JoeJoe2112 From United States of America, joined Dec 2002, 5 posts, RR: 0 Posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 6760 times:
Hi All. I am a newcomer to this forum, so please bear with me as I get used to the “Posting Culture” here. To all the pilots, air crew, or aviation enthusiasts who may read this, over the past 6 months or so, I have become aware of an issue regarding contrails that appear to be of questionable origin. Come people refer to these as chemtrails. (for background reference on chemtrails see here http://carnicom.com/contrails.htm and here http://www.chemtrailcentral.com/ ).
I have some questions concerning the chemtrails phenomena and I would appreciate your assistance and help.
If you are a pilot, have you ever heard of chemtrails before this post?
Have you noticed any changes or anything unusual in regard to the frequency, persistence, and/ or physical and optical properties of contrails over the past five years?
Are you aware of any current operations by any military or civilian agencies involving chemicals dispersed from high flying aircraft that might be related to any of the following: weather modification, exotic weapons development, or biochemical warfare research?
Have you ever encountered fibers, filaments, webs, strands, or long hair like materials, either in the air or on the ground?
Have you noticed any instances of reparatory problems (i.e. persistent coughs, sinus infections etc. ) in yourself or among your co-workers?
Have you ever heard of HAARP?
Can you explain the contrail behavior in the following photo?
I am looking forward to your input on this issue as I try to make some sense of this. I would like to thank you in advance for your attention to this issue. I often post at the chemtrail forum http://pub8.ezboard.com/fchemtrailschemtrails If you do not wish to discuss this here, please stop by and post there. Thank you.
Backfire From Germany, joined Oct 2006, 0 posts, RR: 1 Reply 1, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 6613 times:
Normally I wouldn't dignify this subject with a response, but the simple fact is that the "chemtrail" conspiracy is a paranoid delusion put about by people with more time than common sense. It isn't even worth trying to explain to these people the lack of logic involved in their little fantasy -- not least, how come it's managed to remain such a top secret despite the number of people who'd have to be in on the cover-up. The White House couldn't even keep a blow-job by an intern quiet.
If you're genuinely concerned, I suggest you go and gather evidence elsewhere because you won't find much sympathy among air transport enthusiasts. I'm sure there's a fair number of people on this forum who'd be less mindful of their choice of words for people who spread this "chemtrail" nonsense around.
There are people here who argue about the position of door levers on different aircraft. I don't imagine for one second that they'd have missed a chemical sprayer. The only disturbing thing about the "chemtrail" bullsh!t is the number of gullible idiots who are prepared to take it seriously. The inability of some people to scrutinise this kind of nonsense and form an independent, level-headed opinion is more dangerous than the worst government-men-in-black story you could imagine.
Hmmmm... From Canada, joined May 1999, 2087 posts, RR: 7 Reply 2, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 6585 times:
This sounds to me that, rather than asking about chemtrails, you are here to tell about them. Do I have that right. You sure have your links and your info already packaged for dissemination on the internet, and you hope to use airliners.net as a pipeline. Nice try. You're not the first.
Play with your browser to see the hidden message:
Okay people, this guy is on to us. We must now implement plan Denial. The secret must be protected. They are getting too close to the truth. If the world finds out that we have been spraying mind controlling substance over the nation to make people stupid, lazy, and fat, we will all end up in jail. If any of you are caught, we will issue a blanket denial of any knowledge of you, the program, or any of the airlines involved.
An optimist robs himself of the joy of being pleasantly surprised
Thomasphoto60 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3598 posts, RR: 29 Reply 3, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 6591 times:
Looks like someone might a fan of Art Bell or as I call him 'captain doomsday' . Frankly, I am glad the he ceases broadcasting tonight. As for the supposed 'chemtrail issue, well despite Art's infinite knowledge in this area . I completely agree with Backfire, in that this is a non-issue.
You might want to head back to the Art Bell home page and chat with like minded chicken littles there who share your theories, you probably won't find many supporters here.
Hmmmm... From Canada, joined May 1999, 2087 posts, RR: 7 Reply 4, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 6592 times:
If you look at the picture of the contrail in the last link, that stops and then restarts, move your head back from the monitor for a sec. You will then see that there is the faint outline of a digital airbrush technique that has produced a circular discoloration. Look closely. That circle where the contrail was removed, and then the sky blended, is a bit darker than the sky around it.
An optimist robs himself of the joy of being pleasantly surprised
JoeJoe2112 From United States of America, joined Dec 2002, 5 posts, RR: 0 Reply 5, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 6553 times:
Actually, my reasons for posting here were not “to inform you” but rather to inform myself of the general consensus of opinion regarding this topic on this board. I see by a simple search, that this topic was extensively discussed 2 years ago, but I wanted to see if those opinions had changed in the meantime.
I have been informed by a poster on another forum that
“BTW... I know a total of three pilots personally. Two military and one commercial. ALL three of them acknowledge that these CONtrails are not normal, and that there is good cause for concern. Beyond that, none of them are willing to elaborate, obviously for fear of some kind of harm to their career.
Three out of three, compared to your THOUSANDS out of THOUSANDS of pilots that have never even heard of chemtrails. . . .”
I was just trying to check the validity of this statement.
Pmcdonald From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 6, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 6541 times:
Woah there fellas-go easy...
I think that Joe Joes' inquiry is a valid one-certainly on this site. While there are those "conspiracy theory" type folks out there who love to imagine that the government is for some reason secretly spraying us with chemicals, this is most likely not the case (all though I suppose there's that part of me that will never fully trust the gov't---but that's what being a good citizen is all about). As with many other alleged cover-ups by the gov't, this one too may stem from actual gov't activities-that the gov't has been up front about. I'll explain:
NASA and NOAA scientists have been aware of the potential adverse effects of jet contrails (the "normal" ones that come from commercial and military traffic). In an effort to better understand just what they are and what they may be doing, NASA has in the past conducted experiments designed to create and study contrails. Specifically, NASA determined that by circling a jet off of the Pacific, they could form a contrail that would coalesce into a cirrus cloud that covered some 13,000 square miles.
So does this mean that the gov't is actively engaged in spraying us with chemicals of unknown origin for unknown reasons? I would say no; but I could also see how some groups would take this info and twist it: "oh my god, NASA flys jets over the US to create huge cirrus clouds from contrails..They must be trying to poison us from above..." and so on and so on.
Still, if these people think something is going on and they would feel better by discussing it and propagating these stories, so be it-maybe one day they'll discover that one of their conspiracy theories was correct and they'll uncover a huge plot.
HlywdCatft From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 5321 posts, RR: 8 Reply 7, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 6523 times:
I remember when Drew and Mike (Detroit Radio 101.1 WRIF morning talk show) talked to the guy who came up with this conspiracy. He was a real wack job to say the least.
5280AGL From United States of America, joined Apr 2001, 414 posts, RR: 1 Reply 9, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6492 times:
I have heard this chemtrail theory for years...As a pilot myself (and an Art Bell fan ), I have seen countless types of contrails. However, just because a particular contrail may appear different than others, doesn't mean that it is. Since atmospheric conditions are always varying, contrails and the life of contrails are all different (ie some crystalize into Cirriform clouds, some evaporrate).
As a whole, I would consider myself a conspiracy theory nut, but this is one I have a difficult time believing. From what I understand, the going theory is that these "chemtrails" are a national defense application, sponsored by the Air Force and CIA, something about altering the upper-atmosphere to thwart certain attacks. That being said, I think the theory of Sasquatch holds more water than the chemtrail one.
Hmmmm... From Canada, joined May 1999, 2087 posts, RR: 7 Reply 10, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6502 times:
If you are a pilot, have you ever heard of chemtrails before this post?
Everyone here has heard of chemtrails. Everyone here has also heard of Santa Claus, too. Which, by the way, seems to get cheaper and cheaper with each passing Christmas.
Have you noticed any changes or anything unusual in regard to the frequency, persistence, and/ or physical and optical properties of contrails over the past five years?
No. They look pretty much the same as when I was kid. I'm 34.
Are you aware of any current operations by any military or civilian agencies involving chemicals dispersed from high flying aircraft that might be related to any of the following: weather modification, exotic weapons development, or biochemical warfare research?
What kind of bizarre question is that? But come to think of it, I remember seeing a 747 many years ago flying over my country. And it did have a white wispy contrail behind it. Similar to what you would expect from a high-flying commercial airliner with massive engines. But then months later, I got a cold with sinus congestion. Do you think they could be related?
Have you ever encountered fibers, filaments, webs, strands, or long hair like materials, either in the air or on the ground?
All over the place. You are welcome to examine my central vac. It's filthy. You don't suppose.....
Have you noticed any instances of reparatory problems (i.e. persistent coughs, sinus infections etc. ) in yourself or among your co-workers?
Yes. I have sinus congestion most of the year. I asked my doctor about it, and he said "4 out of 5 doctors say "Chemtrails."
Have you ever heard of HAARP?
Yes. Let me now provide a link that is not submitted by conspiracy survivalist types:HAARP
I've also heard of MADD. Mother's Against Drunk Drivers. They are much closer to airliner contrails than HAARP is.
Can you explain the contrail behavior in the following photo?
Yes, in my previous post. Can you explain the darker blue circle left by the photo editing?
An optimist robs himself of the joy of being pleasantly surprised
Thomasphoto60 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3598 posts, RR: 29 Reply 11, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6476 times:
LOL, Hmmmmm........
I love it when folks like you use common sense and logic in a humourous fashion.
Tappan From United States of America, joined Oct 1999, 1538 posts, RR: 51 Reply 12, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 6480 times:
My theory is that when the American Neil Armstrong first landed on the moon (oh yeah, the French don't think that ever happened but......) When he did, he left behind a Guiness Stout 6 pack and over time the bottles opened up and are spewing their contents in short bursts. here, look at this photo and you will clearly see the beer "leaking" from the moon.
OPNLguy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 13, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day ago) and read 6471 times:
Backfire said:
>>>It isn't even worth trying to explain to these people the lack of logic involved in their little fantasy -- not least, how come it's managed to remain such a top secret despite the number of people who'd have to be in on the cover-up. The White House couldn't even keep a blow-job by an intern quiet.
After I picked myself up from the floor after laughing so hard at your comments, I began to reflect upon my own 25-year career (thus far) in this business. In all that time, all those recurrent training classes, all those route checks, and other training ventures, I've yet to "discover" any such system on our aircraft for dispensing these airborne evils so I/we can take over the world.
I would then guess, since I'm an industry "insider", that now makes me an official part of the "conspiracy" and that nothing I say on the subject is ever to be believed.
Oh well... I hope I'll be able to sleep tonight...
BTW, I sat next to Elvis on a UFO out of Area 51 last week, and he ASSURED me that airliners were not the cause of these supposed chemtrails. He made me promise not to tell what they REALLY were...
Happy New Year..... (Hey, who's that behind you....?)
Thomasphoto60 From United States of America, joined Jan 2000, 3598 posts, RR: 29 Reply 14, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 1 day ago) and read 6464 times:
Airplay From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Reply 15, posted (9 years 4 months 4 weeks 6 hours ago) and read 6407 times:
Jet fuel is dangerous stuff, and it doesn't get any better when you burn it.
Everyone seems to miss the obvious. There is no conspiracy. All aircraft spew chemicals when they fly, and they do it with little or no consideration to the effects on the environment.
With the ever increasing air traffic, I'm sure that jet fuel exhaust has had an effect on health and the environment. Especially around airports. Just imagine burning tons of jet fuel daily within the confines on an airport in the middle of a city. It can be argued that cars generate exhaust too, but we all know that a loaded jet airliner taking off burns more fuel than any cars in the vicinity, and it burns it much less efficiently (and occasionally DUMPS tons of raw fuel prior to emergency landings).
The Material Safety Data Sheet for JP-4 and JP-5 can be found here:
I'm surprised that you don't see ramp personnel wearing protective breathing equipment especially since NIOSH has identified jet fuel exhaust as a potential carcinogen. The MSDSs address the unburned fuel vapors only, but there are tons of resources available on the internet that discuss the effects of fuel dumping and exhaust. Health effects include everything from irritation to pretty severe immune system problems, and a few different types of cancer.
Benzene, which has been banned for over 20 years as a solvent in the US, is a component of various fuels and their exhausts including jet fuel. This dangerous chemical is a known carcinogen. One cup of benzene evaporated in a football field sized building produces harmful vapor levels that are 33 times the OSHA standard for safe exposure levels.
As much as I like airplanes, I realize that airliners are major polluters. Some day we'll wake up to the fact that we need to reserve air travel for reasonably long trips and stop using aircraft for commuting. Many routes can be better served by rail service and if the train can be operated electrically, (hydro..not diesel) it will alleviate the problem a great deal. We really need to expand rail service, not tear it down.
Chemtrails? It's no conspiracy. It's not even a secret. It's a fact.
B727-200 From Australia, joined Nov 1999, 1051 posts, RR: 3 Reply 17, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 6339 times:
Is it possible that the rapid decompression and recompression of air above an airfoil traveling at M0.78 in a moist frigid atmosphere could cause these "whole wing" contrails? The photo below shows this happening at near sea level, where the visible vapour does not have the opportunity to freeze and remain suspended in the air.
Beefmoney From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 1111 posts, RR: 5 Reply 20, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 23 hours ago) and read 6279 times:
Yeah, Ive heard all I can stand about this chemtrail crap.
Every dang ground crew member in the world would have to stay silent if the found any "sprayer nozzle" not to mention a gigantic tank full of whatever they are spraying. The chances of that are about the same as my dog launching a fully functional communications satellitte in geostationary orbit.
And if you cant see that the second photo is doctored, then you need to 1) get glasses 2) find a tutorial on the capabilities of Photoshop.
Avt007 From Canada, joined Jul 2000, 2131 posts, RR: 6 Reply 22, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 22 hours ago) and read 6280 times:
Gee, don't I feel stupid! 17 years of aviation experience, a lifetime around a/c, growing up as an airforce brat, and I'd never heard of chemtrails until today I decided to look at these sites and found a batch of poorly doctored photos, and some untouched ones of perfectly normal contrails, including standard "racetrack patterns" left by AWACS or tankers. Scattered along the way were references to crop circles and earthquakes. I didn't see anything that would make me think the government was up to something. Note to moderators; I for one wouldn't object to this thread being deleted, although it did provide some amusement Gotta love the links to every crackpot on the web, though.......................
VC-10 From United Kingdom, joined Oct 1999, 3656 posts, RR: 42 Reply 23, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 5 days 20 hours ago) and read 6241 times:
This contrail argument isn't new. Do you realise they were the reason the Nazi's lost the war? The 8th Air Force flew over Germany daily spreading the stuff
Beefmoney From United States of America, joined Oct 2000, 1111 posts, RR: 5 Reply 24, posted (9 years 4 months 3 weeks 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 6169 times:
You know, I am really tempted to send one of these chemtrail sites an email pretending to be a guy "on the inside" and I want to spill the beans. Tell them all about the chemicals and the ways we spread em from the plane. I bet they would absolutely eat that stuff up.
25 Cloudy: I listen to the Art Bell show. The nuts are entertaining when they actually talk about their wild theories. Hey, they have to be somewhat believable a
26 JoeJoe2112: “You know, I am really tempted to send one of these chemtrail sites an email pretending to be a guy "on the inside" and I want to spill the beans. T
27 FSPilot747: This is funny. I've heard of the term "chemtrails" before, but I never really knew what they were. Now, those photos. I'm a graphic artist, and I have
28 Tomh: Anyone remember the Skytypers? They were A-6 Texan aircraft fitted with timed release spray apparatus. Six or seven of them would fly line abreast and
29 FredT: They (and I won't tell you who they are - they're reading this board and they'd go after me! Yes, it is completely illogical since they'll go after me
30 Beefmoney: Dont worry fred, im not one that would go about lying to that extent. But, believe it or not, some guy pretending to be a pilot sent a big long articl
31 FredT: Beef, LOL! Crazy is just the word.... Cheers, Fred
32 JoeJoe2112: Posted by "Ex Pilot" http://www.chemtrailcentral.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001648.html "Chem-trails are NOT a myth. I should know as I was an airline pilot
33 Staffan: Sounds to me that some people in this world have too much free time, too much imagination and access to alot of drugs. These people could earn loads m
34 Avt007: Seems to me Captain Jay is a traitor to the country and should hunted down and locked up in Area 51 This all reminds me of the film "A Beautiful Mind"
35 Airhead711: Hi,I've seen many contrails before and in fact I have seen quite a few today.I've never felt sick or anything afterwards so I think *cough cough*that
36 FSPilot747: Captain Jay huh? You guys smell somethin'?? Smells like [sniff], yep, smells like B.S. JoeJoe, you obviously believe this stuff, but you have to remem
37 Cloudy: Easy to refute, nutty, but entertaining nevertheless. Captain J, we thank you for the good story and the fun we are having laughing at you.
38 ExitRow: They tested this technology on NASCAR fans... My guess is Neural Disruption Agent IV. At the conclusion of this race, the fans DID seemed intoxicated
39 XFSUgimpLB41X: Not to mention these insightful people seem to think that there are no winds up there that would blow the chemicals around the world. Kinda like spray
40 OPNLguy: >>>It all starts with the flight plan. In addition to the aircraft weights, weather, route of flight, etc. are a couple of symbols. The first is an as
41 OPNLguy: >>>The chances of that are about the same as my dog launching a fully functional communications satellitte in geostationary orbit. A screamer! ROTFL!
42 Jwenting: Everyone here has heard of chemtrails. Everyone here has also heard of Santa Claus, too. Which, by the way, seems to get cheaper and cheaper with each
43 IHadAPHeo: Below is a photo of Captain Jay as he tries to hold his breath while a cloud of ChemTrail agent IV is released into the studio. The ChemTrail garbage
44 Francoflier: This is by far, the funniest forum around! Alright, my turn to have fun. True story: A while ago, by a bright sunny morning, on a ferry flight, a copi
45 Boeing4ever: Chemtrails are real. And Airbus is leading the way in development of them as we can clearly see in this photo...they are longer, and larger! B4e-Forev
46 Jwenting: Ah yes, the largest dildo ever to take to the skies... Makes you wonder what agent they're going to spread using that, maybe something for breeding co
47 Francoflier: A longer, larger ...fart??????? Geez, they're really spraying gas then!!!
48 JoeJoe2112: Thank you all for your responses. Beefmoney/PHXPilot, thank you for taking the time to debate the finer points of chemtrails. I have a lot of data to
49 737doctor: Being a mechanic for a major airline myself, I loved this "letter": http://carnicom.com/mech1.htm Funny stuff. JoeJoe, you can rest assured that I hav
50 MD88Captain: I understand that both UAL and USAirways refused to cooperate in this government program.
51 OPNLguy: >>>I understand that both UAL and USAirways refused to cooperate in this government program. Come to think about it, I think Braniff, Eastern, and Pan
52 Bhill: Ok...let's put this issue to rest once and for all. All we need is empirical data...soooo the next time the aircraft you are travelling in intersects
53 E1FAIL: Ahhhh....After seeing that picture of the Tide Ride gassing the NASCAR fans it finally dawned on me why someone would be a Jeff Gordon fan......Chemic
54 Beefmoney: Does anyone else find it weird that I have been accused (twice) on the chemtrail website of being a secret government agent whos mission is to keep th
Sponsor Message: 
From United States of America, joined Dec 2002, 5 posts, 
From Germany, joined Oct 2006, 0 posts, 
From Canada, joined May 1999, 2087 posts, 
. Frankly, I am glad the he ceases broadcasting tonight. As for the supposed 'chemtrail issue, well despite Art's infinite knowledge in this area 
. I completely agree with Backfire, in that this is a non-issue.
From , joined Dec 1969, posts, 
From Australia, joined Nov 1999, 1051 posts, 
From United Kingdom, joined Oct 1999, 3656 posts, 
Sponsor Message: 
Printer friendly format
