AirRyan
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Senator Calls For Open Competition In KC-X...

Thu Sep 20, 2007 8:02 am

The USAF cannot grade the CSAR-X a certain way but expect to use a completely opposite metric for KC-X, Boeing doesn't deserve to win both the CSAR-X and KC-X but they will likely win at least one of them...

Quote:
Sessions calls for open competition in air tanker race
Senator adds amendment to defense bill urging open competition for Air Force tanker contract

http://www.al.com/news/mobileregiste...e/news/1190194342229620.xml&coll=3
 
echster
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RE: Senator Calls For Open Competition In KC-X...

Thu Sep 20, 2007 12:03 pm

Senator Sessions from Alabama. Of course, that's where Airbus plans to modify the A330s into KC-30s. He doesn't so much as want an open competition as much as he wants Airbus to win and bring the jobs to his state. Seems like typical political-speak to me.
 
KevinSmith
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RE: Senator Calls For Open Competition In KC-X...

Thu Sep 20, 2007 12:19 pm

Quoting Echster (Reply 1):
He doesn't so much as want an open competition as much as he wants Airbus to win and bring the jobs to his state

Exactimundo!!!!!!!! Can you say pork?
Learning to fly, but I ain't got wings.
 
AirRyan
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RE: Senator Calls For Open Competition In KC-X...

Thu Sep 20, 2007 12:32 pm

Quoting Echster (Reply 1):
Senator Sessions from Alabama. Of course, that's where Airbus plans to modify the A330s into KC-30s

As opposed to the Democrat politicans from Washington state who were at the Boeing KC-767 pep rally a few weeks ago? That's what polticians do - they represent their constituents and all this legislation does is "encourage" the USAF to select the best product and if the USAF uses the same selection criteria as they did when they awarded the CSAR-X to Boeing, the KC-X will be a hands down winner for the KC-30.

Quote:
The U.S. Air Force "should hold a full and open competition" to choose the best available aerial refueling tankers at the best price, according to an amendment inserted in the U.S. Senate's defense spending bill by Sen. Jeff Sessions, R-Mobile.
 
Devilfish
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RE: Senator Calls For Open Competition In KC-X...

Thu Sep 20, 2007 1:31 pm

And this piece advises against a split buy.....

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/cgi...1H8AAAEAAFNsW98AAAAL&modele=jdc_34

Tanker Competition: Buying Both Planes Would Waste Billions

(Source: The Lexington Institute; issued Sept. 19, 2007)

(© The Lexington Institute; reproduced by permission)

By Loren B. Thompson, Ph.D.

Quote:
"The Air Force doesn't like that idea at all, and wants to replace the antique tankers as soon as possible -- before they become safety risks. The service is running a competition to decide whether a Boeing plane or an Airbus plane would be better suited to provide the first 179 next-generation tankers.

Since the Air Force only has enough money to buy 15 new tankers per year, it could take decades to replace all the Eisenhower-era planes in the fleet. Unfortunately, legislators from Alabama -- whose state stands to benefit from an Airbus win -- want to split the contract between both competing planes. They fear the Air Force will pick the smaller Boeing plane because it can land in more places, uses less space on the ground, and burns a ton less aviation fuel per flight hour.

The Airbus plane can carry more fuel and cargo, so the Alabama delegation believes a good outcome would be to buy a mix of aircraft that affords access to the best features of both planes. But such 'dual sourcing' is a bad idea that would waste billions of dollars without enhancing the performance of the aerial-refueling fleet."
"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
 
Curt22
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RE: Senator Calls For Open Competition In KC-X...

Sun Sep 23, 2007 12:58 pm

Hum.... Alabama Senator calls for fair and open compatition while EADS has been quite clear they intend to build their aircraft in Mobile AL...

How come the Senators from Washington aren't making the same request? Then again, as everyone's favorite Boeing hater Ryan would know...the Senators from NY and CT seem to be the only ones concerned about fair compatition in the CSAR-X program...

Why is it only the loosers feel compelled to make such complaints?
 
trex8
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RE: Senator Calls For Open Competition In KC-X...

Sun Sep 23, 2007 4:52 pm

Quoting Curt22 (Reply 5):
How come the Senators from Washington aren't making the same request? Then again, as everyone's favorite Boeing hater Ryan would know...the Senators from NY and CT seem to be the only ones concerned about fair compatition in the CSAR-X program...

Why is it only the loosers feel compelled to make such complaints?

where have you been the last few years?

http://cantwell.senate.gov/news/record.cfm?id=241873

besides the WA state delegation all got egg on their face from the aborted leasing deal
 
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zeke
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RE: Senator Calls For Open Competition In KC-X...

Tue Sep 25, 2007 1:11 am

In my view this is looking from the outside like the start of another body armour style fiasco, with the KC-30 being the Dragon Skin, the KC-767ADV the Point Blank, and Boeing equivalent to Point Blank Body Armor/DHB Industries.
We are addicted to our thoughts. We cannot change anything if we cannot change our thinking – Santosh Kalwar
 
Lumberton
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RE: Senator Calls For Open Competition In KC-X...

Tue Sep 25, 2007 1:15 am

IMO, at the end of the day, Sessions doesn't have the votes in either house to carry the day for the KC-30--even if the USAF selects it. A bruising Congressional fight would loom, with the Secretary of the Air Force figuring prominently as the punching bag for both sides. As I have opined endlessly, I feel they will take the political path of least resistance and select the aircraft for which they are certain of funding.

[Edited 2007-09-24 18:17:03]
"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
 
AirRyan
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RE: Senator Calls For Open Competition In KC-X...

Tue Sep 25, 2007 11:59 am

Quoting Curt22 (Reply 5):
How come the Senators from Washington aren't making the same request? Then again, as everyone's favorite Boeing hater Ryan would know...the Senators from NY and CT seem to be the only ones concerned about fair compatition in the CSAR-X program...

You don't understand, I'm a rather fond Boeing enthusiast but even they don't trump my patriotism - Boeing' just happens to be the one offering inferior and outdated platforms for CSAR-X and KC-X.

Here's more substance for those that may think Congress will be voting on who gets the bid or not:

Quote:
The wings for Airbus aircraft are built at its Broughton factory in North Wales and the company employs more than 13,000 people in the UK.

Although production of the fuselages will move from Europe to America if Airbus wins the contract, the wings will continue to be made in Wales.

Airbus hopes that the British component of its aircraft will carry some weight with US legislators and defence officials, given the close relationship between the countries.

A spokesman for EADS, the parent company of Airbus, said: “The US and the UK enjoy a special security relationship. The Northrop Grumman KC30 programme is a unique opportunity to simultaneously strengthen future US/UK joint operations, as well as deepen our mutually beneficial defence industrial partnership.”

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/to...ors/engineering/article2517811.ece

[Edited 2007-09-25 05:00:40]
 
Lumberton
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RE: Senator Calls For Open Competition In KC-X...

Tue Sep 25, 2007 7:05 pm

Quoting AirRyan (Reply 9):
Here's more substance for those that may think Congress will be voting on who gets the bid or not:

The USAF will select. Congress, via its appropriations functions, will ratify or negate that selection.
"When all is said and done, more will be said than done".
 
AirRyan
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RE: Senator Calls For Open Competition In KC-X...

Wed Sep 26, 2007 8:39 am

Quoting Lumberton (Reply 10):
Quoting AirRyan (Reply 9):
Here's more substance for those that may think Congress will be voting on who gets the bid or not:

The USAF will select. Congress, via its appropriations functions, will ratify or negate that selection.

Yeah, just like they did when the Navy bypassed Congress with their Super Hornet, eh?  wink 

Seriously, no Congressman with a straight face would be able to volley and argument against our closest allies that an aircraft they designed is simply not "good enough" despite the fact that the USAF would have selected it, too. A) they couldn't formulate a logical basis on which to argue and B) it would utterly ruin their reputation as any sort of credible congressional statesman.
 
redflyer
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RE: Senator Calls For Open Competition In KC-X...

Wed Sep 26, 2007 9:05 am

Quoting AirRyan (Reply 9):
A spokesman for EADS, the parent company of Airbus, said: “The US and the UK enjoy a special security relationship. The Northrop Grumman KC30 programme is a unique opportunity to simultaneously strengthen future US/UK joint operations, as well as deepen our mutually beneficial defence industrial partnership.”

What a crock of runny bowel movement! Talk about sleeze!!!! The US and the UK already enjoy one of the strongest political and defense relationships between any two countries in the world. As if it needs any strengthening in any aspect! Oh, I forgot! Let's play the sympathy card and make it even stronger!!!!  rotf  rotf  rotf 
My other home is in the sky inside my Piper Cherokee 180.
 
halls120
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RE: Senator Calls For Open Competition In KC-X...

Wed Sep 26, 2007 11:42 am

Quoting AirRyan (Thread starter):
Quote:Sessions calls for open competition in air tanker race
Senator adds amendment to defense bill urging open competition for Air Force tanker contract

Wow. Somebody stop the presses. A senator from Alabama calling for open competition in the tanker procurement. About as newsworthy as a senator from Washington doing the same thing.

 zzz   zzz   zzz   zzz   zzz   zzz   zzz 
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography

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