art
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Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Fri Jan 18, 2008 11:06 am

"The Royal Norwegian MoD has requested FMV, Sweden’s Defence Materiel Administration, to submit binding proposals for the replacement of its ageing fleet of F-16’s with the Gripen fighter."

http://www.gripen.com/en/MediaRelations/News/2008/080118_no_rbi.htm
 
Arniepie
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Fri Jan 18, 2008 12:34 pm

I always tought it could be a good idea for Belgium and Norway together with other smaller european countries to team up again (like they did with the F16 program) and make a joined request for a F16 replacement, the Gripen certainly sounds like a good idea as it is affordable and can be acquired in substantial numbers.
Also there is enough growth potential (stronger engine, Meteor missiles, AESA?, ....) for it to last a long time.
[edit post]
 
PADSpot
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Fri Jan 18, 2008 1:13 pm



Quoting Art (Thread starter):
to submit binding proposals for the replacement of its ageing fleet of F-16’s with the Gripen fighter.

Binding for both sides? The Danish MOD was criticized for demanding "informational proposals" in an attempt to apparently just back up an already made decision in favor of the JSF (which SAAB and Eurofighter refused to make, I read a rather harsh comment on this from EADS military boss Hamilton)
 
Devilfish
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacem

Fri Jan 18, 2008 5:22 pm

Quoting ArniePie (Reply 1):
I always tought it could be a good idea for Belgium and Norway together with other smaller european countries to team up again (like they did with the F16 program) and make a joined request for a F16 replacement,



Quoting PADSpot (Reply 2):

Binding for both sides? The Danish MOD was criticized for demanding "informational proposals" in an attempt to apparently just back up an already made decision in favor of the JSF (which SAAB and Eurofighter refused to make,

It's really curious that Norway and Switzerland issued RFPs to Gripen at the same time. While it could be seen as justification for the JSF, driving a better bargain with LockMart in terms of offsets and price seems a more convincing motivation. And going by their statement, SAAB in this instance is very pleased at complying with the requests in contrast to the Danish case.....

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/images/AIR_JAS-39N_Concept_Water_lg.jpg

Gripen Invited to Tender for Norwegian, Swiss Fighter Programs
(Jan 18)

Quote:
"'We are delighted that Sweden, through FMV, has been invited to propose what we confidently believe will be the complete solution to meet Norway's future combat aircraft requirements.'

[.....]

'The Gripen team is delighted to be invited by the Swiss authorities to meet Switzerland's future combat aircraft needs'."


http://www.defense-aerospace.com/cgi...f38AAAEAAB--ZiUAAAAR&modele=jdc_34

It's really interesting that other offerors were not mentioned in Norway's case, and only comparatively bigger aircraft in the Swiss announcement. None for this.....



[Edited 2008-01-18 09:34:50]
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SAS A340
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Fri Jan 18, 2008 5:33 pm

Unfortunately, i think that Norway is in the hands of USA and the JSF. I would be surprised if the would go for the Gripen. I think it was the US foreign minister that say regarding to this deal "No contract.less contact"......  biting 
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PADSpot
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacem

Fri Jan 18, 2008 5:58 pm



Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 3):
It's really curious that Norway and Switzerland issued RFPs to Gripen at the same time. While it could be seen as justification for the JSF, driving a better bargain with LockMart in terms of offsets and price seems a more convincing motivation. And going by their statement, SAAB in this instance is very pleased at complying with the requests in contrast to the Danish case.....

It would be news to me that the Swiss had more than superficial negotiations with LockMart about the JSF. Replacing F-5s with EF or JSFs would be a large leap in capacity. However, my two cents are on the Gripen (or maybe Block-60 F-16s). Replacing a 5Mil$ F-5 with a 120++Mil$ EF or JSF is way beyond what you can sell to a democratic decision making institution.

Quoting SAS A340 (Reply 4):
Unfortunately, i think that Norway is in the hands of USA and the JSF. I would be surprised if the would go for the Gripen. I think it was the US foreign minister that say regarding to this deal "No contract.less contact"...... biting

It is much more likely that EADS sells EFs to Norway than to Denmark. The Norwegian Government was more than pleased when Eurofighter transfered certain development and production packages to Norway even before they have entered into negotiations. They addressed exactly the concerns Norway had about the JSF project ...
 
GDB
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacem

Fri Jan 18, 2008 6:53 pm

Could it come down to what one gives the best industrial payoff for Norway.
Remember, the Norwegians have a competent defence/aerospace sector, in particular with guided weapons that are often innovative.
(I would like to see the UK adopt the NSM, a new sea or air or ground launched anti ship missile, also very capable at land attack/littoral warfare and generally very smart and new generation, for RN ships, EH-101's, F-35's, maybe even RAF Typhoons too).
 
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Mortyman
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Fri Jan 18, 2008 8:43 pm

read about NSM missile here:

http://www.kongsberg.com/eng/kda/pro...iles/NavalxStrikexMissile&id=32934

There are plans to develop a multi-role version of the NSM, with ground strike being an option. This missile will be integrated with the Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II "Joint Strike Fighter", and might be integrated with the Eurofighter and the JAS 39 Gripen as well. Studies have shown that the F-35 would be able to carry two of these in its internal bays, while additional missiles could be carried externally.

According to Kongsberg, this "multi-role NSM" is the only anti-ship missile that will fit inside the F-35's internal bays.[1] Lockheed Martin and Kongsberg have signed a joint-marketing agreement for this air-launched version of the NSM, called the Joint Strike Missile (JSM). The project is funded by Norway and Australia.[2][3] The JSM is planned to feature a two-way communications line, so that the missile can communicate with the central control room or other missiles in the air. By September 2007 the missile development is still only at the planning stage ( Wikipedia )



another missile " The Penguin " is also a Norwegian missile also used by the US Navy:

Penguin Mk2 Mod7 for Naval helicopters:

http://www.kongsberg.com/eng/kda/pro...oducts/Missiles/Mk2xModx7&id=32932

Penguin Mk2 Mod7 for ships:

http://www.kongsberg.com/eng/kda/pro...siles/MK2xModx7xforxships&id=32938


Penguin Mk3 for fighter and patrol aircraft

http://www.kongsberg.com/eng/kda/pro...KDA/Products/Missiles/Mk3&id=32933

[Edited 2008-01-18 12:48:22]
 
GDB
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Fri Jan 18, 2008 10:39 pm

Yes, I was thinking about NSM in relation to F-35 carriage, as well as on RN ships and helicopters.
It would provide a common system as well as being modern and designed with today's scenarios in mind, not just hitting major warships out at sea.
 
F27Friendship
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Sat Jan 19, 2008 8:12 am

The big disadvantage JSF has at the moment is that future more modern missiles like METEOR, IRIS-T are not integrated.

Integration of the Norwegian misslise would be a great thing
 
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Mortyman
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Sat Jan 19, 2008 2:42 pm

The NSM do fit in to the bay of the JSF
 
F27Friendship
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Sun Jan 20, 2008 6:31 pm



Quoting Mortyman (Reply 10):
The NSM do fit in to the bay of the JSF



Quoting Mortyman (Reply 7):
According to Kongsberg, this "multi-role NSM" is the only anti-ship missile that will fit inside the F-35's internal bays.[

 
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SAS A340
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Mon Jan 21, 2008 3:37 pm

On the news this morning,they told us that for the deal to come true,Norway also want Sweden to buy this "supergrip" ore E/F version. Sweden holds about 130 C/D Gripps to day and to replace those with E/F version,only 48 units will sustain security at the same level as before....  scratchchin  The C/D versions,where would they go?  Confused I have a hard time seeing this deal goes true......
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art
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:13 pm



Quoting SAS A340 (Reply 12):
Sweden holds about 130 C/D Gripps to day



Quoting SAS A340 (Reply 12):
The C/D versions,where would they go?

If only life were so simple as to supply them to an Asian country in urgent need of replacing MiG 21's.
 
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Mon Jan 21, 2008 6:58 pm



Quoting Art (Reply 13):
Quoting SAS A340 (Reply 12):
The C/D versions,where would they go?

If only life were so simple as to supply them to an Asian country in urgent need of replacing MiG 21's.

Has the Gripen been offered to nations outside of Europe?
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agill
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Mon Jan 21, 2008 7:41 pm



Quoting EBJ1248650 (Reply 14):

Has the Gripen been offered to nations outside of Europe?

Thailand did buy them didn't they? And they have been offered to at least India, Brazil and Chile... I think  Smile
 
Doona
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Mon Jan 21, 2008 10:10 pm



Quoting EBJ1248650 (Reply 14):

Has the Gripen been offered to nations outside of Europe?

And South Africa has 20-30 on order, I believe.

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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Tue Jan 22, 2008 1:37 am



Quoting Doona (Reply 16):
And South Africa has 20-30 on order, I believe

26 to be exact (9 two seaters and 17 single)
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Devilfish
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacem

Wed Jan 23, 2008 7:30 pm



Quoting PADSpot (Reply 5):
It is much more likely that EADS sells EFs to Norway than to Denmark. The Norwegian Government was more than pleased when Eurofighter transfered certain development and production packages to Norway even before they have entered into negotiations. They addressed exactly the concerns Norway had about the JSF project ...

Selling Typhoons to Norway may be a bit difficult now that EADS has withdrawn the Eurofighter from the contest.....

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/...ntinued-dogfights-in-norway-03034/

Quote:
"Dec 21/07: EADS pulls its Eurofighter out of the Norwegian and Danish competitions, leaving both future fighter programs as a straight-up competition between the JAS-39 and the F-35. The rationales given are vague and make little sense, but many sources believe the key objection is official favoritism toward the F-35. The government-to-government nature of the F-35 deal, it seems, wouldn't require the same industrial offsets, though the F-35 program has pledged significant production contracts with Denmark's Terma and with Norwegian firms."

Quoting SAS A340 (Reply 12):
On the news this morning,they told us that for the deal to come true,Norway also want Sweden to buy this "supergrip" ore E/F version. Sweden holds about 130 C/D Gripps to day and to replace those with E/F version,only 48 units will sustain security at the same level as before.... scratchchin The C/D versions,where would they go? Confused I have a hard time seeing this deal goes true......

This makes matters very complicated for SAAB as Sweden is commited to a reduced 100-fighter fleet. They need a big win in the following to ease the pressure.....

Quoting Agill (Reply 15):
And they have been offered to at least India, Brazil and Chile... I think



From the link above.....

Quote:
"The Gripen's new 'next generation' JAS-39N version is a single engine fighter, which may be able to offset some of the existing Gripen model's range issue. It has already garnered key political support, however, and is considered to be superior to the F-35 in speed, agility, likely sticker price – and possibly even in jobs, given the Gripen's connection to Volvo industrial benefits.

[.....]

Despite all this, it would be highly surprising if Norway would decide to pull out of the JSF program now that the production MoU is signed. Although the Norwegian government stresses that no final decision will be made before 2008, there is little doubt that any Norwegian withdrawal after signing this latest MoU has significant potential to become a political scandal. Tom Burbage has previously stated that should Norway choose to withdraw, it could trigger demands of reparations from Lockheed Martin in the range of almost $1 billion. While this is an expected negotiating tactic, it's a demand that would be backed by contract provisions that could not simply be ignored.

The effects a withdrawal could have on the JSF program as a whole are unknown, but they could be significant despite the small number of aircraft involved (approximately 80).

[.....]

Finally, the F-35 enjoys systemic preference, in that it reportedly has the support of the Air Force and the military bureaucracy, while the JAS-39 Gripen for instance enjoys predominantly political and some industrial support."


http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/images/AIR_F-35A_AA-1_Landing_lg.jpg

So it looks like a one-on-one battle, with LockMart having the incumbent position and a fallback option (although it's not solicited) of unilaterally offering a next generation Falcon should they verge on being beaten in price.

Quoting Art (Reply 13):
If only life were so simple as to supply them to an Asian country in urgent need of replacing MiG 21's.

Make that old F-5s.....

View Large View Medium
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Photo © HansAir
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Photo © Piotr Biskupski


There's always the Philippines waiting for bargain basement offers and hand-me-downs.  Wink
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art
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Thu Jan 24, 2008 12:33 am



Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 18):
Quoting Art (Reply 13):
If only life were so simple as to supply them to an Asian country in urgent need of replacing MiG 21's.

Make that old F-5s.....

There's always the Philippines waiting for bargain basement offers and hand-me-downs.

Good point. Would be very useful to Saab if the Philippines were interested in buying a shedload of used Gripens.
 
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SAS A340
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Thu Jan 24, 2008 12:58 am

News paper this morning says that SAAB has offered Denmark a deal for 48 Gripen,training,simulators and service for 4.6 bilj $ and thats a similar deal that SAAB will offer Norway..... This is probably not written in stone.
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art
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Thu Jan 24, 2008 1:11 am



Quoting SAS A340 (Reply 20):
News paper this morning says that SAAB has offered Denmark a deal for 48 Gripen,training,simulators and service for 4.6 bilj $

Do you know if that is for the proposed upgraded Gripen?
 
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Thu Jan 24, 2008 1:27 am



Quoting Art (Reply 21):
Do you know if that is for the proposed upgraded Gripen?

Dosent say,but i guess it is because thats the plane Norway want,but i,m not 100%.
It's not what u do,it's how u do it!
 
Bengan
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacem

Thu Jan 24, 2008 7:00 am

Quoting Art (Reply 21):

Do you know if that is for the proposed upgraded Gripen?


It is.

22 billion dkk($4.3b) includes 48 aircraft, training, spares and maintenance for 20 years.

Artists Impression:



/Bengt

[Edited 2008-01-23 23:05:16]
 
art
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Thu Jan 24, 2008 10:21 am

"US concerned over Norway's $8bn fighter selection programme, Saab's Gripen may be favoured news

15 January 2008...

[edited out]

...US concerns have come to the fore amid efforts by Norway and Sweden to increase their defence cooperation, including the possible establishment of joint army, naval and air force units and potential common procurement programmes for major defence equipment.

Norwegian government sources have been quoted in the media as saying that very likely a landmark agreement between Norway and Sweden may come about in 2008 that would involve an unprecedented level of collaboration between the defence forces of each country.

Such cooperation would involve interoperability of equipment as a key issue.

Under such a joint military programme, sources said, two or more Nordic nations, most probably Sweden and Norway, will establish a common fighter unit to police their national airspace or participate in international operations.

Such an eventuality may be the reason for the withdrawal of the Eurofighter consortium from the bidding process."

Source: http://www.domain-b.com/aero/mil_avi/mil_aircraft/20080115_norway.html via link from http://www.air-attack.com/news/news_...-Saabs-Gripen-may-be-favoured.html

If Norway and Sweden are considering such a radical political move to ultra-close co-operation on defence, this puts the whole F-16 replacement program in a different light. No longer a Gripen v F-35 evaluation but a re-evaluation of Norway's defence strategy.

It would be interesting to see a military parallel to SAS. Anyone have any idea if Denmark would be interested in much closer defence co-operation with Sweden and Norway?


Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 18):
Tom Burbage has previously stated that should Norway choose to withdraw, it could trigger demands of reparations from Lockheed Martin in the range of almost $1 billion. While this is an expected negotiating tactic, it's a demand that would be backed by contract provisions that could not simply be ignored.

I have no idea how much it would cost Norway (financially) to switch out of the F-35 but I have read that the US will still be paying at least $100 million per airframe in 2012, if I remember correctly.

On that basis a deal similar to the one offered to Denmark for 48 upgraded Gripens mentioned below looks extremely attractive.

Quoting Bengan (Reply 23):
22 billion dkk($4.3b) includes 48 aircraft, training, spares and maintenance for 20 years.

 
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SAS A340
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Thu Jan 24, 2008 5:10 pm



Quoting Art (Reply 24):
Under such a joint military programme, sources said, two or more Nordic nations

Probably thats why Norway demanded Sweden to also acquire the N version for a possible deal....there might be things going on here that we dont know mutch about  Confused
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F27Friendship
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Thu Jan 24, 2008 5:44 pm



Quoting Bengan (Reply 23):
Artists Impression:

that's a lot of bombs (drag)
 
PADSpot
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacem

Thu Jan 24, 2008 8:29 pm



Quoting Bengan (Reply 23):
Artists Impression:

looks badass Big grin
 
Devilfish
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Tue Apr 29, 2008 3:49 am

Update:

Gripen proposal submitted.....

http://www.defenseindustrydaily.com/...-Bid-With-a-Twist-04865/#more-4865

Quote:
"'An integral part of the Swedish offer to Norway, is a commitment on the part of the Swedish Government to operate the same advanced version of the Gripen fighter aircraft as offered to Norway, in the event that Norway selects Gripen as its future combat aircraft. This offer creates a win-win situation for both countries, as they would not only share the development costs for the new fighter but would also share future enhancements over the future operational life of Gripen fighter aircraft for the next 30-40 years.'

[.....]

To back that up, a number of cooperation agreements with Norwegian companies were announced in Oslo on April 28/08. The biggest partnership involves Kongsberg Defence & Aerospace AS. It covers composites and missiles in particular, including the new NSM anti-ship missile. That missile offer will help match the F-35 team's offer. The overall agreement is reportedly valued at 12 billion NOK/ $2+ billion, spread over 10-15 years. Other partnerships include:

Thales Norway (Communications equipment)
Nammo (Gripen 27mm cannon ammunition)
Simrad Optronics ASA (UAVs)
Natech (cabling, panels, and racks)
TotAlgroup (design and structural parts)
Note that many of these agreements are likely to be conditional, based on Norway's final choice of fighter.

The Norwegian government is expected to announce its decision at the end of 2008, and parliament is to vote on the issue in 2009."


Photos here.....

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...hlight-gripen-ng-capabilities.html
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brendows
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Tue Apr 29, 2008 8:12 am



Quoting F27Friendship (Reply 26):
that's a lot of bombs (drag)

And huge pylons (drag)... That thing would light up like a Christmas tree on radars Big grin
 
wvsuperhornet
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Tue Apr 29, 2008 8:40 am

Maybe I missed it but is norway looking for in a fighter?

An Interceptor or an multirole aircraft?
 
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Mortyman
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Tue Apr 29, 2008 12:17 pm



Quoting Wvsuperhornet (Reply 30):
An Interceptor or an multirole aircraft?

Multirole



Tom Burbage of the JSF said yeasterday that 48 JSF would cost under 20 billion NOK
 
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Mortyman
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Tue Apr 29, 2008 12:19 pm



Quoting Art (Reply 24):
joint army, naval and air force units

Trust me, it would never happen
 
checksixx
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:46 am

Strange...wasn't Norway complaining about the 'short range' of the F-35 recently? The F-35's combat radius is nothing short of awesome and now they're looking at Gripen?? I guess that requirement got tanked huh?
 
wvsuperhornet
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Wed Apr 30, 2008 4:49 am

Well I guess if they aren't happy with the F-35 they could always go to an F-15E version. They would lose the stealth but would have their range covered.
 
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:05 am



Quoting Checksixx (Reply 33):
Strange...wasn't Norway complaining about the 'short range' of the F-35 recently? The F-35's combat radius is nothing short of awesome and now they're looking at Gripen?? I guess that requirement got tanked huh?

The Gripen NG will have a range of 4000km (2485 miles, 2160 nm) according to Linköping based newspaper Corren. I'll try to find an electronic source, all i have right now is the "hardware-copy" of the paper...

Wikipedia, citing jsf.mil, says the F-35A will fly 1200 nm without drop tanks. Anyone know what those extra gallons will do to the range? Unless they double the amount of fuel using drop tanks, I guess the Gripen range isn't half bad compared to the F-35...
 
art
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:33 am



Quoting Wvsuperhornet (Reply 34):
Well I guess if they aren't happy with the F-35 they could always go to an F-15E version.

I think the only contenders are F-35, Gripen and (possibly) Typhoon.
 
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Wed Apr 30, 2008 7:48 am



Quoting TGIF (Reply 35):

The Gripen NG will have a range of 4000km (2485 miles, 2160 nm)

Is that with our without drop tanks? It would be interesting to see a breakdown in range with and without drop tanks for both a/c.
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brendows
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacem

Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:34 am



Quoting TGIF (Reply 35):
The Gripen NG will have a range of 4000km (2485 miles, 2160 nm) according to Linköping based newspaper Corren.

That has to be ferry range with external tanks (ferry range for the current Gripen is about 3000km IIRC.) The internal tank volume for the Gripen demonstrator has grown from ~3300kg (for the current Gripen) to ~5000kg.

Quoting Art (Reply 36):
I think the only contenders are F-35, Gripen and (possibly) Typhoon.

Just F-35 and Gripen, since Typhoon withdrew from the competition before Christmas.
 
TGIF
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Wed Apr 30, 2008 10:57 am



Quoting Moriarty (Reply 37):
Is that with our without drop tanks? It would be interesting to see a breakdown in range with and without drop tanks for both a/c.

Yes I believe external tanks are included and thats why we need some figures for the F-35 with external tank (or Gripen without them) to get an equal comparison.

Quoting Art (Reply 36):
I think the only contenders are F-35, Gripen and (possibly) Typhoon.

F-35 and Gripen were the only ones to submit a proposal on the 28th of April. But what I guess Wvsuperhornet ment was that if range was this significant, Norway should have invited other parties (i.e. F-15E) to submit a proposal.
 
art
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Wed Apr 30, 2008 11:49 am



Quoting Brendows (Reply 38):
Quoting Art (Reply 36):
I think the only contenders are F-35, Gripen and (possibly) Typhoon.

Just F-35 and Gripen, since Typhoon withdrew from the competition before Christmas.

When I said possibly Typhoon, that would be in the unlikely event that Norway did not want to accept either the F-35 or Gripen proposals and asked Eurofighter to submit their proposal, under which circumstances I would be surprised if Eurofighter refused.
 
checksixx
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RE: Norway Requests Gripen Offer For F-16 Replacement

Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:24 pm



Quoting TGIF (Reply 35):
The Gripen NG will have a range of 4000km (2485 miles, 2160 nm) according to Linköping based newspaper Corren. I'll try to find an electronic source, all i have right now is the "hardware-copy" of the paper...

Wikipedia, citing jsf.mil, says the F-35A will fly 1200 nm without drop tanks. Anyone know what those extra gallons will do to the range? Unless they double the amount of fuel using drop tanks, I guess the Gripen range isn't half bad compared to the F-35...

Can you feel your car screeching to a stop? First, the Gripen range is WITH external tanks in a ferry configuration. Its combat radius is around 500 miles. F-35 combat radius is around 600 miles. I'd say they're getting less range and that was my point.
 
TGIF
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Quoting Checksixx (Reply 41):
Can you feel your car screeching to a stop? First, the Gripen range is WITH external tanks in a ferry configuration. Its combat radius is around 500 miles. F-35 combat radius is around 600 miles. I'd say they're getting less range and that was my point.

Yes, as I stated in my post it is WITH external fuel tanks, nothing else... I was trying to compare it's ferry configuration to the F-35 ferry configuration, was I not clear about that??

Quoting TGIF (Reply 35):
F-35A will fly 1200 nm without drop tanks. Anyone know what those extra gallons will do to the range?



Quoting TGIF (Reply 39):
Yes I believe external tanks are included and thats why we need some figures for the F-35 with external tank (or Gripen without them) to get an equal comparison.

Do you have a source to the 500 miles combat radius for the Gripen NG? All I can find is 430 miles for Gripen A/B and with 30% more fuel, 500 miles seems low. I'm not saying it's range will be as great as the F-35's, but I think it's close.

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