Tbar220 From United States, joined Feb 2000, 6892 posts, RR: 20 Posted (2 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 639 times:
Ok, lots on my mind so I'll try and make this understandable. I'll start this by saying I'm Jewish, don't celebrate Christmas, and never have done Christmas shopping. Heck, my family goes to Vegas on Christmas and we have a good time.
From my observations, I feel like Christmas has long lost its true meaning. How long is the holiday supposed to be (I don't know)? Now that Thanksgiving is over, Christmas is the only thing we're going to hear about on the radio, television, and advertising. When did Christmas become such a consumer whorefest?
Watching the insanity on black friday makes me wonder, is this the Christmas spirit that everybody tries to capture and share? People get so stressed out about shopping for gifts and trying to make everybody they know happy for Christmas. What's worse is American companies exploit this and only reinforce the consumerism that is everywhere during this time of year.
Now, what is the holiday of Christmas? I'm not an expert, but I'm guessing its not about seeing who can give the better gifts or who can hang the best Christmas lights.
If anybody wants to talk about "an attack on Christmas", perhaps we should first look at the consumerism in our society first. That seems to me what would be the main factor that's "attacking" Christmas. How many people truly enjoy the holiday these days without the stress of shopping, travel, etc.?
I am very curious on this topic, and at the same time very glad I don't partake in the shopping involved in it.
Any thoughts? Am I completely off on my observations?
LHMARK From United States, joined Jan 2000, 7223 posts, RR: 53 Reply 3, posted (2 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 629 times:
I think that the "old" embodiment of Christmas is alive and well, but in a much more personal and private way than it used to be. The holiday reunites far-flung families and rejuvenates strained relationships. We get to watch the Heat Miser and the Cold Miser on TV. There's rumalicious egg-nog. For the religious, this time of year is still important and profound.
Yeah, there's the Christmas of Crass Commercialism, A Mall and the Night Visitors, and all that, but I've seen too many happy people to believe that voracious commerce has gotten the upper hand.
"Sympathy is something that shouldn't be bestowed on the Yankees. Apparently it angers them." - Bob Feller
Pope From United States, joined Mar 2005, 4388 posts, RR: 4 Reply 4, posted (2 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 627 times:
Christmas is what you make of it. If you want it to be highly commercialized and superficial, then by all means participate in the craziness. If you want it to have significant spiritual meaning to you - then nothing that goes on around you should affect your relationship with your God.
People spend way too much time worrying about what others are doing and not accepting the fact that they themselve control what this holiday or any other event means to them.
To me Christmas is a time to spend with family, watch the joy on the face of my daughter as she opens way too many Christmas presents and reflect on the incarnation of my God and the lessons that teaches me. Everyone else is free to make Christmas want for themselves and their families and their doing so has absolutely no impact on me.
Tbar220 From United States, joined Feb 2000, 6892 posts, RR: 20 Reply 5, posted (2 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 17 hours ago) and read 621 times:
Quoting Superfly (Reply 2): Would you rather there not be Christmas and no happy time of the year?
Huh??
Quoting LHMARK (Reply 3): I've seen too many happy people to believe that voracious commerce has gotten the upper hand.
I hope you're right.
Quoting Pope (Reply 4): Christmas is what you make of it. If you want it to be highly commercialized and superficial, then by all means participate in the craziness. If you want it to have significant spiritual meaning to you - then nothing that goes on around you should affect your relationship with your God.
Well said. For example, when my family celebrates Hannukah its not about giving lots of gifts and going nuts in that respect. We enjoy the fact that we are all together and get to spend some time with eachother, as well as eating some great food. And also, there's some great traditions involved which we take part in.
I guess its a two way problem. I blame companies for driving this craziness this time of year, but I also blame the consumer for falling for it and insisting that its all that the holiday is about.
Aloges From Germany, joined Jan 2006, 5852 posts, RR: 50 Reply 6, posted (2 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 618 times:
I'm once again beginning to appreciate Christmas. It has to do with living away from home, once you do that and rarely travel home Christmas gets a different meaning. We also don't have Christmas decorations in my flat (of four students) so that stuff also won't have a chance to get on my nerves until the 22nd or 23rd of December. I'm also going to meet a few people from my old highschool; as always, there are some I'd rather not meet but hey. I'm still looking forward to the whole thing.
Pope From United States, joined Mar 2005, 4388 posts, RR: 4 Reply 7, posted (2 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 608 times:
Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 5): I blame companies for driving this craziness this time of year, but I also blame the consumer for falling for it and insisting that its all that the holiday is about.
There's nobody to blame but yourself. You control your destiny, you control what affects you. I was fortunate to learn pretty early on that nobody should be able to control how you feel. Accept ownership over your life and then you'll find that external factors have far less impact on how you feel then they do now.
I find that far too many people (particularly on this forum) worry way too much about what other people think and how other people view them. Who cares? If you're confident in yourself and you're proud of what you are, then f*ck anyone else who thinks less of you. Opinions are like assholes - everyone has one.
Superfly From United States, joined May 2000, 26008 posts, RR: 74 Reply 8, posted (2 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 602 times:
Quoting Pope (Reply 4): Christmas is what you make of it. If you want it to be highly commercialized and superficial, then by all means participate in the craziness.
Wow I agree with this Pope on something. You are correct and we should welcome all to participate Christian or not.
So what if it's commercialized?!?!?!
Big deal!
I like this time of year and everything associated with it. And Christmas is NOT just for kids.
Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter): I'll start this by saying I'm Jewish, don't celebrate Christmas
Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter): I feel like Christmas has long lost its true meaning
Quoting Tbar220 (Thread starter): When did Christmas become such a consumer whorefest?
Oh you better watch out!
You may have set yourself up to get flamed by some Christian fundamentalist.
They may question why it matters to you in the first place. Especially if the holiday has no meaning to you. Then to call it a "whorefest" could be interpreted as you insulting another religion's holiday.
Marco From Canada, joined Jul 2000, 4112 posts, RR: 15 Reply 10, posted (2 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 16 hours ago) and read 581 times:
Well it's the same with most holidays. Even with my Jewish friends, some of them just think about getting wildly drunk during purim. During Eid some of my Muslim friends just look forward to getting money or presents from relatives. And it's the same with Christmas...
Searpqx From United States, joined Jun 2000, 4264 posts, RR: 23 Reply 11, posted (2 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 570 times:
Quoting Pope (Reply 4): Christmas is what you make of it.
Quoting Pope (Reply 7): Accept ownership over your life and then you'll find that external factors have far less impact on how you feel then they do now.
Two of the best quotes I've seen in awhile.
To me, Christmas is a season that means family. I love the decorations and lights, and I enjoy the time I spend picking out gifts for my family. It has no religious conotations at all to me, it's just that special time at the end of the year that we mark the passing of years and celebrate those that are special to us. To quote Bill Murray, "It's that one time of year when we are the people we always hoped we'd be"
"The two most common elements in the universe are Hydrogen and stupidity"
Superfly From United States, joined May 2000, 26008 posts, RR: 74 Reply 12, posted (2 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 15 hours ago) and read 564 times:
Quoting Searpqx (Reply 11): To me, Christmas is a season that means family. I love the decorations and lights, and I enjoy the time I spend picking out gifts for my family. It has no religious conotations at all to me, it's just that special time at the end of the year that we mark the passing of years and celebrate those that are special to us. To quote Bill Murray, "It's that one time of year when we are the people we always hoped we'd be"
Agreed!
It's also an excuss to play all those great Christmas albums.
Tbar220 From United States, joined Feb 2000, 6892 posts, RR: 20 Reply 13, posted (2 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 553 times:
Quoting Pope (Reply 7):
There's nobody to blame but yourself. You control your destiny, you control what affects you. I was fortunate to learn pretty early on that nobody should be able to control how you feel. Accept ownership over your life and then you'll find that external factors have far less impact on how you feel then they do now.
True, people do control their own destinies and their actions. But don't you think that society and the culture around people pull them towards certain actions, whether they are concious of this happening or not? Its nearly impossible for one to completely avoid external factors and their influence on one's decisions. At the same time, there's nothign wrong with that as it is part of life ot have others influence what you do and who you are IMO.
Quoting Marco (Reply 10): Well it's the same with most holidays.
Except that with Christmas, we saw how the craziness started last friday, even though Christmas is about a month away.
Superfly From United States, joined May 2000, 26008 posts, RR: 74 Reply 16, posted (2 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 14 hours ago) and read 542 times:
Quoting Tbar220 (Reply 15): I tried it once and it made me gag
Try it with brandy next time.
Make sure it's the totally fattening egg nog. I had the non-fat kind and it taste like vomit!
Egg nog has to be fat, thick & creamy!
Be careful when you do. The cheap grocery store kind is awful and can scar you for life. The good kind is the gourmet kind from specialty shops or department stores. They are pricey.
Searpqx From United States, joined Jun 2000, 4264 posts, RR: 23 Reply 18, posted (2 years 7 months 1 week 1 day 13 hours ago) and read 535 times:
Quoting Superfly (Reply 12): It's also an excuss to play all those great Christmas albums
Trans Siberian Orchestra and Mannheim Steamroller right along with Mormon Tabernacle Choir (don't agree with the religion, but can't argue with the voices - wow!)
Quoting Superfly (Reply 16): Egg nog has to be fat, thick & creamy!
Quoting Superfly (Reply 16): The good kind is the gourmet kind from specialty shops or department stores.
Or even better, if you enjoy a baking challenge, make your own, and soak it in rum! One of our Thanksgiving weekend traditions was to make a huge batch of fruitcake, then wrap it in rum soaked cloth for two weeks, so it'd be perfect for gift giving - our fruitcakes were ones that were eagerly awaited every year (and banned from school - I got called into the principals office one year!)
I think it's more likely that the the one month leadup is purely driven by the economics of the shopping season. I don't know a single christian family that celebrates for a month.
Quoting Marco (Reply 17): Except that with Christmas, we saw how the craziness started last friday, even though Christmas is about a month away.
Well because for Christians Christmas is a very big deal.
"The two most common elements in the universe are Hydrogen and stupidity"
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