lastordu
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Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Mon Nov 21, 2005 12:10 pm

I know that this might be a dumb question, but what fixed wing air craft dose the US Army have and/or use? I looked on here but everthing was helicopters.


Thanks,
Nick
"Remember, Remember the 5th of November" from V for Vendetta
 
HaveBlue
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Mon Nov 21, 2005 12:35 pm

The Army is not allowed to have fixed wing combat aircraft, that was decided long ago in an Air Force vs Army debate. They had the O-1, O-2 and OV-10 observation planes which could carry targeting smoke rockets and such, but they are not allowed to have combative aircraft. But logistical and combat aircraft fall under the domain of Air Force command.

I had an Air Force recruiter argue with me in High School in the 80's that the Army had A-10's at one point, but he was wrong. It was a bitter fight in Washington but the Air Force won that one.
Here Here for Severe Clear!
 
joness0154
Posts: 650
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Mon Nov 21, 2005 12:39 pm

UC-35's
C-12's
C-23's

All still in service
I don't have an attitude problem. You have a perception problem
 
SlamClick
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 2:11 am

Quoting HaveBlue (Reply 1):
O-1, O-2 and OV-10

I flew the O-1, but never saw so much as a picture of the other two in Army markings. I would not rule them out, but they were not part of the Army "inventory" of fixed wing.

During my time in Army Aviation, which was the Vietnam era, we had:

Singles
O-1 Bird Dog
T-41B - A Cessna 172 with an IO-360 and a constant-speed prop.
U-6A - DeHavilland of Canada Beaver
U-1A - DeHavilland of Canada Otter
U-10A - Helio Courier

Twins
T-42A - A Beech Baron instrument / multi trainer
U-8D & G - Beech Twin Bonanza
U-8F - Beech Queen Air
U-21A - An unpressurized King Air or a PT-6A powered Queen Air 88. Not sure which.
OV-1 Mohawk - Grumman, triple-tail, side-by-side ejection seats.
CV-2 Caribou - - DeHavilland of Canada

By the time I was on active duty a few others had been dropped from the inventory:

Aero Commander
Cessna 195
Navion

Some other aircraft of which they had maybe only one or maybe as many as a half dozen or so on special projects:

YO-3A - Schweizer glider with a very quiet engine and prop
P-51 Cavalier Mustang as a chase plane at Test Board
C-45
T-28B
C-47 - several around the world
C-54 - at Lakehurst and maybe a couple other places
P-2V Neptune - All at the "First RR" at Cam Rahn Bay, RVN.
F-3D Skynight - straight-wing Douglas twin jet

They also had other aircraft "demonstrated" and this sometimes meant that they were painted at least temporarily in US Army markings. This included:

Helio Stallion
Shorts Skyvan
OV-10

[Edited 2005-11-22 18:12:22]
Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
 
propatriamori
Posts: 131
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 4:26 am

Army Aviation operates ELINT platform modified DHC-7 (RC-7B) aircraft as part of Military Intelligence units. The aircraft are painted in "civilian-like" paint schemes with small "U.S. Army" titles on the tail. I know several are stationed at Biggs AAF (adjacent to Ft. Bliss, TX) as part of an M.I. unit there. I have also seen these aircraft deployed to Korea, and from what I hear make somewhat "unadvertised" depoyments to various locations.
 
sidishus
Posts: 488
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 4:27 am

Quoting HaveBlue (Reply 1):
The Army is not allowed to have fixed wing combat aircraft

The GR/CS, not to mention the increasingly doubtful ACS, and even the AR(L) aircraft are as much "COMBAT" aircraft as any A-10, F-15 , etc.
Treating SIGINT/ELINT aircraft as spectators to the fight is an obsolete notion that belongs in the quaint past of the last century.
Indeed, with the advent of NETWAR, AESA, and the drive for an ever shorter sensor to shooter loop, it's well time to question the need for specialized manned ELINT/SIGINT aircraft to exist at all.

[Edited 2005-11-22 20:39:19]
the truth: first it is ridiculed second it is violently opposed finally it is accepted as self-evident
 
dl021
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 6:08 am

Don't forget the BTC-47 and the AN-2 Colts the Army has down at Hurlburt.
Is my Pan Am ticket to the moon still good?
 
SlamClick
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 8:01 am

Quoting Sidishus (Reply 5):
Treating SIGINT/ELINT aircraft as spectators to the fight is an obsolete notion that belongs in the quaint past of the last century.

Some spectators have a better view of the proceedings than others!
Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
 
2H4
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 2:19 am




There was also the Cessna U-3:


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Photo © Paul Goddard
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Photo © Gary Chambers






2H4


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SlamClick
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 2:49 am

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 8):
There was also the Cessna U-3:

Those came over from the USAF just as I was leaving the Army. We got OH-58s and I went to ground school on that, but never flew one, then we were told we were going to get a U-3 "blue canoe" from the Air Guard. I was designated the IP for it, and did my summer camp writing the training program. 25 hours of ground school if I remember right. But I left the guard and never flew it. I'd guess they came into the inventory around 1973-74.
Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
 
f4wso
Posts: 942
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sat Nov 26, 2005 12:24 am

The Army doens't have many, but they do have some interesting fixed wing aircraft.

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Photo © Gary Chambers
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Photo © Gary Chambers



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Photo © Gary Chambers
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Photo © Gary Chambers



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Photo © Gary Chambers
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Photo © Gary Chambers



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Photo © Gary Chambers

Seeking an honest week's pay for an honest day's work
 
Lurch
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sat Nov 26, 2005 1:10 am

The US Army operated the Boeing 767-200 prototype with a dorsal cupola. It was converted as the Airborne Optical Adjunct Laboratory although not many people remember it as a US Army aircraft
 
SlamClick
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sat Nov 26, 2005 2:22 am

Quoting Lurch (Reply 11):
The US Army operated the Boeing 767-200 prototype with a dorsal cupola. It was converted as the Airborne Optical Adjunct Laboratory although not many people remember it as a US Army aircraft

That would pretty much hold the record then. Do you know if it was actually flown by Army Aviator crews or if they contracted that out?
Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
 
sidishus
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:19 am

Quoting SlamClick (Reply 7):
Quoting Sidishus (Reply 5):
Treating SIGINT/ELINT aircraft as spectators to the fight is an obsolete notion that belongs in the quaint past of the last century.

Some spectators have a better view of the proceedings than others!

Trouble is, emerging military doctirne being advertised by some potential bad guys makes it a point to include such platforms in the fight.
The Cold War concepts of standing off the contested airspace, or south of a DMZ, or whatever won't work in this century's scraps
the truth: first it is ridiculed second it is violently opposed finally it is accepted as self-evident
 
espike
Posts: 2
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sat Nov 26, 2005 5:36 am

Guys are showing a lot of obsolete aircraft on this forum. U-3s, T-42, C-47s? Not anymore.

The current fixed-wing aircraft in the Army are:

C-12 Huron (Beechcraft Raytheon B200 Super King Air)
RC-12 - military intelligence variant
UC-35 - (Cessna Citation Ultra)
Gulfstream GIV- Used by the Army Chief of Staff from Andrews AFB, and flown by Army Aviators.
RC-7s - Dash 7 - as previously stated, an MI platform used in Texas and Korea and parts unknown.
C-23 Sherpa - A box with wings that is currently out flying the Air Force in Iraq by delivering much needed personnel and equipment all over the Iraqi theater to tiny little airfields the C-130s won't go to.

The C-23 is going to be replaced very soon. The C-27J Spartan is the leading competitor. It's like a mini C-130, but it will be flown by Army Aviators, not Air Force. The Army should also be looking to replace the C-12 and UC-35 with a larger jet aircraft for the personnel/vip transport role. Hopefully, they will consider the GIV or G200. We need something that can cross the oceans.

Fly Safe!

Spike
 
Lurch
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sat Nov 26, 2005 7:06 am

From memory the AOA project used some US Army and Boeing Crews to do the flying but all the Cabin personal were US Army people!
 
2H4
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sat Nov 26, 2005 7:09 am




I remembered another:



The Pilatus UV-20 Chiricahua:








...And, winning the "What the hell?" award:


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Photo © Alan McKnight




 eyepopping 




2H4


Intentionally Left Blank
 
erj-145mech
Posts: 305
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sat Nov 26, 2005 10:38 pm

That last pic is a T-6B, basically a US built Pilatus PC-7.

The Army did have two O-2A's, 68-11150 and 151. They replaced two U-6 Beavers based in Berlin. The Army also has a T-34C based in North Carolina.
 
SlamClick
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sun Nov 27, 2005 1:07 am

Quoting Erj-145mech (Reply 17):
The Army did have two O-2A's, 68-11150 and 151.

Interesting. Never saw them. Baugher has 150 now civil registered.

Quoting Espike (Reply 14):
Guys are showing a lot of obsolete aircraft on this forum. U-3s, T-42, C-47s? Not anymore.

Right! That is why I said:

Quoting SlamClick (Reply 3):
During my time in Army Aviation, which was the Vietnam era, we had:

I was waiting for someone familiar with today's inventory to pop up.

You have planes today that I would consider superior to most that we had back then, but we sure did have numbers and diversity all over you. Of course the same was true for Air Force and Navy thirty years ago - more aircraft and more types.
Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
 
erj-145mech
Posts: 305
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sun Nov 27, 2005 3:09 am

Here ya go Slam, check it out:

http://www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org...egistry/o2registry/o2-6811150.html

I got checked out in the Bird Dog at the Ft Hood Aero Club, had two of them, later got a Beaver, but I had PCS'd by then.
 
ShyFlyer
Posts: 4698
Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2009 11:38 pm

RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sun Nov 27, 2005 3:49 am

Quoting Erj-145mech (Reply 17):
That last pic is a T-6B, basically a US built Pilatus PC-7.

Actually, they are Pilatus PC-9s, upon which the Texan II was based. So the question remains, why did the US Army have Swiss built PC-9s?

According to Scramble, all three aircraft in that picture left the Army for Slovenia.

91-0071 (C/N: 180) To Slovenia as S5-DSL
91-0072 (C/N: 181) To Slovenia as S5-DPT
91-0073 (C/N: 182) To Slovenia as S5-DPI
I lift things up and put them down.
 
erj-145mech
Posts: 305
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sun Nov 27, 2005 4:42 am

Shyflyer, thanks for the correction, I knew what I meant, its just that my fingers forgot!! Thats my story, and I'm sticking to it.
 
2H4
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sun Nov 27, 2005 4:58 am




Quoting ShyFlyer (Reply 20):
Actually, they are Pilatus PC-9s, upon which the Texan II was based. So the question remains, why did the US Army have Swiss built PC-9s?



I was wondering the same thing. Given that the factory PC-9 logo is still visible, I'd venture a guess that the three were in the running for an aircraft requirement competition....much like the Northrop A-9 competed with the A-10 (and lost) for a ground attack requirement:











The question then becomes....what requirement was the PC-9 proposed to fulfill? And what other aircraft did it compete with, and lose to?

 confused 




2H4


Intentionally Left Blank
 
Contact_tower
Posts: 534
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sun Nov 27, 2005 5:41 am

Quote:
According to Scramble, all three aircraft in that picture left the Army for Slovenia.

Actually, they went back to Pilatus on a HB- reg before beeing sold to the Slovenians.
 
ShyFlyer
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Sun Nov 27, 2005 5:11 pm

Quoting Erj-145mech (Reply 21):
Thats my story, and I'm sticking to it.

 Silly

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 22):
I'd venture a guess that the three were in the running for an aircraft requirement competition...The question then becomes....what requirement was the PC-9 proposed to fulfill? And what other aircraft did it compete with, and lose to?

Kind of a wild guess but, JPATS maybe?
I lift things up and put them down.
 
SlamClick
Posts: 9576
Joined: Sun Nov 23, 2003 7:09 am

RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Mon Nov 28, 2005 12:15 am

Quoting Erj-145mech (Reply 19):
Here ya go Slam, check it out:

Unfortunately the photos are of a "warbird" civil aircraft in a pseudomilitary paint job. I'd sure like to see pictures of the actual livery. (this might look just like it, I don't know)

Quoting Erj-145mech (Reply 19):
I got checked out in the Bird Dog at the Ft Hood Aero Club,

Fun machine. I had made the decision to buy one about twenty years ago when a decent example could be found for under $35K. I considered that undervalued as T-34s with, of course, no combat history were selling for five times that amount and up. Instead, I decided to go to another airline and took a huge pay cut. (Love that B-scale) so I did not buy that, or any other airplane.

My first civilian flying job was a Cessna 305A Bird Dog.
Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
 
2H4
Posts: 7960
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Mon Nov 28, 2005 1:03 am




Quoting ShyFlyer (Reply 24):
Kind of a wild guess but, JPATS maybe?



Yeah, I was thinking that, too....but is the Army involved in JPATS?

I sure hope this won't turn into an unsolved Airliners.net mystery.




2H4


Intentionally Left Blank
 
SlamClick
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Mon Nov 28, 2005 4:53 am

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 26):
I sure hope this won't turn into an unsolved Airliners.net mystery

Well, they certainly are capable of laying chemtrails.
("Shot! Over!")
Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
 
DeltaGuy
Posts: 3965
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Tue Nov 29, 2005 9:23 am

Quoting SlamClick (Reply 18):
The Army did have two O-2A's, 68-11150 and 151.

Interesting. Never saw them. Baugher has 150 now civil registered.

You wouldn't believe how many O-2's are out there now doing civilian jobs. My roomate has a job flying them out of the Jacksonville area for whale watching for NOAA...pretty adaptable to that sort of work.

DeltaGuy
"The cockpit, what is it?" "It's the little room in the front of the plane where the pilot sits, but that's not importan
 
erj-145mech
Posts: 305
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2001 4:21 am

RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Wed Nov 30, 2005 2:31 am

Quoting SlamClick (Reply 25):
Unfortunately the photos are of a "warbird" civil aircraft in a pseudomilitary paint job. I'd sure like to see pictures of the actual livery. (this might look just like it, I don't know)

Its civillian now, and I have pics of it in flight over West Germany, in a book "Cessna Warbirds", but I don't know how to post those pics. It hasn't changed since it was surplussed. Look at the lack of prop spinners, O-2A's didn't have them, and they are a no go item on C337's. Also, the left front side window is larger and wraps around the fuselage curve, ala post 68-10868 (Late build) O-2A's. I've had my O-2 since April 1989, restored it, and have maintained several 337's since I got my A&P in '75, so I'm well aware of the differences between all of the variants of the 336/337 line.
 
mechatnew
Posts: 110
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 5:59 am

RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Thu Dec 01, 2005 3:21 am

The PC-9s' were used at Fort Bragg ,NC as photo chase aircraft for the US Army Airborne test unit. They would fly in formation with C-130's, and C-141's and film the troops, and equipment as they were airdropped. They replaced T-28's, and were replaced by ex US navy T-34C's.

Carey
 
2H4
Posts: 7960
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Thu Dec 01, 2005 3:26 am




Quoting Mechatnew (Reply 30):
The PC-9s' were used at Fort Bragg ,NC as photo chase aircraft for the US Army Airborne test unit.



Wow, thanks for the info Mechatnew. Do you have any idea how long they were in service?




2H4


Intentionally Left Blank
 
Lurch
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RE: Fixed Wing Aircraft In The US Army?

Thu Dec 01, 2005 7:31 am

Apparently the 767 Prototype is still operational in the US Army but has changed its name and is Located in a remote location in the Pacific The Reagan test site!

So the US Army still operates a 767 with a Joint Boeing Army Crew.

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/cgi...3.Q44nN8Oa9dUAAGm4voY&modele=jdc_1

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