rjpieces
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IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Thu Jul 20, 2006 6:57 am

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/740395.html

An Israel Air Force fighter jet crashed late Wednesday while taking off from an Israel Defense Forces base in the Negev for an operation in Lebanon.

The pilot and navigator escaped from the aircraft without injury.

Initial IAF investigations indicated that at one of the aircraft's tires burst during take-off.
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LY744
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Thu Jul 20, 2006 7:04 am

They don't make them like they used to. If this was a Mirage it would be fixed up and shooting down MiGs again within a couple months.  Wink It would then be sold to Argentina and lost forever...


LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it
 
AirRyan
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Thu Jul 20, 2006 7:38 am

I don't understand why they ejected after takeoff? The tire blew so they ejected? Did it prohibit their rotation or did they get off the ground otherwise with just a blown out tire and open rim? You would have thought that as long as you could get the gear up you could still do the mission and worry about the tire later.
 
prebennorholm
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Thu Jul 20, 2006 7:47 am

Right now they are hammering underground Hezbollah command bunkers in southern Lebanon.

They are probably loading those F-16s heavier than the designers ever dreamed?
Always keep your number of landings equal to your number of take-offs
 
aislepathlight
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Thu Jul 20, 2006 7:53 am

Quoting Prebennorholm (Reply 3):
They are probably loading those F-16s heavier than the designers ever dreamed?

Probably... After all, they were designed as light weight fighters/multi role aircraft. The Israelis must have them loaded crazy full.
bleepbloop
 
LY744
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Thu Jul 20, 2006 8:02 am

The loads are probably more than what General Dynamics engineers envisioned 35 years ago, but the aircraft can definitely handle them. It does not look like the aircraft actually departed the runway, the crew probably had to eject as they were nearing the threshold, who wants to stay in an F-16 loaded with fuel and a couple tons of explosives heading for the open desert? Until we see pictures of the Sufa I wouldn't be discounting it as a total write off BTW, a few years ago an F-15A crashed on take off and the IDF/AF rebuilt it, it took about 2 years, but they really like their Eagles.


LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it
 
FlyUSCG
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Thu Jul 20, 2006 1:25 pm

Quoting AirRyan (Reply 2):
I don't understand why they ejected after takeoff? The tire blew so they ejected? Did it prohibit their rotation or did they get off the ground otherwise with just a blown out tire and open rim? You would have thought that as long as you could get the gear up you could still do the mission and worry about the tire later.

First of all, one word... Concorde. Second of all, a blown tire can have serious consequences. Shreds and debris ripping into the fuselage and tearing up all kinds of systems. And you dont raise a blown tire, it's no longer the same dimensions as the well was designed. Strips of tire still left on could latch onto something and then rip it out when they are lowered again. Then of course a fully fueled and armed fighter takes up a SHIT load of runway and if a tire blows out (IF you can even maintain control) your running out of runway faster than you can afford. So anything other than ejecting would have probably meant certain death for the crew.
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checksixx
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Thu Jul 20, 2006 10:27 pm

My simple answer would simply be that F-16's like to roll so you could take your chances I guess.

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AirRyan
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Thu Jul 20, 2006 11:52 pm

Quoting FlyUSCG (Reply 6):
First of all, one word... Concorde. Second of all, a blown tire can have serious consequences. Shreds and debris ripping into the fuselage and tearing up all kinds of systems. And you dont raise a blown tire, it's no longer the same dimensions as the well was designed. Strips of tire still left on could latch onto something and then rip it out when they are lowered again. Then of course a fully fueled and armed fighter takes up a SHIT load of runway and if a tire blows out (IF you can even maintain control) your running out of runway faster than you can afford. So anything other than ejecting would have probably meant certain death for the crew.

But the question remains - could they have still dropped that ordinance on the target before ejecting?  Smile Sucks to have one of their late model F-16I's, that's the least best news I've heard since Korea parked one of their shiny new F-15K's in the bottom of the Yellow Sea or Korean Strait!
 
AerospaceFan
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Fri Jul 21, 2006 6:14 pm

The following photograph, said to be of an F-16I at its 2003 roll-out, was found at the Website, F-16.net.

http://www.f-16.net/modules/pnGaller...&g2_itemId=57202&g2_serialNumber=2

From the photograph, it appears highly modified.

Here are some more links:

(Photograph from BBC)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/olmedia/1530000/images/_1531098_fsixteen300.jpg

(BBC story on purchase of 52 F-16I's in 2001)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/1531098.stm

Elsewhere, it is stated that Israel's purchase of the F-16I will be completed in the year 2008. Losses from attrition were probably anticipated, but even if not, it appears that the production line is still under way and that the loss of the F-16I aircraft, if considered totaled, in the last few days could be made up for by the purchase of an additional aircraft.

The following image-heavy Website also contains references to the acquisition of F-16I's and F-15I's. It appears that at least some of the F-16I's were paid for through U.S. military aid provided to Israel.

(Image-heavy Webpage)

http://www.israeli-weapons.com/weapons/aircraft/f-16i/F-16I.html

The following Website contains a description of the F-16I, its capabilities, and its reception by the Government of Israel. It also contains a graphic purporting to identify the nature of various exterior features that are visible on the F-16I.

(Jewish Virtual Library Webpage)

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/...ource/Society_&_Culture/f-16i.html

[Edited 2006-07-21 11:47:59]
What's fair is fair.
 
bennett123
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Fri Jul 21, 2006 6:42 pm

http://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19630904-0&lang=en


This is what can happen if you take off after a tyre burst.
 
bennett123
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Fri Jul 21, 2006 9:29 pm

I was just watching the BBC News.

There was an interview at an unnamed base, when F16 343 took off.

In the background there was a displayed Meteor F8, any ideas.
 
AerospaceFan
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Sat Jul 22, 2006 12:07 am

It might be the Ramon air base in the Negev, I would think.
What's fair is fair.
 
LY744
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Sat Jul 22, 2006 1:24 am

Quoting Bennett123 (Reply 11):
There was an interview at an unnamed base, when F16 343 took off.

There's no F-16 with the tail number 343 in the IDF/AF. But the airbase you saw would have been Ramat David. That's where all the 3XX numbered F-16s are, and one of the bases from which the Isreali Meteors used to operate.


LY744.
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bennett123
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Sat Jul 22, 2006 2:12 am

I checked the latest news, the number was 341.
 
LY744
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RE: IAF F-16I Crashes During Takeoff

Sat Jul 22, 2006 3:50 am

Quoting Bennett123 (Reply 14):
I checked the latest news, the number was 341.

That works! Like I said, you saw Ramat David AB. It's the closest base to the Syrian and Lebanese border and houses three squadrons of F-16s as well as the IDF/AFs small unit of maritime helicopters.


LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it

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