CX747
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Afsoc RFI For 30 New Tankers.

Tue Feb 14, 2006 11:35 am

It has been reported in several magazines (Aircraft Illustrated) and other media outlets that the United States Air Force Special Operations Command has put out a RFI (Request for Information) for a replacement tanker. The tanker will replace the aging fleet of HC-130P and MC-130E tanker aircraft. Several aircraft manufacturers have come forward.

Bell/Boeing: CV-22 Osprey
Lockheed: C-130J (Non-stretched version)
Airbus: A400M
EADS/CASA: C-295

It would seem that the C-130J has a leg up on the other platforms. It replaces the operating aircraft in size, fuel available while increasing the platforms range and speed. The speed issue would definitely come in handy if the platform is used to refuel "fast movers".

I think that the C-295 airframe is to small and does not offer enough cargo and fuel offload capability.

The A-400M and CV-22 are pipedreams.

[Edited 2006-02-14 03:37:09]
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: Afsoc RFI For 30 New Tankers.

Tue Feb 14, 2006 3:52 pm

Quoting CX747 (Thread starter):
The speed issue would definitely come in handy if the platform is used to refuel "fast movers".

In the USAF, the HC/MC-130s do not refuel the "fast movers". KC-135s and KC-10s do that. The AFSOC tankers refuel helocopters, like the USAF/USMC HH/MH-53s, V/CV-22s, HH/MH-60s, and the US Army CH-47s.

Quoting CX747 (Thread starter):
It would seem that the C-130J has a leg up on the other platforms.

I would agree, since the USMC already has 10-12 KC-130Js already on order to replace their aging KC-130F/Ts. A USAF order for the (HC/MC/KC?) C-130J tanker would make sence. The C-130Js are already in the USAF/ANG inventory.

Like the current HC/MC-130E/H/Ps, I'm sure these airplanes will have a duel role as Combat Talons, too.
 
PADSpot
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RE: Afsoc RFI For 30 New Tankers.

Tue Feb 14, 2006 4:35 pm

Quoting CX747 (Thread starter):

The A-400M and CV-22 are pipedreams.

The CV-22 is in the same class as the C-295 and therefore simply too small.

Although it might unrealistic to assumme the USAF would buy foreign eqippment (I refer to the A400M) to a greater extent, but US Special Forces were always those that had less problems with doing it, be it airborne or ground vehicles ... but maybe a complete new, stealthy approach meets their requirements best ...
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: Afsoc RFI For 30 New Tankers.

Tue Feb 14, 2006 4:52 pm

Quoting PADSpot (Reply 2):
but maybe a complete new, stealthy approach meets their requirements best ...

You could be right. But, you are looking at a 20 year development program for a stealth tanker/SOC mission aircraft.
 
PADSpot
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RE: Afsoc RFI For 30 New Tankers.

Tue Feb 14, 2006 5:16 pm

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 3):
But, you are looking at a 20 year development program for a stealth tanker/SOC mission aircraft.

That's true. Decades of development, billions of dollars and most important you need to produce more than 30 airplanes in order to make it feasible.

But at some point you just have to start ... and in small numbers this type of aircraft could also be useful to the next 10 biggest militaries in the western world, like the UK, France, Germany, Turkey, Spain etc ...
 
keesje
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RE: Afsoc RFI For 30 New Tankers.

Tue Feb 14, 2006 7:49 pm

Oh oh, better make sure it won't be too much of an aircraft.

IMO the -J has the best papers in overall national strategic value.
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CX747
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RE: Afsoc RFI For 30 New Tankers.

Wed Feb 15, 2006 2:28 am

I was reading an article several months ago that said the next round of buys would indeed look for a stealth aircraft etc. That round of special ops refuelers and platforms would come 30+ years from now when they are retiring the current birds that they are looking to buy.
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
columba
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RE: Afsoc RFI For 30 New Tankers.

Wed Feb 15, 2006 5:04 am

The C130J makes most sense since it is already in the fleet it would be too expensive to add a single new type to the it. Although I would love if the US buy some A400Ms in the future but I really doubt it.
It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
 
PADSpot
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RE: Afsoc RFI For 30 New Tankers.

Wed Feb 15, 2006 10:33 am

Quoting Keesje (Reply 5):
best papers in overall national strategic value.

ehhmm .... in what?

Quoting Columba (Reply 7):
The C130J makes most sense since it is already in the fleet it would be too expensive to add a single new type to the it. Although I would love if the US buy some A400Ms in the future but I really doubt it.

Yes, this is what it is finally going to result in ... no doubt
 
bennett123
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RE: Afsoc RFI For 30 New Tankers.

Tue Feb 28, 2006 6:22 pm

I would expect a C130J given the number in service already.
 
cannibalz3
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RE: Afsoc RFI For 30 New Tankers.

Wed Mar 01, 2006 6:59 am

Let's rephrase the question slightly: does anyone SERIOUSLY doubt the selection of the C-130J?
 
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STT757
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RE: Afsoc RFI For 30 New Tankers.

Wed Mar 01, 2006 12:38 pm

Quoting CannibalZ3 (Reply 10):
Let's rephrase the question slightly: does anyone SERIOUSLY doubt the selection of the C-130J?

A possible scenario I could see would be the USAF placing an order for A400s for SOC as a pacification over giving the order for 100+ KC-767s to Boeing, also as a quid pro quo in exchange for a "reasonable" order from Europe (France, Germany..) for lets say 8-12 C-17s.
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CX747
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RE: Afsoc RFI For 30 New Tankers.

Fri Mar 03, 2006 10:41 am

I can't see an order for anything other than a C-130. Having a small fleet of A400Ms would be difficult. Parts etc might become a hassle if you are operating in and out of third world countries and other hush hush places on a nightly bases. Also, a C-130 allows the operator to just blend in as another C-130 operated by the USAF. If a A400 comes in, then you know that Spec Ops has arrived.
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower

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