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Going Back To AME After FAA Denial?  
User currently onlineKAUST From United States of America, joined Jun 2009, 95 posts, RR: 25
Posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 10 hours ago) and read 4157 times:

Greetings,
I within the past year almost went to an AME, and he cleared me for the third class medical all but for a banning medication I am taking. He then said he'd defer it to OK City. I went through an appeals process, however I did so with my treating physician and not with the AME. As you may have guessed, I was ultimately denied.

So that brings me to my question, would it be possible, given the fact that I may mostly erred in going with the wrong person for it, that if I went back to the same AME to be re-tested and used him for the appeal to OK City (invariably I would have appeal again), that the outcome could be different? I had led myself to assume that since he did defer and not out-right deny me himself that there was some chance, or did he just not want it on his name that I was denied?

Any comments welcome -
KAUST


"Houston, this is Apollo 8. We are now in Lunar orbit."
17 replies: All unread, jump to last
 
User currently offlineAvioniker From United States of America, joined Dec 2001, 1109 posts, RR: 11
Reply 1, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 3 days 9 hours ago) and read 4112 times:

If you're taking a banned medication the AME should have been able to tell you that a waiver wouldn't be granted. It wouldn't matter what doctor you went to.
If you want to fly you have to be fully cognizant of your surroundings (that's why the NIDA 5 are banned) and be fully physically capable of maintaining positive physical control of the aircraft at all times (that's why any motor depressant and a lot of blood pressure medications are banned).
Talk to your doctor about prescribing an allowed medication or forget flying.
We have enough people up there, who have lied on their history forms, falling out of the sky and screwing up landings and airplanes as it is.
Sorry to be so blunt but If I can't fly any more because of loss of sensation in my hands I don't see why anyone else should be allowed to fly if they have the possibility of loss of sensation in their heads...
Just having a love of flight doesn't make for the needed physical attributes to be allowed to do it... Smile/happy/getting dizzy


[Edited 2004-09-12 09:06:42]


One may educate the ignorance from the unknowing but stupid is forever. Boswell; ca: 1533
User currently offlineIllini_152 From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 1000 posts, RR: 2
Reply 2, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 18 hours ago) and read 3871 times:

I would join AOPA if I were you and give them a call, they can be very helpful in these matters, especially if you really don't know the ropes. From what I gathered from your post, your medical was defered to OKC, and later denied. Depending on your condition, you might be able to still get a 3rd class, but it depends, that's where AOPA can help, they have doctors on staff that can assist you with the red tape.

Remember- your AME is NOT your doctor. He/she is an agent of the FAA, and has their best interests at heart, not yours.

good luck



Happy contrails - I support B747Skipper and Jetguy
User currently offlineWoodreau From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 1038 posts, RR: 6
Reply 3, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 13 hours ago) and read 3846 times:

I was going to mention AOPA as well, there was an article last month about a guy who had heart problems, so his medical was suspended for a year, so he had to work to get his 3rd class medical again, but he worked with the FAA and now he's flying again with a 3rd class medical even with a heart bypass. I think it took him about a year or so to get medically cleared to fly again.

Granted that's not your situation but resolving medical issues will take time, and from what I gathered from the AOPA article is that you need to make sure that you get all the info to the FAA so that they can make a determination on your medical status, preferably a "med up" status. But you need to build your case as to why you are med up, getting the AME to work with you (if you can find one)

AOPA has the medical staff to help you out if you are an AOPA member.

All of this will take time. The FAA is a bureacracy (e.g. the 3 month wait to get your permanent pilot certificate) So it will take 2-3 months for the FAA to get to your case for review. If all your documentation is present, then you'll get an answer - hopefully in your favor, otherwise, they'll ask for more info and documentation. Then you'll have to get them the documentation, and it will be 2-3 months before the FAA will get back to your medical file... you get the picture.

But (just my opinion - everyone has one, just like everyone has an a$$hole) I think you need to find an AME who will work with you on resolving your medical issue. Get AOPA help to make sure you have all the proper paperwork to get medically cleared.

Also while you are still med down you can still fly with another pilot to stay current, you can't act as PIC, but you can still log PIC by being the sole manipulator of the controls as long as you are properly rated. (the author mentioned this in the article - he worked his instrument rating while his medical certificate was suspended - I haven't investigated it and don't know about all the legal minutae)

So good luck

Woodreau / KMVL

[Edited 2004-09-13 05:25:27]


Bonus animus sit, ab experientia. Quod salvatum fuerit de malis usu venit judicium.
User currently onlineKAUST From United States of America, joined Jun 2009, 95 posts, RR: 25
Reply 4, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 3837 times:

Thanks for the advice!

If I go through the doctors at AOPA would that be different than going through the doctors at Aviationmedicine.com? Plus, speaking of doctors, since it was mentioned that I find a flight surgeon would be willing to work with me, how do I know where to start? Just ask around FBO's, or?

Also, in response to you statement Woodreau about staying current, I have not even started yet, so though I be able to log hours flown with a CFI or non-CFI while I wait for it to clear up?

Thanks again -
KAUST



"Houston, this is Apollo 8. We are now in Lunar orbit."
User currently offlineIllini_152 From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 1000 posts, RR: 2
Reply 5, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 2 days 2 hours ago) and read 3808 times:

You'll still be able to fly with a CFI as a student without a medical. In the absence of advice from others as to which AME's are good and which are bad, I would look for the ones that have been practicing the longest. At school there were two AME's; the young guy was known for deferring EVERY little thing to OKC, while the older guy had been around the block before and knew what he could allow, and what needed to be deferred. AOPA should be able to help you find an AME as well, good luck.


Happy contrails - I support B747Skipper and Jetguy
User currently offlineWoodreau From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 1038 posts, RR: 6
Reply 6, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 3772 times:

I assumed that you were already a rated pilot... (I guess I shouldn't do that) You can still take lessons and can still log your time as dual received. You can't log PIC time since you aren't rated. But you won't be able to solo without that medical certificate. (my opinion here, if you're already denied, I am assuming again that you haven't spent much money towards flying, so you should clear up your medical situation before you spend any more money on flying...)

There is a sport pilot certificate (e.g. the driver license medical - if you have a driver license, then you can fly with that) that just became effective, but you would be ineligble for the sport pilot certificate as you've been denied a medical certficate. You can still fly gliders without a medical certificate.

AOPA will not get you your medical... they don't do any medical tests or anything. You still need to go to an AME, but AOPA can give you advice about your situation that is probably more relevant to you than what I or anyone here can give you.

As far as looking for an AME, you can ask around locally or you can look for one at http://ame.cami.jccbi.gov/ If you can't find any info as to which ones were good, you could call each one and ask if they would work with you to clear your situation.

From the AME's I've visited, it appears most AMEs do it on the side as well as their normal medical practice, it's just that they've gone the extra step and gotten FAA approval to do flight physicals.

Woodreau / KMVL



Bonus animus sit, ab experientia. Quod salvatum fuerit de malis usu venit judicium.
User currently onlineKAUST From United States of America, joined Jun 2009, 95 posts, RR: 25
Reply 7, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 15 hours ago) and read 3749 times:

So what is the best way to find people to ask at the FBO's? Is it easy to just walk in and speak to local pilots asking them their opinion on a good flight surgeon?

Or would it make more sense to call the different business, i.e. flight schools, and ask them that way?

Cheers -
KAUST



"Houston, this is Apollo 8. We are now in Lunar orbit."
User currently offlineIllini_152 From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 1000 posts, RR: 2
Reply 8, posted (9 years 11 months 3 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 3735 times:

Either way works, depends on the culture at your local airport. The place I learned to fly out of was a small rural uncontrolled field with one runway, and there were plenty of pilots hanging around most of the day. They all have an opinion about something. Go in one day and start asking around. If you're taking lessons, as your instructor who they'd recommend as well.

Once, I was on the road and needed a medical (don't ask...) but the problem was I have a condition that some AME's would defer, others would not. I already passed a second class with the condition, but didn't want to take the chace. So what I did was lookup the AME's in the area and went to the one that had been practicing the longest. Figured he'd seen enough to know what he could issue one for and what he couldn't. It worked, I got my medical, no questions asked.




Happy contrails - I support B747Skipper and Jetguy
User currently onlineKAUST From United States of America, joined Jun 2009, 95 posts, RR: 25
Reply 9, posted (9 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 20 hours ago) and read 3714 times:

So how would I be assured that the flight surgeon wouldn't laugh in my face when I explain my prediciment? Meaning since right now I am on FAA banned medications....or am I to assume the best thing to do would be to get off the medication altogether? Are there actually some flight surgeons whom are more liberal than others? I figure I might have at least a slight chance in that area, cause I passed the initial medical examination with flying colors all but for that one area.

KAUST



"Houston, this is Apollo 8. We are now in Lunar orbit."
User currently offlineIllini_152 From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 1000 posts, RR: 2
Reply 10, posted (9 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 19 hours ago) and read 3705 times:

It's hard to say really, that's why you should contact AOPA, they have a lot of experience dealing with this very thing, and explaining the whole situation to them will get you a lot more helpful advice.
http://www.aopa.org

Join, and give them a call. It depends on what the medication is for; diabetes or blood pressure, if you can get the underlying condition under control without medication, you might be able to get a 3rd class. Psycological problems, the FAA is less lenient towards. Generally, it isn't the medication that is banned, but the underlying condition that requires medication that is the problem.

Good luck,



Happy contrails - I support B747Skipper and Jetguy
User currently offlinePhilsquares From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 11, posted (9 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 18 hours ago) and read 3694 times:

First of all, don't get off the medication without consulting an physician!!

Various AMEs are not more or less liberal. What the real issue is some AMEs are more experienced in working with OKC and understand the ins and outs of getting a waiver.

If you're on medication for treatment of high blood pressure or diabetes or some similar physical condition, there may be an alternative medication which is approved by the FAA. However, if you are on medication for treatment of a psychological condition, for example depression or anxiety, then that is a more serious issue. Getting off the medication will not necessarily get you your medical. Most medications have a waiting period to judge any possible long term effects of the medication. Generally speaking, there are no medications approved by the FAA for treatment of those conditions.

Bottom line, get better then worry about your medical.


User currently onlineKAUST From United States of America, joined Jun 2009, 95 posts, RR: 25
Reply 12, posted (9 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 12 hours ago) and read 3677 times:

How about ultra-lights? Is a medical certificate needed for those?




"Houston, this is Apollo 8. We are now in Lunar orbit."
User currently offlineIllini_152 From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 1000 posts, RR: 2
Reply 13, posted (9 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 3672 times:

14 CFR 103.7 (c)
Notwithstanding any other section pertaining to airman certificiation, operators of ultralight aircraft are not required to... have airman or medical certificates.


So, no with an ultralight you don't need a medical. Nor do you need one to operate a glider. However, something to keep in mind, if you don't meet the medical requirements to fly an airplane, should you be flying at all? The reason the exception is made for ultralights is because you pose very little risk to the public if something happens and you crash.

Food for thought.



Happy contrails - I support B747Skipper and Jetguy
User currently onlineKAUST From United States of America, joined Jun 2009, 95 posts, RR: 25
Reply 14, posted (9 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 3670 times:

Heck I had been driving and boating now for years and years with no problems. I even have a couple of night time solo boating credits to my name. Not to sound paranoid but I think I am partly the exception in the rule. There are always exceptions, even with medication and medical conditions, nothing is set into stone.

KAUST



"Houston, this is Apollo 8. We are now in Lunar orbit."
User currently offlinePhilsquares From , joined Dec 1969, posts, RR:
Reply 15, posted (9 years 11 months 2 weeks 6 days 11 hours ago) and read 3669 times:

KAUST, please remember the FAA and for that fact, all regulatory bodies make regulations for the lowest common denominator. If a certain medication has side effects, even though you don't think you have them, clinical trials have shown a certain percentage of people do exhibit those side effects.

That's why it's important to work with your AME. Although he might not prescribe the medication, he will know the effects and the FAA's position. He might be able to work with your physician who is medicating you and get another drug prescribed.

Unfortunately, this is set in stone.


User currently offlineBrons2 From United States of America, joined Sep 2001, 3013 posts, RR: 4
Reply 16, posted (9 years 11 months 2 weeks 5 days 14 hours ago) and read 3626 times:

Where can one find a list of approved medications for various conditions?

Just kind of curious.



Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
User currently offlineIllini_152 From United States of America, joined Jan 2001, 1000 posts, RR: 2
Reply 17, posted (9 years 11 months 2 weeks 5 days 13 hours ago) and read 3621 times:

http://www.leftseat.com/medcat1.htm

Fairly complete list, interesting to find what cold medications are approved...




Happy contrails - I support B747Skipper and Jetguy
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