Apuneger From Belgium, joined Sep 2000, 3024 posts, RR: 15 Posted (10 years 1 day 12 hours ago) and read 2247 times:
Hi,
due to the 2nd birthday of CityBird Virtual airlines, I'm going to do a bunch of sightseeing flights over Belgium, in a Cessna (they wrote a 152, but I don't get it since they also wrote that we would be 1 pilot and 3 pax per flight). Now, the strange thing is that, in the information letter they sent to me, the organiser also wrote that every time we landed, passengers would change places, so we would be able to fly for ourself for 20/30 minutes. So, every participant would make three flights. Of course, the instructor will also explain some basics of flight to us.
Now, since most of the participants probably only have flight sim experience and are heavily interested in aviation, I wonder if it will be very likely that I will actually fly the plane myself. Is it possible that I'll sit on the left seat, or will I sit on the right seat?
Also, is this legal, since e.g. I would fly for a while, the instructor sitting next to me, and the two other pax in the back? Is this not prohibited, to fly without a licence and other pax? Or do you think it's allowed, since there's an instructor?
And, supposing that this will actually be the case, how's it like to fly an aircraft for the first time? Any tips, comments that you'd like to share?
Now, to conclude, I really hope that I understood that particular part of the letter really well, and that I actually will be able to fly an aircraft myself. After this, who knows maybe I'll take some lessons and try to get my PPL?
Wilcharl From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1158 posts, RR: 3 Reply 1, posted (10 years 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 2217 times:
when I took my frist GA aircraft flight, i had been playing flight simulator for years before and honestly it helped... i understood the "sacred six" insturements use of ailerons/rudder/elevator... We took off, he followed me through on the take off, climbed out, he let me do some basic airwork to get a feel for the a/c after that we went did a power on and off stall... and returned for landing...
i would say that flight sim's best thing for me was it kept me ahead of the a/c instead of the a/c ahead of me
Saintsman From United Kingdom, joined Mar 2002, 2065 posts, RR: 2 Reply 2, posted (10 years 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 2193 times:
Forget the flight sim as the actual experience will be much different. Yes you will know what to do but there are substancial differences, particularly with your senses.
Hands on will be very enjoyable for you, so relax and make the most of the feelings you will get when you make the inputs on the controls. When you move the control column back you will feel the G forces, which obviously you don't get on the simulator. It'll make all the difference.
FLY 8 From Austria, joined Dec 2000, 329 posts, RR: 0 Reply 3, posted (10 years 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2189 times:
Well, first it´s a huge difference. At the first place you think that the flightsim has nothing to do with the real thing. But after some time (well just a few minutes when you fly the aircraft) it becomes the same. There is really nothing great about if you flew the simulator proffesionally (maintaining altitude ,...)
Please write us how your experience was!
yes i can handle that alone. - - -famous last words
Apuneger From Belgium, joined Sep 2000, 3024 posts, RR: 15 Reply 4, posted (10 years 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2182 times:
Thanks for the comments, guys. I really hope I understood the letter well. I'll let you, and everybody else, know how it went. It'll be a great experience (well, it's not a Boeing or so, but it must be great, especially for the first time, to actually be in control of an aircraft). I know, this sounds very 'childish' and so, but I'm really looking forward to this. Let's hope I won't be disappointed...
Vapourtrails From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 5, posted (10 years 23 hours ago) and read 2168 times:
Apunger, what a great opportunity!
Now, since most of the participants probably only have flight sim experience and are heavily interested in aviation, I wonder if it will be very likely that I will actually fly the plane myself. Is it possible that I'll sit on the left seat, or will I sit on the right seat? -- I think flightsim would help in a small way with regard to the terminology and some basic theory but the practical application would be totally new, and not an extension of 'flying' the computer! My 2c.
Apuneger From Belgium, joined Sep 2000, 3024 posts, RR: 15 Reply 7, posted (10 years 19 hours ago) and read 2136 times:
Erasmus:
We'll be flying from Grimbergen airfield. This event will take place on July 20th, two days after I return from Lisbon with an TAP Airbus (A320 or A319). Normally, we would make a sightseeing trip from Deurne EBAW on a VLM Fokker-50, but there weren't enough subscriptions (well, I've already done this last year, and I really enjoyed it). This event is organised by the CityBird Virtual Airlines, due to their 2nd birthday.
For all you guys, thanks again for the comments. Now, let's not dwell on this FS thing, I was just trying to say that we have no real flying experience whatsoever, so I was wondering whether it would be likely that they would let us fly for a while, even when two other enthusiasts (passengers) would be sitting in the back of the plane.
PPGMD From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 2453 posts, RR: 0 Reply 8, posted (10 years 16 hours ago) and read 2120 times:
Routinely here for Discovery Flights (ie first flight) are done with passengers in the aircraft. In fact I was watching in the back seat when my friend took his first flight.
Normally the student is flying from the left seat with the instructor on the right.
Skyguy11 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 13, posted (10 years 8 hours ago) and read 2063 times:
LOL^ Hey the 152/172 is a damn fun and good airplane! Now regarding your flight, first off you will have a great time. And yes, you will most likely be able to fly. The instructor is PIC, meaning he's in charge the whole time, and really there is no rule about what seat the PIC must sit in. If I wanted to as a private pilot, I could sit right seat while my pax sit left seat and in the back. Why anyone would want to do this aside from CFI training is beyond me. Anyways, back to your flight, even though it's a long way away (2 months), please post to let us know how it went and what you plan to do (ie, flight train).
Beefmoney From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 1111 posts, RR: 5 Reply 15, posted (10 years 6 hours ago) and read 2041 times:
I love the 152, its my baby, N5525H!! . They are very forgiving, great to learn in, a little cramped though. But I've never never spun one. I almost did once while doing a power on stall, but thats about it. Easy to land also. But, I also had flown FS95-FS2000 for 6+ years before I actually got ahold of a real plane, and it helped me MUCH, but mostly in the way of instrument flight. The flight dynamics in FS are ok, but by no means great. But I was able to do ILS approaches to minimums back when I was 5 years old flying "Flight Assignment: ATP" (A great sim by the way, or at least WAS.) And my instructors all agree now, that I am extremely proficient at instrument flight and landings. And I believe, and my instructors believe that flight sims really helped me in that area. By the way, HAVE FUN!!!
Serge From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 1989 posts, RR: 3 Reply 17, posted (10 years 3 hours ago) and read 2033 times:
My first experience flying a Cessna was surprising when I arrived at the FBO and learned I would be sitting in the left pilot's seat. It was a C172.. I got buckled in, and closed the doors, waiting for my instructor who told me he would be right back.
He helped with engine start, while i was allowed to taxi. I remember how crappy I taxiied compared to this day . He pushed the throttle in and rotated I believe. We departed to the Southwest and flew over a small town.. I was content just "flying" at normal attitude and bank angle, but my instructor of course had to do a steep diving turn, "You will have a lot of time to recover as you can see". . Then I was allowed to fly over my friend's house (still at 2-3 thousand feet AGL though). We entered the pattern (somewhat ) on base leg and turned final. I lined her up but my instructor took the control's over the runway to flare. Once we taxiied back in and shutdown the engine and walked inside, the FBO owner noted that I had an ear to ear grin on my face .
You will have a heck of a time. I know I did with my first Cessna flight and still do to this day.
"Push it forward, plane goes down. Pull it back, plane goes up." hehe
Kay From France, joined Mar 2002, 1878 posts, RR: 4 Reply 18, posted (10 years 3 hours ago) and read 2027 times:
Skyguy11,
regarding why pilots choose to sit in the left seat is because that is where Cessna officially considers the pilot is sitting. I just read it off the 152's POH today morning: "the 6 basic flight instruments are grouped on the left side, right in front of the pilot".
I wouldn't choose to sit the other side (except for trying and for a change) all the time because the 6 flying instruments are where your eyes are most of the time (ok, the rest is as important and you look at them as much, but you are used to finding those in front of you).
Sophiemaltese From United States of America, joined Feb 2001, 2064 posts, RR: 4 Reply 20, posted (9 years 12 months 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 1980 times:
I hope you have fun. As far as flight sim goes, it's really not the same. I've watched my instructor who's got about 2000 hours fly planes into buildings, trees, screw up landings, etc. all in FS2000.
Wilcharl From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 1158 posts, RR: 3 Reply 21, posted (9 years 12 months 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 1977 times:
its funny to see hte mixed reviews of if FS helps or not.... Ive seen studies done @ Embry Riddle using flight training devices and even MS flight simulator and there was a definite reduction in training time.. i could see them more benificail to an instrument student learning procedures, or to a private student learning the function of the "sacraid six" instruemnts, and procedures and switch locations ... also fly and ms do a good job of simulaiting the GPS and nav coms though ive never seen a 152 with a bendix king GPS
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From Belgium, joined Sep 2000, 3024 posts, 
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I think flightsim would help in a small way with regard to the terminology and some basic theory but the practical application would be totally new, and not an extension of 'flying' the computer! 
My 2c.
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) on base leg and turned final. I lined her up but my instructor took the control's over the runway to flare. Once we taxiied back in and shutdown the engine and walked inside, the FBO owner noted that I had an ear to ear grin on my face 
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