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Engine Nacelle Diffrences On The 747?  
User currently offlineEricmetallica From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Posted (13 years 6 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2896 times:

I noticed diffrences in the Engine nacelle's of 747's. One has an opening behind the main fan one does not. What are the diffrences between these two, why are they like this??


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Photo © Lindsay Hockey



Eric



9 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineTEDSKI From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (13 years 6 months 4 days 19 hours ago) and read 2820 times:

The top picture is a Rolls Royce RB211 engine from a 747-400 and the bottom picture is a Pratt & Whitney JT9D engine from either a 747-100/200/300 or 747SP.

User currently offlineKonaB777 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 2, posted (13 years 6 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 2807 times:

One may notice on early 747s the little slots that opened up on the front of the nacelle. This allowed additional air in at low speed/high power settings since the old 747 engines were so weak.

User currently offlineEricmetallica From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 3, posted (13 years 6 months 4 days 15 hours ago) and read 2793 times:

Ok i guess i should have named my topic diffrent. Basicly the engine on top looks like all the air that is drawn in is used through the compressors and so on. while to one on the bottow has an opening to let some air go right through. What are difrences in thrust etc????

Eric


User currently offlineSuperslushy From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 4, posted (13 years 6 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 2789 times:

I understand your question and if I may I'd like to add a little of my knowledge. I know that the first engines of the 747 (like the one's in the second photo) were quite revolutionary in design because of the cool-air bypass design. What this means is that not all of the air sucked into the engine goes through the core, but it is compressed and sent around the inside and is fed out those gaps you are referring to. That way the cool air that comes out those gaps meets up with the thrust from the engine and when these two combine, somehow it creates more power. As far as how the first photo works, I dunno?

I'd appreciate it is someone would correct my story, I really only know the basics. I always appreciate it

Chris


User currently offlineXFSUgimpLB41X From United States of America, joined Aug 2000, 4192 posts, RR: 37
Reply 5, posted (13 years 6 months 4 days 13 hours ago) and read 2777 times:

The rolls royce engine is also hi bypass....and most of the air doesnt go through the core just like in the bottom (Pratt and Whitney) one. I do not know the thrust differences though.


Chicks dig winglets.
User currently offlineFanoftristars From United States of America, joined Jul 2000, 1604 posts, RR: 5
Reply 6, posted (13 years 6 months 4 days 10 hours ago) and read 2771 times:

Just think of the outermost metal on the bottom picture extending farther towards the back of the engine, and then you'll understand the RR design. The RR engine has the same nacelle design when fitted to the 757. It's just a different design. Now, what I would like to know are the advantages/disadvantages to the two different designs. The Trent engines do not incorporate this as far as I know.


"FLY DELTA JETS"
User currently offlineEricmetallica From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 7, posted (13 years 6 months 3 days 20 hours ago) and read 2747 times:

thanks.. Now i have a better understanding. I agreee with Fanoftristars, i'd like to know the advantages and disadvantages of the two types.

Eric


User currently offlineMikeybien From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 8, posted (13 years 6 months 3 days 19 hours ago) and read 2739 times:

I think i know the answer to this but im not sure
The RR engine has a long fan duct which has lower drag than the PW model, but the extra long fan duct also adds weight.
For carriers that do mostly long haul flights, the RR might be a better choice because of a lower fuel burn. On the other hand, the PW might be a better choice for a high density short distance carrier because the aircraft has more usable payload.
Of course there are a bunch of other variables that go into engine selection for an airline like specific fuel consumption.
The only figures i have give the RR RB.211 a SFC of 0.57 and the PW 4152 a SFC of 0.58. For those of you new to engines, SFC is the pounds of fuel burned divided by the pounds of thrust developed. The lower the SFC the better.
The same source also claims the RR makes 60K trust versus 52K for the PW. However this is hardly comparing apples to apples so it doesnt mean long fan ducts are the way to go.


User currently offlineRayChuang From United States of America, joined Jun 2000, 7993 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (13 years 6 months 3 days 11 hours ago) and read 2716 times:

I do know that Pratt & Whitney JT9D and PW4000 installations on 747's tend to have relative short fan ducts--look at them on UA's 747-400 fleet. What's interesting is that on the 767, the JT9D/PW4000 installations have longer fan ducts.

I believe that the General Electric CF6-50 and Rolls-Royce RB.211-524 installations on the 747 always had longer fan ducts. Look at the CF6-50/80 installations on 747's and you notice the longer fan ducts pretty easily.


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