posted (7 months 2 weeks 4 days 16 hours ago) and read 5005 times:
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 12): A reader comment below the video questioned the safety aspect. The response was that he never operates it above idle speed.
Anything else would be too much looking for trouble.
... Well... I've just watched and I'm still in full disbelief...
And that smoke cloud just reminded me of AC's Tristars at YMX...
DocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 16824 posts, RR: 57 Reply 15, posted (7 months 2 weeks 2 days 19 hours ago) and read 4612 times:
Quoting bohica (Reply 14): This guy must have a lot of money to be able to afford all the fuel needed to run that engine. Those RB211's burn a lot of fuel.
That's what occurred to me, too. Although at idle, maybe not so much. But did you see what those trees did at idle?
My question is: why the hell would you want to go to the trouble of rigging a turbofan up in your backyard that you can't even run above idle?
tdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80 Reply 16, posted (7 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 4570 times:
Quoting DocLightning (Reply 15): My question is: why the hell would you want to go to the trouble of rigging a turbofan up in your backyard that you can't even run above idle?
I don't understand the question. He has a *running turbofan* in his *backyard*! Why the hell *wouldn't* you want that?!
DocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 16824 posts, RR: 57 Reply 17, posted (7 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 4568 times:
Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 16): I don't understand the question. He has a *running turbofan* in his *backyard*! Why the hell *wouldn't* you want that?!
Newark727 From United States of America, joined Dec 2009, 1173 posts, RR: 0 Reply 18, posted (7 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4543 times:
Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 16): I don't understand the question. He has a *running turbofan* in his *backyard*! Why the hell *wouldn't* you want that?!
I think what DocLightning is asking is when you've dismissed enough questions of practicality and money, and quite frankly sanity to go and install an entire jet engine in your backyard, why not go the whole way and make it so that you can run it full power?
DocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 16824 posts, RR: 57 Reply 19, posted (7 months 2 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 4403 times:
Quoting Newark727 (Reply 18):
I think what DocLightning is asking is when you've dismissed enough questions of practicality and money, and quite frankly sanity to go and install an entire jet engine in your backyard, why not go the whole way and make it so that you can run it full power?
Actually, fair point. If I'm going to mount an RB-211 in my backyard, I want to HEAR WHAT IT SOUNDS LIKE AT TAKEOFF POWER!
I mean, that's why this particular model is so beloved by us A.nerds, right? It makes the most glorious and melodic buzz when pushed up to full power. If you can't do that, why have one in your back yard?
Fair enough. But I have neighbors who deep fry turkeys...I worry more about them than this guy.
Quoting Newark727 (Reply 18): I think what DocLightning is asking is when you've dismissed enough questions of practicality and money, and quite frankly sanity to go and install an entire jet engine in your backyard, why not go the whole way and make it so that you can run it full power?
boacvc10 From United States of America, joined Jul 2006, 515 posts, RR: 0 Reply 21, posted (7 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 4389 times:
Quoting Newark727 (Reply 18): I think what DocLightning is asking is when you've dismissed enough questions of practicality and money, and quite frankly sanity to go and install an entire jet engine in your backyard, why not go the whole way and make it so that you can run it full power?
Hah, most of you a.nuts are missing the point. He did it because he could.
That said, at my university (GWU, Foggy Bottom, Wash. DC) in one dim and darrk dungeon, there is an entire jet engine, courtesy of the Propulsion lab of School of Engineering and Applied Sciences. From comments by the staff of the university, upto about 8 / 9 years ago, the engine was regularly operated, and at one point, students/staff would be permitted to feel the thrust generated by the engine at low power - essentially standing behind it at a safe distance. Now, I have not witnessed it in operation, but the engine is intact it seems, and sitting doing not much, of anything nowadays.
I think the utility of having actual engines is debatable, as most data collection/analysis is done through modeling and simulation anyway - and I am sure there are other such defunct facilities all around the US wherever there is an aerospace engineering department. But as a mechanical engineering enthusiast, the experimenter seems to have learnt a lot, and show others that a little can go a long way. So, he is effectively putting out a challenge for those (techs, engineers, students, researchers) .. look at what I can do.
Fuel consumption would be his ultimate expense, and I wouldn't be surprised if a local college were to eventually want to help offset that expense by exchanging student time for experience. Or, Rolls Royce could consider helping out ... it should be a pittance for them to see one of their babies in up and running in good conditoin. Essentially any aviation museum would also be grateful to get a donation of a working jet engine (in this case, a LARGE jet engine) , so that option is also available, and if you can spend $$$$$$$ on restoring old cars, aircraft, why not this project?
DocLightning From United States of America, joined Nov 2005, 16824 posts, RR: 57 Reply 22, posted (7 months 2 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 4369 times:
Quoting tdscanuck (Reply 20): Fair enough. But I have neighbors who deep fry turkeys...I worry more about them than this guy.
I wonder... could you mount a turkey behind the core on the RB-211 and roast it that way? Might wind up pretty dry, though...
francoflier From France, joined Oct 2001, 3195 posts, RR: 10 Reply 23, posted (7 months 2 weeks 2 days ago) and read 4347 times:
Full power runs would be sweet.
But there's 20 Tons of thrust to keep in leash somehow, household insurance broker to take to the hospital if he ever finds out, and I don't care how far into nowhere that guy lives, people are going to hear that.
Oh, what's the fuel flow of a fully unleashed RB211 at sea level again?
Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit posting...
tdscanuck From Canada, joined Jan 2006, 12709 posts, RR: 80 Reply 24, posted (7 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 4287 times:
Quoting DocLightning (Reply 22): I wonder... could you mount a turkey behind the core on the RB-211 and roast it that way? Might wind up pretty dry, though...
And you'd have to go catch it when it flew off your support and went bouncing away into the underbrush...might be a little more jet fuel scent than I really want to be eating too. The thrust frame this guy has doesn't really look up to the task of holding back full takeoff thrust.
Many. Just because I don't trust my neighbors doesn't mean I don't trust me.
Quoting francoflier (Reply 23): Oh, what's the fuel flow of a fully unleashed RB211 at sea level again?
North of 10 tons per hour.
Tom.
25 jetpropulsion: I guess my little project would eventually find it's way onto Airliners.net, so thanks for the positive feedback and glad you all enjoyed the video as
26 MD11Engineer: Tom, to me this doesn´t look like a proper test stand thrust frame, but more like a slightly modified engine transport and change cradle. I´ll doub
27 Aircellist: Very cool to have you on board! Congratulations, by the way.
28 jetpropulsion: Yes, you're right. The engine is on a transportation stand that we have modified. The engine is supported at 4 points on the front compressor casing
29 Newark727: The neighbor jokes are a cliche but I do kind of wonder where you're living where this sort of thing can be accomplished without a major hue and cry f
30 boacvc10: [This is my attempt at late night humor - I'm studying] You have the engine, and a fuel tank. You have a frame, and a way to start the engine. The en
31 jetpropulsion: Understandable I guess....we do live in fairly rural area luckily so neighbours are not a major problem. I know that you really have to be careful wi
32 MD11Engineer: The Danes I mentioned earlier, who are set to build rockets to launch a man into space (and possibly orbit) have set up shop in a disused shipyard in
33 francoflier: Yes, you do look like you're having too much fun with that. This is Europe you know, we don't like it when other people are enjoying themselves. Have
34 shufflemoomin: They're not far from neighbours. They're two minutes away from me and a huge summerhouse area. Luckily they don't make any noise that I've noticed.
35 jetpropulsion: No we haven't tried that but I think it would probably run on diesel, veg oil or whatever. I know of a fellow turbine enthusiast who ran a RR Nimbus
36 MD11Engineer: Old (non-bio) diesel should be ok, though turbine fuel is refined to reduce the sulphur content even more than the normal ultra-low sulphur diesel, b
37 rjsampson: Justin, Well done. You're on par with AgentJayZ from YouTube, and this doesn't even appear to be your day job. I'm sure Tom and I aren't the only a-nu
38 jetpropulsion: Thanks for the supportive comments. We'll have to see how things go after we've run it a few times....not easy as I need a few people to run the start
39 Dreadnought: Has anyone told you you were Nucking Futs? Seriously, my wife gave me hell for having plane spotting as a hobby and having piles of slides everywhere
40 Aircellist: I would add that when you eventually get hold of the two other engines and of the remainder of the Tristar, I and a few other fellows would gladly vo
41 ricknroll: If you have to ask then you don't understand.
42 rcair1: One? Hell - to do this proper we need 3.... Because..... As a fireman - I've responded to far more turkey frying incidents than to "my jet engine cam
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At least if it was in the city...
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thanks for that!
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