Northwest717 From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR: Posted (11 years 5 months 5 days ago) and read 9272 times:
Ok, to start off, I'm sorry if this is a stupid question. I keep hearing people refer to "ETOPS" and I know it has something to do with the aircraft only having two engines and that is why some airlines chose (supposedly) the A340 over the 777. What is ETOPS? This is just one of those things I never found out about.
WidgetBoi From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 1432 posts, RR: 18
Reply 1, posted (11 years 5 months 5 days ago) and read 9125 times:
ETOPS (Extended Twin-engine OPerationS) is an acronymn for an International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) rule permitting newer twin-engined commercial air transports to fly routes that, at some points, are further than a distance of 60 minutes flying time from an emergency or diversion airport. This definition allows twin-engined airliners—like Boeing 757, 767, 777 and Airbus A300, A320 series, A330—to fly routes long distances (especially over water) that were previously off-limits to twin-engined aircraft.
PW100 From Netherlands, joined Jan 2002, 2911 posts, RR: 17
Reply 4, posted (11 years 5 months 5 days ago) and read 9058 times:
ETOPS: Engines Turning Or Passengers Swimming.
Also works with EROPS [R = Running].
ETOPS sets out regulations for twin engined aircraft for extended flights without a suitable diversion airport. ETOPS 120 means that this twin can fly routes that should have diversion airports within 120 minutes of flight at one engine. ETOPS 180 and 207 are currently also in use. Boeing is doing 777-300ER trials for ETOPS 330. In order to fly these routes, operatos must meet the stringent regulations of these ETOPS rules.
ETOPS is to be replaced by LROPS [Long Range OPerationS], which set regulations for long range flights for ALL airliners, not just twins.
Immigration officer: "What's the purpose of your visit to the USA?" Spotter: "Shooting airliners with my Canon!"
Tristar2000 From Canada, joined Dec 2000, 274 posts, RR: 0
Reply 10, posted (11 years 5 months 4 days 22 hours ago) and read 8897 times:
ETOPS 330???? Man I didn't know about this one, that's 5.5 hours to a diversion airports, not many places where that applies... I mean if you're in the middle of the atlantic, most of the time, you're 3 hours or less away from each side, so ETOPS 180 and 207 meant you could pratically choose the straight line you wanted if ATC approved it.
Does anyone know where ETOPS 330 could really come in handy???
OB1783P From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 329 posts, RR: 0
Reply 14, posted (11 years 5 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 8806 times:
OK, we get what the acronym stands for. But "my" question is, what entity earns an ETOPS qualification? Is it an aircraft, or a certain aircraft in a certain airline fleet?
I remember reading in a recent post that TG had had trouble with ETOPS certification, and would thus keep all four-engine fleet over extensive water. Yet TG has never lost an aircraft over water. I would rather fly a TG twin over water than, say, Egyptair, who obviously has a good ETOPS rating.
This is getting very interesting...
I've flown thousands of miles and I can tell you it's a lot safer than crossing the street!
Ltbewr From United States of America, joined Jan 2004, 13623 posts, RR: 17
Reply 15, posted (11 years 5 months 4 days 21 hours ago) and read 8780 times:
Very long range ETOPS could be used over the Pacific, Indian Oceans, South Atlantic and overflying land areas such as the Middle East, Parts of Africa, Russia/Asia where few if any safe airports or ones that can handle some aircraft models.
DfwRevolution From United States of America, joined Jan 2010, 1080 posts, RR: 50
Reply 17, posted (11 years 5 months 4 days 20 hours ago) and read 8714 times:
ETOPS 330???? Man I didn't know about this one, that's 5.5 hours to a diversion airports, not many places where that applies..
ETOPS 330 has not yet been approved, but Boeing has performed all the necessary testing to obtain certification for this protocal. I believe the 773ER prototype was used for these test. It comes in handy over the south pacific and polar routes.
Tsentsan From Singapore, joined Jan 2002, 2016 posts, RR: 15
Reply 19, posted (11 years 5 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 8623 times:
I think one of the most famous examples of ETOPS where an aircraft had to run on one engine to the nearest airport, was the engine shutdown on a UA 777 from AKL to LAX or SFO... the 777 flew slightly more than 180 mins on 1 engine to reach her diversion airport.
Ua777222 From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 3348 posts, RR: 10
Reply 20, posted (11 years 5 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 8594 times:
You are correct. It was a UA777222ER that was on it's way to SFO(?) and ended up at HNL. When the actual engine quit it was exactly 180min from there. Now as that pilot I wouldn't really worry about getting there I would worry about the stress on the engine and the damage to the other engine. 3hrs ETOPS is not a big deal for a 777, I think Boeing did 13hrs(?).
ETOPS certification only happens once and that is when the a/c is first built. For example the 777-300ER got its ETOPS certification with the demo a/c and now that that has happened as long as Boeing agrees to build the a/c exactly the same then any 777-300ER built after is certified.
WindowSeat From United States of America, joined Sep 2003, 1319 posts, RR: 56
Reply 21, posted (11 years 5 months 4 days 18 hours ago) and read 8571 times:
ETOPS certification may happen only once for an aircraft type. That is different from ETOPS certification for each flight. FAR 121.161 states the regulations for ETOPS flights capped at 60 mins. Operators can get around that by complying to the FAA Advisory Circular 120-42A. Each flight needs to be ETOPS certified, through advanced aircraft maintenance, especially engines and APUs. There are very strict regulations eg. the same technicians cannot work on both engines of the twin, it must be done by two seperate techician teams to avoid multiple similar systems maintenance. All systems for ETOPS must be checked before each flight etc etc. In addition flight crew also needs to be certified.
I'm all in favour of keeping dangerous weapons out of the hands of fools. Let's start with keyboards.
Planespotting From United States of America, joined Apr 2004, 3547 posts, RR: 5
Reply 23, posted (11 years 5 months 4 days 17 hours ago) and read 8517 times:
wasn't there an A330 that was going from LAX - SYD or something like that that lost an engine and the flight crew flew it for 4 hours on one engine? Im probably way overstating it but wasn't it like the longest flight ever on one engine? maybe it was a 76 or 77? ahh i think it was on a thread here. annnyway post if you know about it.