AsstChiefMark
Topic Author
Posts: 10465
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2004 2:14 pm

Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Mon May 16, 2005 8:24 am

It drives me crazy when people assume a VC-25 is Air Force One.  banghead 

This IS NOT Air Force One:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Alejandro Pérez



These ARE Air Force One:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Jeremy Irish/Cactus Wings
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © David J Madzelonka



What's the problem?

Mark
Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Damned MSP...Red tail...Red tail
 
jaybird
Posts: 171
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2001 4:23 am

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Mon May 16, 2005 8:26 am

Air Force One is ANY plane that the U.S. President is on .. Piper Cub, 747, whatever .. it's not a SPECIFIC aircraft - it's the aircraft a President happens to be in on any given moment ..
 
EMBQA
Posts: 7795
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 3:52 am

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Mon May 16, 2005 8:36 am

Air Force One is ANY plane that the U.S. President is on

Air Force One is any US AIR FORCE aircraft that the President is on, I don't think they own any J-3 Cub's...  Wink
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
User avatar
Starlionblue
Posts: 17049
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 9:54 pm

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Mon May 16, 2005 8:42 am

So the world is full of ignorant people who don't care. YAwn...
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots."
 
SATL382G
Posts: 2679
Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2004 12:02 am

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Mon May 16, 2005 10:42 am

Quoting AsstChiefMark (Thread starter):
It drives me crazy when people assume a VC-25 is Air Force One.

It drives me a bit bonkers when folks who know relatively little about the situation get upset and drive threads that go on and on about what the damn callsign is.

When I worked the Air Force 1 detail at Andrews it was always the Air Force 1 detail regardless of wether the President was aboard the aircraft or not. If you asked the cop at the gate how to get to the Air Force 1 complex he could help you -- If you asked for the SAM 28000 complex he'd look at you funny.

The crew on the aircraft always refered to the VC25 as either Air Force 1, or Air Force 1 (Primary) and Air Force 1 (Backup). For short they used Primary and Backup. This applies to common conversation only. When the pilot talks to tower he is going to use "Air Force 1" or "SAM 2x000" for a callsign.

Hey check this out. It's even called Air Force 1 on the aircrafts website -- I can guarantee you the Prez was not aboard when they took the photo at Rushmore.

http://public.andrews.amc.af.mil/vc25a.htm

So lets take a deep breath and remember the following:

Air Force 1 is...

A. The callsign used by an Air Force aircraft that the President is aboard.

and

B. The popular name for the Air Force aircraft that is reserved for the Presidents use, the VC25. Any of the big shots in D.C. can order up a junket in a C-32, they can not ask for the VC25. The VC25 is controlled/tasked thru the White House Military Office for White House use.

any questions?

[Edited 2005-05-16 03:49:21]
"There’s nothing quite as exhilarating as being shot at and missed" --Winston Churchill
 
OzLAME
Posts: 336
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2005 8:40 am

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Mon May 16, 2005 11:31 am

Is it the case that Dubya's helicopter is 'Marine One'? I guess that the aircraft that took him to the carrier for his 'major combat is over' speech was 'Navy One' for the day, would that be correct? If he happened to go up in a Coast Guard C-130 would that be 'Coast Guard One'?
Monty Python's Flying Circus has nothing to do with aviation, except perhaps for Management personnel.
 
jhooper
Posts: 5560
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2001 8:27 pm

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Mon May 16, 2005 12:35 pm

Quoting OzLAME (Reply 5):
I guess that the aircraft that took him to the carrier for his 'major combat is over' speech was 'Navy One' for the day, would that be correct?

Yes, indeed. The a/c was called "Navy One". In fact, I think they actually painted it on the side.

Quoting Jaybird (Reply 1):
Air Force One is ANY plane that the U.S. President is on .. Piper Cub, 747, whatever .. it's not a SPECIFIC aircraft - it's the aircraft a President happens to be in on any given moment ..

A civilian aircraft with the prez on board = EXECUTIVE ONE.
Last year 1,944 New Yorkers saw something and said something.
 
garnetpalmetto
Posts: 5351
Joined: Tue Oct 21, 2003 1:38 am

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Mon May 16, 2005 12:56 pm

Quoting OzLAME (Reply 5):
Is it the case that Dubya's helicopter is 'Marine One'?

Only if it's a Marine Corps helicopter. If it was an Air Force helo it would be Air Force One or if it were a US Army UH-60, it would be Army One.
South Carolina - too small to be its own country, too big to be a mental asylum.
 
KC135R
Posts: 696
Joined: Sun May 01, 2005 6:38 am

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Mon May 16, 2005 1:57 pm

Quoting AsstChiefMark (Thread starter):
It drives me crazy when people assume a VC-25 is Air Force One.

Details... Wink

Quoting OzLAME (Reply 5):
Is it the case that Dubya's helicopter is 'Marine One'? I guess that the aircraft that took him to the carrier for his 'major combat is over' speech was 'Navy One' for the day, would that be correct?

All correct, now who knows the story as to why they started using these callsigns??? I'll give you a hint, it had to do with a close call.
 
NBGSkyGod
Posts: 807
Joined: Sun May 30, 2004 7:30 am

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Tue May 17, 2005 10:54 am

If I remember right, it was a trip when Kennedy was flying somewhere, and a PanAm (or other now defunct carrier) had a nearly similar callsign to the presidential aircraft.
Pilots are idots, who at any given moment will attempt to kill themselves or others.
 
KC135R
Posts: 696
Joined: Sun May 01, 2005 6:38 am

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Fri May 20, 2005 2:07 pm

Quoting NBGskygod (Reply 9):
If I remember right, it was a trip when Kennedy was flying somewhere, and a PanAm (or other now defunct carrier) had a nearly similar callsign to the presidential aircraft.

Close - from Wikipedia:

The call signs were established for security purposes during the administration of Dwight D. Eisenhower, the first American president to have been a pilot in his own right. The change stemmed from a 1953 incident where an Eastern Airlines commercial flight (8610) had the same callsign as a flight the President was on (Air Force 8610). The planes accidentally entered the same airspace, and after the incident the unique call sign "Air Force One" was made for the presidential aircraft.
 
KevinSmith
Posts: 626
Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2006 9:08 am

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Sat Feb 03, 2007 2:16 pm

Quoting OzLAME (Reply 5):
I guess that the aircraft that took him to the carrier for his 'major combat is over' speech was 'Navy One' for the day, would that be correct?

This is that aircraft. It has since been retired and placed on display at the National Museum of Naval Aviation.



Quoting Jhooper (Reply 6):
The a/c was called "Navy One". In fact, I think they actually painted it on the side

Sure did. You can see it in the picture just above the VS-35 towards the tail. It's hard to make out but it also says "George W Bush Commander in Chief" under the pilot's window.

[Edited 2007-02-03 06:21:22]

[Edited 2007-02-03 06:21:59]
Learning to fly, but I ain't got wings.
 
unattendedbag
Posts: 2154
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 10:35 pm

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Sat Feb 03, 2007 2:42 pm

Quoting KC135R (Reply 10):
from Wikipedia:

a 1953 incident where an Eastern Airlines commercial flight (8610) had the same callsign as a flight the President was on (Air Force 8610).

What was an Eastern Airlines aircraft doing using an Air Force callsign?
Slower traffic, keep right
 
ShyFlyer
Posts: 4698
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2009 11:38 pm

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Sat Feb 03, 2007 3:17 pm

Quoting UnattendedBag (Reply 12):
What was an Eastern Airlines aircraft doing using an Air Force callsign?

The Eastern flight was using Eastern 8610 as a call sign. The confusion resulted from the same numbers being used.
I lift things up and put them down.
 
PC12Fan
Posts: 1967
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2007 11:50 pm

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Sun Feb 04, 2007 12:02 am

Quoting Jhooper (Reply 6):
A civilian aircraft with the prez on board = EXECUTIVE ONE.

I know this will raise a red flag, but I have also heard this call sign used for the First Lady as well when she flew on the C-37 (BBJ) into STL.
Just when I think you've said the stupidest thing ever, you keep talkin'!
 
dc8jet
Posts: 329
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2004 1:40 pm

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Sun Feb 04, 2007 6:58 am

Most likely 8610 was the Eastern flight number. 8610 was the tail number of
the VC-121 that Eisenhower was on. Airliners use their flight number as part of their call sign while other aircraft use their tail number or registration.
 
ShyFlyer
Posts: 4698
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2009 11:38 pm

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Sun Feb 04, 2007 1:21 pm

Quoting PC12Fan (Reply 14):
I have also heard this call sign used for the First Lady

Are you sure it wasn't Executive One Foxtrot?
I lift things up and put them down.
 
deskflier
Posts: 525
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 9:59 pm

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Mon Feb 05, 2007 2:10 am

Quoting Jhooper (Reply 6):
A civilian aircraft with the prez on board = EXECUTIVE ONE.

So, if GWB decides to help out on the family ranch, by doing some airborne crop-dusting, the crop-duster he is flying becomes Executive One?
How can anyone not fly, when we live at a time when we can fly?
 
ShyFlyer
Posts: 4698
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2009 11:38 pm

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Tue Feb 06, 2007 3:57 am

Quoting Deskflier (Reply 17):
the crop-duster he is flying becomes Executive One?

This is correct. Now the likelyhood of that happening is another question.  Smile
I lift things up and put them down.
 
JetBlueGuy2006
Posts: 1482
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 5:38 am

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Tue Feb 06, 2007 6:52 am

Quoting SATL382G (Reply 4):
So lets take a deep breath and remember the following:

Air Force 1 is...

A. The callsign used by an Air Force aircraft that the President is aboard.

and

B. The popular name for the Air Force aircraft that is reserved for the Presidents use, the VC25. Any of the big shots in D.C. can order up a junket in a C-32, they can not ask for the VC25. The VC25 is controlled/tasked thru the White House Military Office for White House use.

Couldn't have said it better myself. If the White House Loans one of the aircraft out say for a pres. funeral, many will refer to it as SAM 28000 or 29000.

Although, from what I remember of Ronald Regan and Gerald Ford's Funerals, SAM 29000 was loaned by the White House for both, at the authorization of George W. Bush

edit: Tail Numbers

[Edited 2007-02-05 22:54:42]
Home Airport: Capital Region International Airport (KLAN)
 
zanl188
Posts: 3436
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2006 9:05 pm

RE: Misuse Of The Term "Air Force One"

Tue Feb 06, 2007 8:53 am

Quoting JetBlueGuy2006 (Reply 19):
Couldn't have said it better myself. If the White House Loans one of the aircraft out say for a pres. funeral, many will refer to it as SAM 28000 or 29000.

Although, from what I remember of Ronald Regan and Gerald Ford's Funerals, SAM 29000 was loaned by the White House for both, at the authorization of George W. Bush

Very Cool! Someone remembered a good point from the other thread. Even the aircraft used for Ford & Reagans funerals were tasked by the White House so never left the White House Military Office' operational control.

ZANL188
Legal considerations provided by: Dewey, Cheatum, and Howe

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests