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LAN Chile, Business Class - A340-300: MAD To FRA  
User currently offlineknightsofmalta From Malta, joined Nov 2005, 1750 posts, RR: 18
Posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 20931 times:

INTRODUCTION

In 2012 I spent the Easter break in the city of Cordoba in Spain. For my return home I picked the last scheduled Korean Air flight from Madrid to Amsterdam. The day after, Korean Air would operate to both Madrid and Amsterdam as nonstop services. Quite by coincidence I decided to spend the Easter of 2013 in Spain again – this time visiting the city of Toledo, 70 kilometres away from Madrid. For the return I decided to fly from Madrid to Frankfurt with LAN Chile. Quite by coincidence, I only realised when I got on board that mine would be the last flight from Santiago de Chile via Madrid to Frankfurt. Originally, LAN had planned to operate a daily nonstop service with the B 787 to Frankfurt with the beginning of the summer schedule 2013. The worldwide grounding of the B 787 fleet obviously put an end to those plans. However, one of the flight attendants on my flight did mention that LAN would only be suspending Frankfurt for three months and would resume the destination once they had received ‘the new product’. So I can only assume that LAN is expecting the B 787 to be operational within the next three months. We shall see…

LAN AIRLINES 3 col-fblanco

Airline: LAN Chile
Aircraft: Airbus A 340-300
From: Madrid
To: Frankfurt
Cabin Class: Business
Seat: 1C, aisle
Date: 31 March 2013


GETTING TO THE AIRPORT

Toledo station is a truly remarkable building. It resembles a mosque more than it does a public building, with many Moorish influences incorporated in the structure.

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My train leaves at 10h25 and takes 32 minutes to complete the journey of 70 kilometres from Toledo to Madrid’s Atocha terminus.

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At Atocha I change trains to the suburban line that goes to Madrid airport’s new T4.

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CHECK-IN

T4 really is a remarkable building. It’s also quite remarkable that the facility is in fact way to big for the amount of traffic it handles. But perhaps it’s just because of the Easter weekend. Let’s give them the benefit of the doubt.

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I make my way up three or four floors – I stopped counting – to the check-in level for LAN, which has quite an extensive operation here in Madrid.

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A ground agent guides me to the check-in counters for Business Class passengers, where I am issued my boarding pass for the flight to Frankfurt straight away. I am then given instructions on how to reach the satellite, from where my flight will be leaving.

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The satellite is accessed by an underground automated shuttle, which means that I will have to take the escalators all the way down into the basement again to catch the shuttle and then up again on the other side. This place is simply massive.

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THE LOUNGE

LAN being a member of the Oneworld alliance means that I can use the Iberia lounge and I must say, it really is a very nice place. The lounge is quite large, has a good selection of food and drinks and offers some excellent views of the apron. My only complaint is that wifi access is limited to thirty minutes at a time and you have to get a scratch card from reception to gain access.

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DEPARTURE

Eventually my flight shows up on the screen as ‘Embarque’ – boarding - so I make my way to the gate.

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By the time I get there, boarding has already started. There is a separate line for Business Class passengers but it is cordoned off. ‘No such luck’ me thinks, when one of the gate agents sees me standing there. She greets me, scans by boarding pass and lets me through, wishing me a pleasant trip in the process.

THE CABIN

The bulkhead on this bird has a finish that it supposed to make it look like wood panelling, which obviously it is not. But even so, somehow it doesn’t look that bad. The seat covers are a dark grey colour, which goes quite well with the red tone of the faux wood bulkhead. The seat itself has a lot in common with the model Iberia has installed on its A 340s.

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THE CREW

The crew on this flight is a mixed bag. The men generally seem much friendlier than the ladies on this flight. It’s not that the females are rude or anything, they just seem a bit standoffish. The lead flight attendant in Business Class is a middle-aged female who speaks close to no English at all, which I find rather strange for an airline operating internationally. I also think her lack of English could potentially be a safety concern, particularly in case of a medical emergency or the likes.

SERVICE

This flight very much has the feel of a long-haul flight, which essentially it is, even though I only boarded in Madrid and the flight to Frankfurt is only two hours. When I arrive at my seat, there is a fresh set of earphones in one of the seat pockets in the side of the seat.

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And later on during the flight, once the meal service is over, I ask for a blanket and receive – much to my surprise – a proper duvet cover instead.

As soon as I am comfortably settled in my seat, a friendly young man arrives with a tray of drinks and warm nuts. On offer today we have champagne, water or something called a pisco sour. I decide to make an exception from my usual habit of not drinking any alcohol on a plane and try the Pisco sour, which is in fact quite tasty (although I’m still not quite sure what it is).

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After that a selection of magazines is offered. Apart form the usual offerings like The Economist and Time Magazine, there is also a good selection if German magazines like Der Spiegel.

Departure is one time and the take-off roll is unusually nimble for an A 340-300.

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THE MEAL

As soon as we’re airborne, the meal service starts straight away. We begin with warm towels. They are not scented. Quite the contrary, they have a strong pong of chlorine.

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Then the table is set with a tablecloth.

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The meal itself is somewhat underwhelming and there are no choices.

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It consists of:

  • A mixed salad with slices of cold pork and an apple chutney.

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  • A plate of cheese.

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  • A bowl of fresh melon and pineapple.

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  • A small piece of Lindt dark chocolate.

  • A selection of warm bread.

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To drink my neighbour orders a still water, while I ask for a glass of sparkling water with ice. But seemingly it is too much to ask to expect the flight attendant to remember two items at a time and so we both end up with just a glass of warm still water.

On a positive note, LAN use these huge mugs for their tea and coffee service. Pity the coffee itself is so vile!

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After the meal I put the seat into sleep mode, cover up with the duvet and doze off until it’s time for us to land in Frankfurt.

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ARRIVAL

Arrival in Frankfurt is pretty much on time. We land on the new runway, from where it's quite a trek to our final parking position at terminal 2.

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CONCLUSION

So what did I think of LAN Chile? As I said, the flight certainly had the feel of a long-haul service about it, which is always nice. The crew were much more personable and friendly than the ones I had on Iberia and I think it is quite clear that LAN goes out of its way to reach out to its customers and tries to provide good service. Did they succeed? They were okay, in fact for a short-haul European sector I think they were more than okay. But then again that’s hardly a fair comparison.

34 replies: All unread, showing first 25:
 
User currently offlinedcajet From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 419 posts, RR: 4
Reply 1, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 19878 times:

Quoting knightsofmalta (Thread starter):
The lead flight attendant in Business Class is a middle-aged female who speaks close to no English at all, which I find rather strange for an airline operating internationally. I also think her lack of English could potentially be a safety concern, particularly in case of a medical emergency or the likes.

I find your comment rather "anglo-centric". She is from Chile, where Spanish is spoken. Cut her a break. Would you have made the same comment if you flew BA, where very few of the their cabin staff speak anything but English? Or any US airline? I suppose no, because they speak your language.

Quote:
try the Pisco sour, which is in fact quite tasty (although I’m still not quite sure what it is).

Pisco is a grape brandy produced in Chile and Peru. Pisco sour is a cocktail made with pisco, sours and sweeteners.

Regards,



"Unattended children will be given espresso and a free kitten"
User currently offlineknightsofmalta From Malta, joined Nov 2005, 1750 posts, RR: 18
Reply 2, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 19832 times:

Hi dcjet

Thanks for dropping in.

Quoting dcajet (Reply 1):
I find your comment rather "anglo-centric". She is from Chile, where Spanish is spoken. Cut her a break. Would you have made the same comment if you flew BA, where very few of the their cabin staff speak anything but English? Or any US airline? I suppose no, because they speak your language.

I beg to differ, I think I don't have a cultural bias. If I may:
http://www.zhaw.ch/en/zurich-univers...for-aviation-language/testing.html

I'll try not to go off on a tangent...For every communicative act meaning has to be negotiated between the interlocutors in oder to achieve successful communication. In aeronautical communication lives depend on that. Both native and non-native speakers share the burden and the responsibility of achieving successful communication.

Quoting dcajet (Reply 1):
Pisco is a grape brandy produced in Chile and Peru. Pisco sour is a cocktail made with pisco, sours and sweeteners.

Thanks for the clarification. I rather liked it AND it didn't give me a fat head.

Cheers,
William


User currently offlinedcajet From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 419 posts, RR: 4
Reply 3, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 19779 times:

Quoting knightsofmalta (Reply 2):
I beg to differ, I think I don't have a cultural bias. If I may:
http://www.zhaw.ch/en/zurich-univers...for-aviation-language/testing.html

I'll try not to go off on a tangent...For every communicative act meaning has to be negotiated between the interlocutors in order to achieve successful communication. In aeronautical communication lives depend on that. Both native and non-native speakers share the burden and the responsibility of achieving successful communication.

That is all fine and dandy on paper if a bit of ivory tower speak. But, and I don't meant to be argumentative, would you have made the same comment had you flown BA, Qantas or Delta?

And if the knife cuts both ways, did you share the burden and tried to speak Spanish with her? After all, it is a Chilean airline, where Spanish is spoken, on a flight from Madrid, where Spanish is spoken to Frankfurt, where German is spoken.

Now, I will give you this - Lan Chile has a reputation for not having the most linguistically diverse flight attendants in the business. They speak your language as long as you speak Spanish.

[Edited 2013-04-06 00:36:19]


"Unattended children will be given espresso and a free kitten"
User currently offlineknightsofmalta From Malta, joined Nov 2005, 1750 posts, RR: 18
Reply 4, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 14 hours ago) and read 19772 times:

Hi dcjet

Quoting dcajet (Reply 3):
But, and I don't meant to be argumentative, would you have made the same comment had you flown BA, Qantas or Delta?

If the BA crew had, for example, a heavy Scottish accent or the Delta crew had a pronounced southern drawl: yes!


User currently offline767747 From United States of America, joined Jan 2005, 1911 posts, RR: 24
Reply 5, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days 8 hours ago) and read 19287 times:
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Good report, knightsofmalta!

Interesting to read a report of Lan Chile's service in Business on a short flight. Food looks pretty good in my mind - but I've heard mixed reviews of Lan before especially the mistake when it came to your requested drinks.

How nice though to get on an A340 for such a short ride!

Matthew (767747)


User currently offlineba319-131 From United Kingdom, joined Jan 2001, 8483 posts, RR: 55
Reply 6, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 3 days ago) and read 18627 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Nice report and pictures, thanks for sharing.

Quoting knightsofmalta (Thread starter):
THE LOUNGE

LAN being a member of the Oneworld alliance means that I can use the Iberia lounge and I must say, it really is a very nice place. The lounge is quite large, has a good selection of food and drinks and offers some excellent views of the apron. My only complaint is that wifi access is limited to thirty minutes at a time and you have to get a scratch card from reception to gain access.

- I love this IB lounge, great views, good F&B offerings, never tried the wifi mind, does seem a daft set up they have here.

Quoting knightsofmalta (Thread starter):
We begin with warm towels. They are not scented. Quite the contrary, they have a strong pong of chlorine.

- Yuck!

Quoting knightsofmalta (Thread starter):
The meal itself is somewhat underwhelming and there are no choices.

- IMO for a flight of this duration the meal looks AOK.

I had a great flight on a LAN in JCL a few years back, though like you it was quite short, would love to try them longhaul in JCL.

Cheers

Mark



111,732,3,4,5,7,8,BBJ,741,742,743,744,752,762,763,764,772,773,77W,L15,D10,30,40,AB3,AB6,A312.313,319,320,321,332,333,342
User currently offlinemoby147 From UK - England, joined Mar 2013, 50 posts, RR: 0
Reply 7, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 23 hours ago) and read 18586 times:

Super report, knightsofmalta,

I have never flown with LAN but the service looks very good & much better that most European carriers would provide on a short haul.

Thanks for taking the time

Regards

Moby147


User currently offlineAR385 From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 6124 posts, RR: 30
Reply 8, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 21 hours ago) and read 18409 times:
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Quoting EASTERN747 (Reply 8):
And I'm mute and can't ask for a correction....

That´s not it, you see. The problem was he doesn´t speak Spanish and the Chilean F/A, audaciously, spoke close to no English.



MGGS
User currently offlinetoobz From Finland, joined Jan 2010, 766 posts, RR: 0
Reply 9, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 20 hours ago) and read 18297 times:

Thanks for the report!
Not sure why some people are being negative towards your comments..
I found your observations totally acceptable. A lead flying Intl routes on an Intl carrier should have enough
English skills to converse and take orders. The OP wasn't suggesting they should be native english speakers.

Very impressive short haul flight I should say!
Thanks again for taking the time.


User currently offlineknightsofmalta From Malta, joined Nov 2005, 1750 posts, RR: 18
Reply 10, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 17985 times:

Hi Mark

Quoting ba319-131 (Reply 6):
- I love this IB lounge, great views, good F&B offerings, never tried the wifi mind, does seem a daft set up they have here.

The strange things about the internet was that when you went back to the desk after half an hour, they would simply hand you a new scratch card without any hesitation. But as you say, other than that the lounge is fantastic!

Quoting ba319-131 (Reply 6):
- IMO for a flight of this duration the meal looks AOK.

Well I guess so, perhaps I was just expecting something else because of the long-haulesque set up of the flight.

Quoting ba319-131 (Reply 6):
I had a great flight on a LAN in JCL a few years back, though like you it was quite short, would love to try them longhaul in JCL.

Funny you should say that. I'm toying with the idea of taking them to Chile, perhaps the Easter Islands or so...

Hi Moby147

Quoting moby147 (Reply 7):
I have never flown with LAN but the service looks very good & much better that most European carriers would provide on a short haul.

Yes, all in all I would agree. They certainly have the advantage operating a widebody on this route.

Hi Toobz

Quoting toobz (Reply 11):
Not sure why some people are being negative towards your comments..

Never mind, everyone's entitled to their own opinion.

Quoting toobz (Reply 11):
Very impressive short haul flight I should say!

The only thing I've been wondering about is whether this was the standard short-haul service offered by LAN that you would also get if you flew for example from Santiago to Buenos Aires, or if this was something else because it's a tag-on to a long-haul service.

Well, thanks to all for taking the time to comment.

Cheers,
William


User currently offlineTheCommodore From Australia, joined Dec 2007, 2716 posts, RR: 8
Reply 11, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 12 hours ago) and read 17841 times:

Quoting dcajet (Reply 3):
They speak your language as long as you speak Spanish.

Sorry, but not good enough !

LAN is an international airline. plain and simple.

Quoting knightsofmalta (Reply 4):
Hi dcjet

Great report, enjoyed all the detail.



Flown 905,468 kms or 2.356 times to the moon, 1296 hrs, Longest flight 10,524 kms
User currently offlinereifel From Germany, joined Feb 2005, 1326 posts, RR: 1
Reply 12, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 4 hours ago) and read 17359 times:

Hi, seems you had a nice flight for such a short hop. Considering LH isasking a fortune for C and offer a regular economy class seat, this is sooo much better .Food looked adequate as well.

Quoting knightsofmalta (Thread starter):
LAN being a member of the Oneworld alliance means that I can use the Iberia lounge and I must say, it really is a very nice place. The lounge is quite large, has a good selection of food and drinks and offers some excellent views of the apron. My only complaint is that wifi access is limited to thirty minutes at a time and you have to get a scratch card from reception to gain access.

Yes, all lounges in MAD have this issue, also the third party lounges. The IB lounge looks pretty nice. I always used third party ones, and they're just awful. Those in T2/3 may be acceptable (although old and lacking snacks), those in T4 are awful and overcrowded.


User currently offlineDCAjet From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 419 posts, RR: 4
Reply 13, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 2 days 3 hours ago) and read 17285 times:

Quoting knightsofmalta (Reply 12):
The only thing I've been wondering about is whether this was the standard short-haul service offered by LAN that you would also get if you flew for example from Santiago to Buenos Aires, or if this was something else because it's a tag-on to a long-haul service.

Well, thanks to all for taking the time to comment.

Here's a trip report in Spanish (not mine) from a similar site from Argentina, showing a LAN flight from SCL to EZE on the 787.

http://www.aeropuertosarg.com.ar/losforos/index.php?topic=22483.0

I have flown a few times their GRU-AEP service (it is GRU-EZE now), but it was on the A320, and on LAN Argentina. It features a business cabin a la European, meaning, neither a dedicated cabin, nor business class seats. If memory serves, the meals were what you would expect from LAN: decent quality but with no fuss.



"Unattended children will be given espresso and a free kitten"
User currently offlinesultanils From Belgium, joined Mar 2010, 1650 posts, RR: 30
Reply 14, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 16559 times:
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Hello William,

I knew somehow that once I would be able to read a C class review of you on this route. So thanks for flying it and reporting on it. This popular 5th freedom is certainly a good way to sample LAN’s product. By the looks of it, it’s a rather average one, at least in business. Still, the major bonus for me here would be the A340, regardless of the cabin or service level . I’d like to do this one in the future but looking at prices it seems I’ll have to postpone my intention until next year  

Quoting knightsofmalta (Thread starter):
My only complaint is that wifi access is limited to thirty minutes at a time and you have to get a scratch card from reception to gain access.

That’s very poor for a flagship lounge if you ask me.

Quoting knightsofmalta (Thread starter):
She greets me, scans by boarding pass and lets me through, wishing me a pleasant trip in the process.

So did you then get in by the ‘proper’ lane?

Quoting knightsofmalta (Thread starter):
The lead flight attendant in Business Class is a middle-aged female who speaks close to no English at all, which I find rather strange for an airline operating internationally.

One would expect a lead FA in a premium cabin to be able to express herself a bit better in a foreign language, notably English here.

Quoting knightsofmalta (Thread starter):
Quite the contrary, they have a strong pong of chlorine.

It’s good to know that indeed the towel was sterilized but a scent of chlorine is not so nice…

Sultanils



In thrust we trust.
User currently offlinetheobcman From UK - England, joined Nov 2010, 140 posts, RR: 0
Reply 15, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 7 hours ago) and read 16314 times:

Really good report - enjoyed it. Nice to experience long haul service on short haul flight !

I also absolutely agree with you - its nothing to do with 'cultural bias' - an international airline flying within Europe should have a lead attendent with a least some spoken English.

Well done.


User currently offlinegabo787 From United Kingdom, joined Sep 2006, 154 posts, RR: 0
Reply 16, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 5 hours ago) and read 16199 times:

Quoting knightsofmalta (Thread starter):
The lead flight attendant in Business Class is a middle-aged female who speaks close to no English at all, which I find rather strange for an airline operating internationally. I also think her lack of English could potentially be a safety concern, particularly in case of a medical emergency or the likes.

My native language is Spanish and I been in flights with BA, KL, and AF to say a few from Europe to South America and return both in business with crews that spoke very little to no Spanish at all. Usually there is always at least one that speak the language properly in the plane so in case of a medical emergency they can manage the situation.
I had the exact opposite situation in LA, AR and AV to name a few too, one maybe two of the crew speak good English and the rest not that well or not at all.
I guess that is a common occurrence in most airlines nowadays.


User currently offlineglobalflyer From United States of America, joined Dec 2005, 924 posts, RR: 3
Reply 17, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 1 day 3 hours ago) and read 16050 times:

Hi William. Great TR as usual. I hear that this route will be discontinued soon so kudos for grabbing it! I really would love to try LA...they always seem to escape me! WOW! MAD looks enormous! Easy to get lost!


Landing on every Continent almost on an annual basis!
User currently offlinedcajet From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 419 posts, RR: 4
Reply 18, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 21 hours ago) and read 15851 times:

Quoting globalflyer (Reply 17):
hear that this route will be discontinued soon so kudos for grabbing it! I really would love to try LA...they always seem to escape me! WOW! MAD looks enormous! Easy to get lost!

FRA is already gone from the LAN map as of 3/31. It is supposed to be resumed in July with the 787, via MAD. However, things are still in a state of flux, not only because of the uncertainty around the 787 but also as LATAM accommodates its schedules. Rumor has it LA will be dropping FRA for good - and using TAM from GRU or GIG for flights to/from FRA.



"Unattended children will be given espresso and a free kitten"
User currently offlineknightsofmalta From Malta, joined Nov 2005, 1750 posts, RR: 18
Reply 19, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 16 hours ago) and read 15654 times:

Hello all,

Thanks for all the comments, I didn't realise my comments about the language issue would provoke such an interesting debate. I like it.

Hi Commodore

Quoting TheCommodore (Reply 11):
Great report, enjoyed all the detail.

Thanks, glad you enjoyed the report.

Hi Reifel

Quoting reifel (Reply 12):
Hi, seems you had a nice flight for such a short hop. Considering LH isasking a fortune for C and offer a regular economy class seat, this is sooo much better .Food looked adequate as well.

That's precisely it! It may not have been perfect as an experience, but it sure beats the narrowbody experience!

Quoting reifel (Reply 12):
The IB lounge looks pretty nice. I always used third party ones, and they're just awful. Those in T2/3 may be acceptable (although old and lacking snacks), those in T4 are awful and overcrowded.

Have you ever been to the one Korean Air uses in the old non-Schengen part? Great views of the apron and loads of place to sit. Not much food though.

Hi DCAjet

Quoting DCAjet (Reply 13):
Here's a trip report in Spanish (not mine) from a similar site from Argentina, showing a LAN flight from SCL to EZE on the 787.
Quoting DCAjet (Reply 13):
I have flown a few times their GRU-AEP service (it is GRU-EZE now), but it was on the A320, and on LAN Argentina. It features a business cabin a la European, meaning, neither a dedicated cabin, nor business class seats. If memory serves, the meals were what you would expect from LAN: decent quality but with no fuss.

Thanks for the information. How does LAN compare to the competition in the region? My impression has always been that they have the lead in and to SA in terms of service standards and quality.

Hi Nils

Quoting sultanils (Reply 14):
I knew somehow that once I would be able to read a C class review of you on this route.

Not quite sure what makes you say that...

Quoting sultanils (Reply 14):
That’s very poor for a flagship lounge if you ask me.

The food more than made up for it!

Quoting sultanils (Reply 14):
So did you then get in by the ‘proper’ lane?

No, she opened the priority lane specially for me.

Quoting sultanils (Reply 14):
It’s good to know that indeed the towel was sterilized but a scent of chlorine is not so nice…

My sentiment exactly!

Hi obcman

Quoting theobcman (Reply 15):
Really good report - enjoyed it. Nice to experience long haul service on short haul flight !

Thanks! It was a fun experience I must say. Like going on a long-haul trip but without jetlag!

Hi gabo787

Quoting gabo787 (Reply 16):
My native language is Spanish and I been in flights with BA, KL, and AF to say a few from Europe to South America and return both in business with crews that spoke very little to no Spanish at all. Usually there is always at least one that speak the language properly in the plane so in case of a medical emergency they can manage the situation.
I had the exact opposite situation in LA, AR and AV to name a few too, one maybe two of the crew speak good English and the rest not that well or not at all.
I guess that is a common occurrence in most airlines nowadays.

You'e quite right. Many European carriers have Asian staff working on their routes, for exmaple. Of course it's a language issue, but obviously it's also a cost issue. Their salaries are usually much lower than those in Europe.

Hi globalflyer

Quoting globalflyer (Reply 17):
Hi William. Great TR as usual. I hear that this route will be discontinued soon so kudos for grabbing it! I really would love to try LA...they always seem to escape me! WOW! MAD looks enormous! Easy to get lost!

Thanks, glad you enjoyed it. I was really lucky to catch this flight. I hadn't heard they'd be discontinuing the route until I boarded.

Quoting dcajet (Reply 18):
FRA is already gone from the LAN map as of 3/31. It is supposed to be resumed in July with the 787, via MAD. However, things are still in a state of flux, not only because of the uncertainty around the 787 but also as LATAM accommodates its schedules. Rumor has it LA will be dropping FRA for good - and using TAM from GRU or GIG for flights to/from FRA.

That would be a real shame. So would the B787 then go to Madrid instead or would that stay a A340?

Thanks to all for taking the time to comment. It's much appreciated.

Cheers,
William


User currently offlinedcajet From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 419 posts, RR: 4
Reply 20, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks 13 hours ago) and read 15564 times:

Quoting knightsofmalta (Reply 19):
Thanks for the information. How does LAN compare to the competition in the region? My impression has always been that they have the lead in and to SA in terms of service standards and quality.

LAN has good service, but it is nothing to write home about. Don't forget that in the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king.

Now, as a business, LAN is brilliantly run. Service wise, a few notches about mediocre, but with as much warmth as a cold winter in Patagonia.

Quote:
That would be a real shame. So would the B787 then go to Madrid instead or would that stay a A340?

The 340s are on their way out; in fact our of 5, one has left the fleet. CC-CQG is gone and is being picked up by SAS.

Now, with the 787 soap opera still unresolved, LAN needs the 340s for the South Pole route. So they may get a reprieve after all.

Currently LAN shows Frankfurt being reinstated 7/1/13, with the 787. I would not put money on that. Speaking the other day with friends in Chile I confirm my suspicion that FRA may be ditched in the very near future for good. At this time, it is mostly a 5th freedom shuttle between MAD and FRA. That 787 can be flown way more profitably back in the Americas.



"Unattended children will be given espresso and a free kitten"
User currently onlineEddieDude From Mexico, joined Nov 2003, 7560 posts, RR: 43
Reply 21, posted (1 year 3 months 2 weeks ago) and read 15202 times:

What a great trip report Knightsofmalta! I found it very enjoyable. It was great reading it back-to-back with your piece on IB's LHR A346 flight... quite a good way to make a comparo. LA definitely looks good in J-class. Even if it is not a standard-setting airline globally speaking, it sort of is the yardstick by which all Latin carriers are measured by.

Quoting dcajet (Reply 1):
Pisco sour is a cocktail made with pisco, sours and sweeteners.

Egg whites and lime juice maybe?



Next flights: MEX-GRU (AM 77E), GRU-GIG (JJ A320), SDU-CGH (G3 73H), GRU-MEX (JJ A332).
User currently offlinedcajet From United States of America, joined Aug 2004, 419 posts, RR: 4
Reply 22, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 22 hours ago) and read 15090 times:

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 21):

Quoting dcajet (Reply 1):Pisco sour is a cocktail made with pisco, sours and sweeteners.

Egg whites and lime juice maybe?

Depends on the country of recipe: Chile and Peru have different recipes and a bitter rivalry as to where it comes from and which one is better tasting. Peruvians also add bitters, Chileans don't. Lime juice is THE sour.

Cheers,



"Unattended children will be given espresso and a free kitten"
User currently offlinesultanils From Belgium, joined Mar 2010, 1650 posts, RR: 30
Reply 23, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 6 days 14 hours ago) and read 14891 times:
Support Airliners.net - become a First Class Member!

Quoting knightsofmalta (Reply 19):
Not quite sure what makes you say that...

Well, you've done some 5th freedom flights intra-Europe in business class and this (popular) one has not appeared as of yet, hence raising my suspicion on that  

Sultanils



In thrust we trust.
User currently offlineMSS658 From Belgium, joined Oct 2010, 2474 posts, RR: 15
Reply 24, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 5 days 4 hours ago) and read 14388 times:

Hi William


Great report, thanks for sharing it. Great to see some long haul service on this shorter MAD-FRA service.
Planning to take this route sooner or later as well when it comes availible again.

Greetings
Marc



Next trip report: Well worn A330s and Hassle free MUC transfer
User currently offlinePlaneHunter From Germany, joined Mar 2006, 6714 posts, RR: 78
Reply 25, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 3 days 13 hours ago) and read 14093 times:

Hi William,

and I also enjoyed this one! Good idea to try LA's J Class product on that route. I have done that in Y Class, but I may look at J Class once the 787 starts operating on the route.

Quoting knightsofmalta (Thread starter):
I decide to make an exception from my usual habit of not drinking any alcohol on a plane and try the Pisco sour, which is in fact quite tasty (although I’m still not quite sure what it is).

Interesting, I'll keep that one in mind.

Quoting knightsofmalta (Thread starter):
Apart form the usual offerings like The Economist and Time Magazine, there is also a good selection if German magazines like Der Spiegel.

Spiegel? No thanks. But unfortunately, other German magazines and many newspapers aren't better. At least there's still the FAZ.


PH



Nothing's worse than flying the same reg twice!
User currently offlineabrelosojos From Venezuela, joined May 2005, 5073 posts, RR: 55
Reply 26, posted (1 year 3 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 13680 times:

What a great report. I found it to be very objective and you praised LAN in areas where it deserves praise and criticized it in places where it deserves so.

Don't take it personally. I have stopped commenting on many Latin threads because the level of national flag waving amongst SOME members is a bit off-putting for me. I am multi-national (!), but have a Venezuelan parent, and am very proud of Venezuela. I just do not see the need to say "it is the best country in the world" ..

More importantly, I think English is the global language, and ANY MAJOR airline should have competent English speakers. This is MORE SO when the airline is operating an intercontinental route and claims to be global. I can forgive the TA crew I had yesterday for their "interesting English" on a domestic Peru flight, but on a MAD-FRA routing, there is no excuse.

English among crews here in Latin America is on par with the Chinese. I find LAN to be the worst of them all. Besides, there is arrogance among them which does not make it better. It could be though that even as a native speaker, I sometimes have no idea what Chileans are saying in Spanish  .

Things are improving. Recently, I have found COPA and TACA to have invested significantly in English training.

Quoting knightsofmalta (Thread starter):
the Pisco sour, which is in fact quite tasty (although I%u2019m still not quite sure what it is).

= Next time, try it in Peru. Infinitely better, and done proper!

Quoting theobcman (Reply 15):
I also absolutely agree with you - its nothing to do with 'cultural bias' - an international airline flying within Europe should have a lead attendent with a least some spoken English.

= Well said.

Thanks again for writing this up.

Saludos,
Alex



Live, and let live.
User currently offlineanstar From United Kingdom, joined Nov 2003, 5158 posts, RR: 6
Reply 27, posted (1 year 3 months 4 days 5 hours ago) and read 13035 times:

Quoting dcajet (Reply 3):
And if the knife cuts both ways, did you share the burden and tried to speak Spanish with her? After all, it is a Chilean airline, where Spanish is spoken, on a flight from Madrid, where Spanish is spoken to Frankfurt, where German is spoken.

Ok - did she speak good german too? By that thesis she should have. However english is pretty widely spoken and epxected to be a given by a lot of international airlines. I fly KLM quite a bit for example and then flying between say holland and greece, english would be the common language spoken.... hence why the saftey demo is in English/Dutch.


User currently offlineknightsofmalta From Malta, joined Nov 2005, 1750 posts, RR: 18
Reply 28, posted (1 year 3 months 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 12912 times:

Hi dcjet

Quoting dcajet (Reply 20):
Now, as a business, LAN is brilliantly run. Service wise, a few notches about mediocre, but with as much warmth as a cold winter in Patagonia.

You made me laugh. LAN's management sound like a lovely bunch of people. Still, it looks like they do know what they're doing.

Quoting dcajet (Reply 20):
The 340s are on their way out; in fact our of 5, one has left the fleet. CC-CQG is gone and is being picked up by SAS.

Thanks for the clarification. So I guess that's where SK is getting the bird to do SFO.

Quoting dcajet (Reply 20):
Currently LAN shows Frankfurt being reinstated 7/1/13, with the 787. I would not put money on that. Speaking the other day with friends in Chile I confirm my suspicion that FRA may be ditched in the very near future for good. At this time, it is mostly a 5th freedom shuttle between MAD and FRA. That 787 can be flown way more profitably back in the Americas.

But how come? Is the route doing so badly? As far as I know LH don't fly direct to SCL, so if LAN could do it with the 787 they'd have a great advantage over the mighty Lufthansa. It would certainly be a pity. It's a cool flight.

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 21):
What a great trip report Knightsofmalta!

Hi Eddie, thank you. Glad you enjoyed it.

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 21):
LA definitely looks good in J-class. Even if it is not a standard-setting airline globally speaking, it sort of is the yardstick by which all Latin carriers are measured by.

Well, I guess it wasn't anything standard-setting. Then again if the 787 were flying, they'd be offering a much more advance product.

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 21):
Egg whites and lime juice maybe?

Egg white? Not sure about that. At least I think then it would have been a thicker liquid.

Quoting dcajet (Reply 22):
Depends on the country of recipe: Chile and Peru have different recipes and a bitter rivalry as to where it comes from and which one is better tasting. Peruvians also add bitters, Chileans don't. Lime juice is THE sour.

Well, whatever it was, it was rather tasty.

Quoting sultanils (Reply 23):
Well, you've done some 5th freedom flights intra-Europe in business class and this (popular) one has not appeared as of yet, hence raising my suspicion on that

Hi Nils
That's quite observant indeed. Yes, originally I wanted to do some experimenting this year. But now I'm flying so often on business that I hardly have the time.

Quoting MSS658 (Reply 24):
Great report, thanks for sharing it.

Hi Marc, thanks a lot.

Quoting MSS658 (Reply 24):
Planning to take this route sooner or later as well when it comes availible again.

Hopefully it will make a return after all. If the 787 makes one, that is.

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 25):
and I also enjoyed this one!

Hi Udo, thanks. Glad you enjoyed the report.

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 25):
I may look at J Class once the 787 starts operating on the route.

A next airliners.net outing?

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 26):
What a great report. I found it to be very objective and you praised LAN in areas where it deserves praise and criticized it in places where it deserves so.

Hi A.
Thanks. Always good to read something like that coming from the expert.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 26):
Don't take it personally.

Thanks for the encouragement. It was not my intention to hurt anybody's feelings. I deal with aeronautical communication professionally. So perhaps I have a bit of an obsession about the subject.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 26):
= Next time, try it in Peru. Infinitely better, and done proper!

Looks like I'm going to have to go Peru.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 26):
Thanks again for writing this up.

My pleasure, thanks for commenting.

Hi Anstar

Quoting anstar (Reply 27):
However english is pretty widely spoken and epxected to be a given by a lot of international airlines.

One of the ICAO Annexes (can't remember which right now, either Annex 1 or Annex 10) states that for the purpose of radiotelephony communication either English should be used or the language spoken on the ground. So it's not that only English may be spoken. But if everything else fails, there should still be a possibility to revert to English to achieve successful communication.

Thanks to all for taking the time to comment. It's much appreciated.

Cheers,
William


User currently offlineRogerbcn From Andorra, joined Sep 2006, 1197 posts, RR: 20
Reply 29, posted (1 year 3 months 2 days 15 hours ago) and read 12550 times:

Hola William!

Thanks for your nice report on this flight. Really great to see LAN on European skies on this short route.

The IB lounge at MAD is very nice, I have been there a couple of times and it is certainly a great experience, although it tends to be crowded during the peak hours and it is difficult to find a place to seat, the food is great and the wine offers are very good. I did not know about the 30 min. curfew for wifi which is quite ridiculous, IMO.

The cabin on LAN business looks nice but I surprised about what you said regarding English skills of the purser, I thought it was a must to speak, at least, English to become a flight attendant, let alone a purser.

The seat is very similar to IB's one, I have tried it to EZE, ORD and LAX and it is very comfortable and really wide; sleeping is another issue, but it has to do with my inability to sleep on planes more than the seat itself.

Food looks great for this two-hours flight although I thought they would serve some warm food, seems it is not the case. But fair IMO.

Salut!

Roger



"At reise er at leve" H.C. Andersen (Travelling is Living)
User currently offlineknightsofmalta From Malta, joined Nov 2005, 1750 posts, RR: 18
Reply 30, posted (1 year 2 months 3 weeks 2 days 1 hour ago) and read 11454 times:

Hi Roger

Quoting Rogerbcn (Reply 29):
The IB lounge at MAD is very nice, I have been there a couple of times and it is certainly a great experience, although it tends to be crowded during the peak hours and it is difficult to find a place to seat, the food is great and the wine offers are very good. I did not know about the 30 min. curfew for wifi which is quite ridiculous, IMO.

I was quite impressed by the food and drink offerings as well, the selection was excellent and the quality of the food was also very good (Perhaps I should just come clean and confess that I have a bit of a thing about tortillas...). Being a holiday when I was there, the place was nearly deserted. But I can imagine it getting quite full during peak times.

Quoting Rogerbcn (Reply 29):
The cabin on LAN business looks nice

The cabin was a surprise to me, I wasn't expecting to like it. Royal Jordanian have this faux wood on the floor in the galley and I didn't like that at all. But LAN has done a better job somehow.

Quoting Rogerbcn (Reply 29):
but I surprised about what you said regarding English skills of the purser, I thought it was a must to speak, at least, English to become a flight attendant, let alone a purser.

She did speak English of sorts, but not sufficiently to communicate effectively.

Quoting Rogerbcn (Reply 29):
The seat is very similar to IB's one, I have tried it to EZE, ORD and LAX and it is very comfortable and really wide; sleeping is another issue, but it has to do with my inability to sleep on planes more than the seat itself.

It is, but I think LAN's seat is slightly more modern.

Quoting Rogerbcn (Reply 29):
Food looks great for this two-hours flight although I thought they would serve some warm food, seems it is not the case. But fair IMO.

The meal was okay I guess. I think what surprised me most was that it was pork, which seems an unusual choice.

Thanks for taking the time to comment Roger.

Cheers,
William


User currently offlinegabrielchew From United Kingdom, joined Aug 2005, 3200 posts, RR: 12
Reply 31, posted (10 months 3 weeks 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 8270 times:

This was just the report I was looking for William! I have *just* booked to fly this route in J in November, on the 787 rather than the 340 though. Yahoo!

Everything looks decent, although the meal and service standards sound like they could do with a little sprice up. I'm looking forward to using that IB lounge again - great views from there.

Do you happen to know what time check in opens in MAD?



http://my.flightmemory.com/shefgab Upcoming flights: LHR-GVA-LHR-TXL-LHR-VE-PRN,SPU-OSL-LHR, LGW-DXB-BKK-DXB-LHR
User currently offlineMIAspotter From Spain, joined Nov 2001, 2729 posts, RR: 25
Reply 32, posted (10 months 3 weeks 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 8052 times:

Hello William.

Thank you for sharing your experience with LAN, I am actually looking at booking the same sector, but on their new 787s.

Their Business class looks decent enough and some good service on the short MAD-FRA sector, Y is also not too bad (at least when I flew them back in 1998)

Looking forward to revisiting them again.

As for the language thing, I guess if you are going to work for an international airline, crewing a long haul aircraft serving routes such as AKL-SYD, FRA, and the US it would be nice to have at least a good grasp of english, if you don´t feel like learning it, then I guess you are more than welcomed to stay as short haul crew and fly around Sth America instead.

MIAspotter.



I think, therefore I don´t fly Ryanair.
User currently offlineknightsofmalta From Malta, joined Nov 2005, 1750 posts, RR: 18
Reply 33, posted (10 months 1 week 4 days 1 hour ago) and read 6418 times:

Hi Gabriel

Quoting gabrielchew (Reply 31):
This was just the report I was looking for William! I have *just* booked to fly this route in J in November, on the 787 rather than the 340 though. Yahoo!

Excellent, I'm rather curious about the interior of LAN's B787. I'm thinking about a trip to the Easter Islands.

Quoting gabrielchew (Reply 31):
Everything looks decent, although the meal and service standards sound like they could do with a little sprice up.

The food was okay, it's more the choice of meat I found a bit unusual.

Quoting gabrielchew (Reply 31):
I'm looking forward to using that IB lounge again - great views from there.

That lounge really is excellent, And the food is good too!

Quoting gabrielchew (Reply 31):
Do you happen to know what time check in opens in MAD?

Judging by the size of their operation in MAD, I wouldn't be surprised if the Business check-in counter were permanently available.

Hi MIAspotter

Quoting MIAspotter (Reply 32):
Thank you for sharing your experience with LAN, I am actually looking at booking the same sector, but on their new 787s.

Good choice. So I take it the first LAN 787 has finally joined the fleet?

Quoting MIAspotter (Reply 32):
Their Business class looks decent enough and some good service on the short MAD-FRA sector, Y is also not too bad (at least when I flew them back in 1998)

I flew LAN from Buenos Aires to Santiago in Y a few years back. I thought they were quite good too. I was quite impressed that they had touch screens even in Economy Class.

Thanks for commenting.

Cheers,
William


User currently offlineSCL767 From Chile, joined Feb 2006, 8748 posts, RR: 5
Reply 34, posted (10 months 1 week 1 day 10 hours ago) and read 5512 times:

Quoting gabrielchew (Reply 31):
Do you happen to know what time check in opens in MAD?

The check-in counter opens before 12:00PM.

Quoting knightsofmalta (Reply 33):
Good choice. So I take it the first LAN 787 has finally joined the fleet?

Hi William, LAN was the first carrier in the Americas to take delivery of the 787 over a year ago. LAN currently has three 787s in the fleet and will take delivery of two more 787s during this month. Also, there is already a LAN 787 TR posted here on A.net.  

Saludos,


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