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747 Series Flap Settings  
User currently offline744lover From United States of America, joined Nov 2000, 187 posts, RR: 0
Posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 4496 times:

Hi there,


While checking this pic, I saw a little -15 mark on the flap positions....


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Photo © Royal S King



Did the 747 ever had a 15º flap position??? I think they were later re-"angled" since the pasted numbers.... Guessing from the numbers, they could have had positions 1, 5, 10, 15, 20, 25, 30 and 40 (the last where today lays the -30 flap setting)....


Could anyone light me up on this???



See ya!
GHN

9 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineAJ From Australia, joined Nov 1999, 2389 posts, RR: 24
Reply 1, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 2 days 9 hours ago) and read 4427 times:

The 747s I've flown had 0, 1, 5, 10, 20, 25 and 30.
The 767 has 0, 1, 5, 15, 20, 25 and 30.


User currently offlineB747skipper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 4291 times:

Our friend AJ gave you the flaps settings for the 747...
One minor detail to mention, in the SP, the "25" setting was deleted...
The SP is 1 - 5 - 10 - 20 - 30
xxx
Flaps 10 and 20 are takeoff flaps settings -
Flaps 25 and 30 are landing flaps settings -
xxx
Some airlines (TWA as an example) prevented use of 30 flaps for landing...
They placed a "lock" to prevent selection of flaps beyond 25... (747-131)
(Yet the pilots could select 30 with electrical alternate flaps extension).
xxx
Happy flamebaiting contrails -  Smile
(s) Skipper



User currently offlineMr.BA From Singapore, joined Sep 2000, 3423 posts, RR: 22
Reply 3, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 4283 times:

Hi B747Skipper,

Just curious, what was the reason for them to go all the way to forbid the use of 30 for landing?

Thanks!



Boeing747 万岁!
User currently offlineB747skipper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 9 hours ago) and read 4290 times:

Dear Mr.BA -
Apparently there were some structural problems with flaps and wings of the 747-100 series, requiring inspection after use of 30 flaps... TWA decided to block that setting. Funny is, they later acquired 747-200 series from another airline, who did not have that problem, but... with "standardization" motives, what did they do... they... blocked 30 flaps on these 747-200s too...
xxx
I wonder what they did with the few 747SPs they got... these did not have a 25 flaps setting... ha ha, they had to "learn" to use 30 flaps, I guess...
xxx
Ooops, hoping I do not flamebait a former TWA pilot here...
I certainly miss good old TWA... they lasted 12 years longer than PanAm...
xxx
Happy contrails -  Smile
(s) Skipper



User currently offlineMr.BA From Singapore, joined Sep 2000, 3423 posts, RR: 22
Reply 5, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 4280 times:

Dear B747Skipper,

Thanks for sharing. Very interesting stuff! Do you have the slightest idea what is the problem they will have if they land with flaps 30? Is it only their B741s or does it apply to the others too?

Nice to hear from you!

alvin



Boeing747 万岁!
User currently offlineB747skipper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week 8 hours ago) and read 4277 times:

Alvin -
xxx
I try to remember here, it was a problem with the wing's aft spar and the flaps drive I believe, a problem that did not exist with later airplanes, not necessarily 200s but, (like PanAm) TWA had old airplanes... If 30 flaps was used it required an inspection...
xxx
At PanAm we favored 25 landings and many other airlines do... Unless other conditions requiring 30, I presently "recommend 25" as a suggestion, not a policy... Most pilots I fly with seem to agree with me... besides, there are other considerations: fuel burn reduction, and less noise...
xxx
What I did not like with TWA "block" for flaps 30, is that an airline deliberately decreases the alternatives left to the crews, who may be in need of that capability without restrictions, one day... I believe making a policy is a better alternative... i.e. "land with 25, but 30 is there if you need it"...
xxx
Happy contrails  Smile
(s) Skipper


User currently offlineMr.BA From Singapore, joined Sep 2000, 3423 posts, RR: 22
Reply 7, posted (10 years 11 months 1 week ago) and read 4244 times:

Thanks B747Skipper for the help! I wonder what is the policy for your airline? I think at my home carrier they standardize everything. Every take-off at any weight is to be 20 and landing 30, even if conditions favoured 10 for take-off more than 20.

For airlines that allows pilots' discretion to which flap setting to use, must there be charts for difference flap setting performances?

Cheers!



Boeing747 万岁!
User currently offlineB747skipper From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (10 years 11 months 6 days 23 hours ago) and read 4228 times:

Dear Alvin -
xxx
For us flaps selection is "SCD" subject to captain discretion...
We use standard Boeing AOM with all data as to what favors what...
For each runways we use, we have "runway analysis" for the numbers.
(Computer generated - we look what is most favorable, then decide)
Often, sea level, shorter runays we will use 20 for takeoff...
High elevations, mountains around (MAD, MEX) we use flaps 10...
xxx
Happy contrails -
(s) Skipper



User currently offlineMr.BA From Singapore, joined Sep 2000, 3423 posts, RR: 22
Reply 9, posted (10 years 11 months 6 days 16 hours ago) and read 4205 times:

Thanks for all the help Skipper. Cheers happy flying  Smile


Boeing747 万岁!
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