Spacepope
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Afghan Military Av

Tue Jun 15, 2004 1:34 pm

What is the status of the Afghani fleet?

In this photo, you can see 2 Mi-8/17, a Mi-24 gunship, as well as an AN-12/Y-8. The C-130 in the background is most likely not Afghani.

Does anyone have any updated numbers of types in service, and where these came from (I have seen numerous US Mi-8s in press photos from early fighting in 2001, as well as being used in liberia).
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greaser
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RE: Afghan Military Av

Tue Jun 15, 2004 3:42 pm

I would imagine the US/EU would start selling defense equipment pretty soon to them. Maybe some block 50/60 desert falcons (f-16s)

3 priorities:

1. Border & National Security: maybe 80-100 SAR/Enforcement helis like Super Pumas or HH-60s.
2.National Army: AH-1Zs, Ch-47s.
3.Air Force: Again, f-16s and maybe F-15s. Another possibility would be the Dassault...
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Duce50Boom
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RE: Afghan Military Av

Tue Jun 15, 2004 4:33 pm

I don't think F-16s or F-15s would be in the Afghani AF anytime soon. It was hard enough selling them to Pakistan and Saudi Arabia, and they're both US friendly (sort of) and stable (sort of) countries. If the F-5 were still in production I'd say that'd be a shoo-in. Not really sure what it's equivalent would be today. Of course, if they can fork up the deneros, the EU countries might be willing to sell mirages or something similiar.

My guess is they'll stick with Russian or Chinese designs. Mig-21 comes to mind as a possibility
 
Contact_tower
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RE: Afghan Military Av

Tue Jun 15, 2004 10:18 pm

I think the F-16 or similar is to complex (and capable) to be an option for the Afghan forces. They are better off with a more rugged Russian design, at least in the short term. There are some surplus MIG29s available at the moment as well, and probably more to come.

For the same reason as above, the Mi-8 family (Mi-17, "hot and high" version at least) and Mi-24 are more suited for this part of the world, I don't think they will afford to keep a fleet of modern western airframes airborne.
Old US CH-47s in storage (if any???) might be a solution, if they have the high altitude capablilites of the modern ones.

[Edited 2004-06-15 15:36:18]
 
Spacepope
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RE: Afghan Military Av

Wed Jun 16, 2004 12:17 am

During and after the Soviet occupation, they had quite a few MiG-21s and Su-22Ms. These along with AN-12/24/26s made up the bulk of their fixed wing forces. There was a MiG-21 flying for the Taliban as recently as the beginning of the US campaign there. As for rotary wing, They had Mi-8/17/24s in service too, so this re-equipment seems to just be replacing units. If you look at the nice newly painted helicopter in the picture, you can see it is not a new-build Mi-17 (still has old style rear loading doors).

I would be amazed to see the Afgans get any "western" rotorcraft. Even Pakistan, who is getting 40 AH-1 and 40 UH-1s this year, still has taken delivery of 13 Mi-17s this year as well.

Is China exporting the Y-8 as a cargo aircraft? The AN-12 went out of production in 1973, and they are becoming rarer by the day. I see a cargo fleet that may include C-130 E/H from surplus stocks, backed up by AN-26/32s

Note: that photo was supposedly from when the Chinese were retrieving the bodies of the 11 contractors killed in their sleep last week. They flew in on an IL-76, the AN-12 there does not seem to belong to them.
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Contact_tower
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RE: Afghan Military Av

Wed Jun 16, 2004 4:01 am

It's pretty much just the CH47 that is really hot and high capable in the "western" world. The Mi-17 is a good choice, and it's fairy cheap as well.

 
greaser
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RE: Afghan Military Av

Wed Jun 16, 2004 4:12 am

Oh well, i guess my hopes of a super modern Afghan Armee are dashed...but u cannot rule out ch-47s....exp. the older ones...
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N328KF
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RE: Afghan Military Av

Wed Jun 16, 2004 6:07 am

I thought the Super Stallion had similar hot/high/heavy capabilities as compared to the CH-47.
When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' -Theodore Roosevelt
 
Contact_tower
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RE: Afghan Military Av

Wed Jun 16, 2004 6:41 am

My bad 28KF, you are right! (I must start taking more vitamins, becoming forgetful... Big grin )
 
Spacepope
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RE: Afghan Military Av

Wed Jun 16, 2004 8:18 am

The problem is that the CH-46 hasn't been produced in how many decades? The Navy and Marines can't afford to get rid of any, plus the airframes are beat to hell and have no useful life left. It seems every tine their hours limit is about to be reached, they extend it.

For fixed wing, I wouldn't say that the US is above pulling some F-16A/Bs out of storage, as the F-16 is readlily available and has been used quite extensively by coalition forces. Used MiG-23s might also be a possibility (perhaps as Algeria takes delivery of more MiG-29s). For new aircraft, it's pretty much either MiG-29 or JF-17. SU-27 is unlikely, although we did see how it dominated MiG-29s in the Ethiopia/Eritrea war a few years ago.
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N328KF
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RE: Afghan Military Av

Wed Jun 16, 2004 11:50 am

Spacepope:

CH-46 != CH-47. The latter is being supplied as new build.
When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' -Theodore Roosevelt
 
Spacepope
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RE: Afghan Military Av

Wed Jun 16, 2004 12:29 pm

N328KF: Sorry brainfart.

Next time use CH-53 instead of "Super Stallion", then I'll be sure to know what the hell we're talking about.

In all seriousness, a tandem/coaxial rotor helicopter, or a heavy lift helo is really the only viable option here. I think Kamov and Mil have the inside track.
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Spacepope
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RE: Afghan Military Av

Fri Jun 25, 2004 11:29 am

Dug up another photo today, dated June 24, 2004.



In the background, it looks like an AN-32 is in service too.
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LY744
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RE: Afghan Military Av

Fri Jun 25, 2004 11:48 am

Couldn't the An-32 belong to a European ally? The type seems popular with Eastern European countries.


LY744.
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Spacepope
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RE: Afghan Military Av

Fri Jun 25, 2004 12:18 pm

Most europeans don't use the AN-32, as they don't need the extra performance for hot-and-high ops. the color scheme looks most like it is an Indian, or at least ex-indian machine. India is one of the largest users of the type. Before the war, there were plenty of AN-24 and AN26s around. Unfortunately that is the best photo I could find of this one.
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