scottieprecord
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Help ID Refueling 707

Mon Jun 25, 2007 1:50 pm

This plane has been at SAT for months, and I can't ID it. I know it's owned by Omega Tanker, but there's no reg. It has three refueling baskets, 2 pods on the wings and one by the tail. Any help with ID-ing this plane would be greatly appreciated.

http://img158.imageshack.us/img158/397/707ig4.jpg

Thanks!

-Mike
 
FlagshipAZ
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Mon Jun 25, 2007 3:45 pm

Well, I did my best trying to help you here, Scottie. I went to the FAA registry database, and found that Omega Air has registered 16 707s! Most are the -320C model, which I believe is what this aircraft is. So unless we have some sort of markings on this bird, I'm afraid I'm not of much help here. Good luck on your ID search.
Regards.
"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy." --Ben Franklin
 
Venus6971
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Tue Jun 26, 2007 4:44 am

I wonder if it is an old Italian KC-137, I hear there fleet was in good shape with low hours.
I would help you but it is not in the contract
 
romeokc10fe
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Tue Jun 26, 2007 6:00 am

Quoting Venus6971 (Reply 2):
I wonder if it is an old Italian KC-137, I hear there fleet was in good shape with low hours

Uhhhhh....I've read just the oppsite, don't know.
 
iRISH251
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Tue Jun 26, 2007 7:15 am

Definitely ex-Italian. Compare to pics on the database and you will see where the minimalist Italian military markings have been removed.
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Tue Jun 26, 2007 9:39 am

Quoting FlagshipAZ (Reply 1):
I went to the FAA registry database, and found that Omega Air has registered 16 707s! Most are the -320C model, which I believe is what this aircraft is

I don't think it is a comdi. It is a B-707-320B

Quoting Venus6971 (Reply 2):
I wonder if it is an old Italian KC-137, I hear there fleet was in good shape with low hours.

I believe you are right, she does look like an Ex-ItAF KC-137. Notice she has all UHF antennas, and no VHF antennas. If she was an ex South American tanker, she would have all VHF radio antennas.
 
USCGC130
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Tue Jun 26, 2007 10:06 pm

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 5):
don't think it is a comdi. It is a B-707-320B

Note the gaps between the windows forward of the wing -- right where the cargo door is located on a -320C.

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 5):
Notice she has all UHF antennas, and no VHF antennas

How do you tell? Most 707s have swept-back blade-type antennas and these are straight. Is that a distinguishing characteristic of UHF antennas? (I always figured the ones on the civilian 707s were shaped and angled the way they were for aesthetic reasons.)
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Tue Jun 26, 2007 11:53 pm

Quoting Uscgc130 (Reply 6):
Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 5):
don't think it is a comdi. It is a B-707-320B

Note the gaps between the windows forward of the wing -- right where the cargo door is located on a -320C.

It may be my eyes, but I don't see the gaps.

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 5):
Notice she has all UHF antennas, and no VHF antennas

How do you tell? Most 707s have swept-back blade-type antennas and these are straight. Is that a distinguishing characteristic of UHF antennas? (I always figured the ones on the civilian 707s were shaped and angled the way they were for aesthetic reasons.)

Yes, the UHF antennas are straight, and VHF are swept back.
 
USCGC130
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Wed Jun 27, 2007 11:16 am

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 7):
It may be my eyes, but I don't see the gaps.

Note the blank spaces between the second and third and the tenth and eleventh windows back.

Granted, civilian -320Cs don't have spaces between their windows in that area that are any wider than those on any other 707s. But these fall right where the cargo door's cut lines would be on a -320C...even if the cut lines on this particular aircraft are all but impossible to see. Could that be the result of the lighting, the angle, and/or the shade of the paint?

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 7):
Yes, the UHF antennas are straight, and VHF are swept back.

Why? Honest question. Is there a functional reason, or is it a matter of the military not caring about aesthetics like the airlines do?
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Wed Jun 27, 2007 11:47 pm

Quoting USCGC130 (Reply 8):
Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 7):
Yes, the UHF antennas are straight, and VHF are swept back.

Why? Honest question. Is there a functional reason, or is it a matter of the military not caring about aesthetics like the airlines do?

T^he antenna style has to do with the radio signal wave lenght. I'm not an expert on this by any means, but the VHF (110.0-137.775 MHz) wave lenght is either longer or shorter than that of military UHF (225.0-395.5 MHz) frequency wave lenghts. It is interesting to note that UHF "Guard" (243.0 MHz) is exactly twice that of VHF "Guard" (121.5 MHz). I don't know if there is a relationship there, or not.

So, the antenna style has nothing to do with aesthetics.

US Military aircraft that carry both UHF and VHF radios, or have a combo VHF/UHF radio (ARC-174?) carry both types of antennas.
 
scottieprecord
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Thu Jun 28, 2007 9:22 am

Well thanks for your help guys.. I had no idea Omega had 16 707s! I looked through the full-size picture, and the only markings I saw was a small "B 707" below the tail. I guess I'll just upload it without a reg..

thanks again!
Mike
 
Venus6971
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Fri Jun 29, 2007 7:14 am

Quoting RomeoKC10FE (Reply 3):
Uhhhhh....I've read just the oppsite, don't know.

talked to a NATO 707 guy from Geilenkirchen yesterday and he told me that the ITalians 707's are in Bad shape, NATO 707 trainer visited us at TIK yesterday, they LX 20000 which is an old Luftwaffe bird with low hours.
I would help you but it is not in the contract
 
starstream707
Posts: 171
Joined: Tue Mar 21, 2006 1:01 pm

RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Sat Jun 30, 2007 3:29 pm

Quoting Venus6971 (Reply 11):
NATO 707 trainer visited us at TIK yesterday

Is it still here in Oklahoma City? I'd LOVE to hear that thing take off!!
 
Pride
Posts: 50
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Sat Jun 30, 2007 11:40 pm

Definately Ex Italian Air Force. Most likely s/n MM62150. This one is sold to Omega Air as N707FR.
 
FlagshipAZ
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Sun Jul 01, 2007 1:28 am

If this is N707FR, then it was known as MM62148 with the Italian Air Force. Boeing serial #19740, line #676, delivered to TAP Air Portugal as 707-382B, in 1968. The pictured 707 Scottieprecord provided is very similiar to the aircraft pictured in the JetPhotos database...both pics show a bare-metaled finish 707 with the same patchworks.
Looks like Pride came thru for you, Mike.  Smile
Regards.
"Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy." --Ben Franklin
 
Venus6971
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Sun Jul 01, 2007 3:26 am

Quoting Starstream707 (Reply 12):
Is it still here in Oklahoma City? I'd LOVE to hear that thing take off!!

Got here on tues and left Wed night.
I would help you but it is not in the contract
 
scottieprecord
Posts: 1208
Joined: Sun Aug 01, 2004 5:38 am

RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Sun Jul 01, 2007 7:20 am

Quoting Pride (Reply 13):
Definately Ex Italian Air Force. Most likely s/n MM62150. This one is sold to Omega Air as
N707FR.

Found it!


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Peter Tonna



This is definitely the same plane (same exact markings and everything). The only problem.. I look up N707FR, and the FAA gives a different serial number  Sad Does Omega have any 707-3F5Cs?

Again, Thanks so much!
Mike
 
scottieprecord
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RE: Help ID Refueling 707

Sun Jul 01, 2007 7:30 am

Whoa... just kidding. There are some incorrect entries in both Anet and JPnet.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Lino Borges - Azores Spotters



This shows MM62150 as c/n 19740, which is what the FAA has as N707FR, which makes sense. All the other entries, I guess, are incorrect... I knew something was up there. haha

So, N707FR it is! Thanks!

-Mike

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