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Early 747 Upperdeck Windows  
User currently offlineTheBigOne From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2004, 240 posts, RR: 0
Posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 4550 times:

I have often wondered about the number of windows on the upperdeck of early B747 aircraft. I can recall seeing photos of a number of early 747 (100 and 200 series) with only three windows on the upperdeck. Since then many of the same aircraft have got 10 windows on the upperdeck. Were these new windows added when the lounges were changed to regular seating? Did airline maintenance personnel cut new windows into the aircraft or were they always there, but just covered up?


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14 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineSATL382G From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 1, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 17 hours ago) and read 4453 times:

The window modification was done by removing the old fuselage skin and replacing with a new section with the windows already built in.

This was very easy to see on NW 747-100s before they went to the bowling shoe scheme as the metal of the new section has a slightly different patina than the rest of the ship.

SATL382G


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[Edited 2004-09-04 19:03:17]

User currently offlineLorm From United States of America, joined Jun 2004, 409 posts, RR: 1
Reply 2, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 16 hours ago) and read 4342 times:

Both the early 100 and 200 variants were produced with only 3 windows on each side. Eventually 10 became the standard on all production models, and some airlines even had modifications on early delivered aircraft, such as United and Continental.

Some carriers retained the 3 window standard and on later deliveries, TWA had seven windows plugged by Boeing with aluminum plates.

Interestingly and tragically TWA flight 800 (N93119) crash coverage on TV showed that some of these plugs were dislodged in the crash on the right side. Though left side covers remained in place.



Brick Windows
User currently offlineFTOHIST From United States of America, joined Mar 2004, 73 posts, RR: 0
Reply 3, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 2 days 7 hours ago) and read 4103 times:

Our ex-Pan Am -121 (N747GE) has 3 windows on the left side, and only 2 windows on the right. What would be the forward-most window on the right is taken up by the upstairs galley.

User currently offlineMiami1 From Australia, joined Feb 2001, 706 posts, RR: 0
Reply 4, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 23 hours ago) and read 3696 times:

Qantas' first 747s (-200s) had 10 windows when delivered, even though the UD was used as a lounge - The "Captain Cook" Lounge. I remember reading the 10 windows were at QF's request, leading me to believe the were the first airline to have this option.

User currently offlineGDB From United Kingdom, joined May 2001, 13043 posts, RR: 78
Reply 5, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 20 hours ago) and read 3181 times:

BA's 747-136 aircraft were modded in the late 1970's.

User currently offlineBofredrik From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 6, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 19 hours ago) and read 2947 times:

I flew with a United B747-100 who had 10 windows but more rows so some seats did not have any other view than the wall... Not so nice for 8+ hours.

User currently offlineTheBigOne From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2004, 240 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 9 hours ago) and read 2435 times:

Thank you for clearing that up. Its a question that has bugged me for many years! I have actually been to Air India's 747 crew training mock-up in Bombay, that still has a lounge on the upper deck. If only the lounges were still around today.....


Reach for the stars - they are closer than you think!
User currently offlineN1120a From United States of America, joined Dec 2003, 26196 posts, RR: 76
Reply 8, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 4 hours ago) and read 2311 times:

Hey, VS has bars on their aircraft. I don't think that any 742s were delivered with 3 windows, but then again does someone know any different


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User currently offlineM404 From United States of America, joined Nov 2003, 2220 posts, RR: 5
Reply 9, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 2248 times:
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If you ever see the #1 B747 (I don't know if it's at BFI museum or not any more) and interesting story about it went something like this.

Although it of course had the original 3 windows of the first -100s Boeing later painted in black the extra seven to be like the newer models (options) it was trying to sell.



Less sarcasm and more thought equal better understanding
User currently offlineTbear815 From United States of America, joined Jun 2003, 704 posts, RR: 5
Reply 10, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 2 hours ago) and read 2228 times:

My first 747 take-off was in the old "Red Carpet Room" of UA's first 747. In the delivery model, there were ~7 gold fabric swivel chairs. Not a great arrangement as a lounge. After they retro'ed the -100's to the 10 window cabin, they created a terrific Polynesian style lounge with a circular sofa, card tables, a full service bar, and snacks for cocktails. Rarely did were any pax seated there - all the paxs were on the lower deck and would wander up to see and maybe have a drink. First class was first class then!

American never changed their few 747 aircraft. In fact, one of those old birds was flying SFO/HNL in '94. The UD had 16 business class seats and only three windows on each side. Comfortable, but sort of cramped.


User currently offlineFeeble From Netherlands, joined Jul 2004, 17 posts, RR: 0
Reply 11, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 1 day 1 hour ago) and read 2171 times:

KLM just removed the plugs and put in windows Big grin


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User currently offlineStarlionblue From Greenland, joined Feb 2004, 16908 posts, RR: 67
Reply 12, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 2033 times:

I don't think that any 742s were delivered with 3 windows, but then again does someone know any different

Yes there were. If nothing else, see Feeble's pic above.



"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
User currently offlineFeeble From Netherlands, joined Jul 2004, 17 posts, RR: 0
Reply 13, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 19 hours ago) and read 2013 times:

Yes there were. If nothing else, see Feeble's pic above.
Yes indeed.

The first -200's were delivered with 3 windows each side.
The last -100's were delivered with 8 windows each side.
And most -100's nowadays are converted to 8 windows each side.


User currently offlineVimanav From India, joined Jul 2003, 1514 posts, RR: 15
Reply 14, posted (9 years 7 months 2 weeks 17 hours ago) and read 1962 times:

AI's B742s currently have 8 windows on the UD port side and 10 on the starboard.

For those who still have doubts that some B742s were delivered with 3 windows on the UD...


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rgds//Vimanav



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