Kukkudrill
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Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Mon Apr 21, 2008 7:57 pm

Here's what it's like to be on the wrong end of an AAM ...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7358761.stm
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curlyheadboy
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Mon Apr 21, 2008 8:04 pm

Amazing video, thanks for sharing!  Wow!
They call the aircraft a Mig-29 and It looks like they're correct (I'd say by the shape of the wing rather than by the "distinctive" double-fin).... Not sure about what missile is that (AA-2?)
Georgia should be quite pissed, to say the least...  Wink
If God had wanted men to fly he would have given them more money...
 
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Ryan h
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:44 pm

The Russians must be desperate if they are using an AA-2 Atoll on their MiG 29.
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curlyheadboy
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Mon Apr 21, 2008 11:26 pm



Quoting Ryan h (Reply 2):
The Russians must be desperate if they are using an AA-2 Atoll on their MiG 29.

Yeah, I wanted to say Archer in my above post, that would be AA-11, my mistake  Smile


Some lovely quotes from the BBC article:

Garry Kupalba, deputy defence minister of the unrecognised Republic of Abkhazia, told reporters the drone had been shot down by an "L-39 aircraft of the Abkhaz Air Force".

L-39???  Yeah sure

A Russian air force spokesman said: "What would a Russian jet fighter be doing over Georgian territory?"

Shooting a missile?  Silly

Seriously, could that be any other fighter other than Russian? I think not, not to my knowledge at least... so either the Mig or the UAV must have been where it shouldn't be....
If God had wanted men to fly he would have given them more money...
 
acw367
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Tue Apr 22, 2008 6:56 pm

The UAV is a Hermes 450.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermes_UAV

Does anyone know how many Georgia possess and where they operate from. Do they carry Georgian air force markings.
 
A342
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Tue Apr 22, 2008 6:58 pm

"MASTER CAUTION"  rotfl 

That was priceless!
Exceptions confirm the rule.
 
IronDuke08
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Tue Apr 22, 2008 9:06 pm



Quoting Kukkudrill (Thread starter):
Here's what it's like to be on the wrong end of an AAM ...

sends chills down my spine...it's pretty amazing how quickly the missile travels, although if it is an R-73 (AA-11) it does give you a nice smoke trail to see...still the R-73 is supposed to be really hard to spoof...is it possible to put a DIRCM unit on a fighter? (the laser pod that blinds the missile, used to protect helicopters and high value airliners)

also makes you think about how an F-22 and a BVR AMRAAM shot you'd never know what hit you...no smoke, just your ECM giving you a short warning when the missile goes active, right before it hits your plane at Mach 4...
 
scottieprecord
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Tue Apr 22, 2008 11:44 pm



Quoting A342 (Reply 5):
"MASTER CAUTION" rotfl

That was priceless!

LMAO.. that had me crackin up!

And I love how Russia just blatantly lies about this. Lol. Sucks for Georgia, but still pretty funny.
 
TheCol
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Wed Apr 23, 2008 12:00 am

Lucy, you got some 'splainin' to do...
No matter how random things may appear, there's always a plan.
 
highlander0
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Wed Apr 23, 2008 12:03 am



Quoting IronDuke08 (Reply 6):
DIRCM

It's actually LIRCM- Large Infra-Red Counter Measures that go on airliners
 
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Revelation
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Wed Apr 23, 2008 1:19 am



Quoting ACW367 (Reply 4):
The UAV is a Hermes 450.

Was!  Smile

(filer)
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IronDuke08
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Wed Apr 23, 2008 2:36 am



Quoting Highlander0 (Reply 9):
It's actually LIRCM- Large Infra-Red Counter Measures that go on airliners

http://usafengineers.com/modules.php...me=Bricolage&MODE=SHOW&PAGE=AAQ-24

It looks as though we're both right. I guess DIRCM, Directional Infrared Countermeasure, is the blanket term for the technology.
 
curlyheadboy
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:34 am



Quoting IronDuke08 (Reply 6):
although if it is an R-73 (AA-11) it does give you a nice smoke trail to see...still the R-73 is supposed to be really hard to spoof...

I'm brought to think it's indeed a R-73, because it looks like it's fired from the outer pylon, where usually WVR missiles are mounted on the Mig-29 (and many other fighters). Interesting to notice also how the Mig pilot maneuvers to get right behind the drone and at a lower altitude before shooting, probably to get the best kill chances without the surface of the sea interfering with the missile tracking. I just wonder why he goes for a costy missile instead of using his 30mm cannon, a drone's a cheap, defenseless target after all...
If God had wanted men to fly he would have given them more money...
 
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RJAF
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:35 am

Why did the Mig-29 fire an expensive missile when a few cannon bursts would have done the job?
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highlander0
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Wed Apr 23, 2008 5:41 pm

What would look cooler though?:D
 
MDorBust
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Wed Apr 23, 2008 6:05 pm



Quoting RJAF (Reply 13):
Why did the Mig-29 fire an expensive missile when a few cannon bursts would have done the job?

The pilot isn't paying for the missile. Might as well fire the most satisfying thing you have on the plane.
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Tugger
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:04 pm



Quoting MDorBust (Reply 15):

Quoting RJAF (Reply 13):
Why did the Mig-29 fire an expensive missile when a few cannon bursts would have done the job?

The pilot isn't paying for the missile. Might as well fire the most satisfying thing you have on the plane.

I would also expect that it is safer for the pilot to just stand off and fire than to approach a slower (much) aircraft and fire your gun at it.

I do find it amusing and concerning that Russia so blatantly ignores the issue when it is so clearly evident what happened. I bet someone got in trouble for getting it caught on film for for the world to see, next time the pilot will not shot from below......

Tugg
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Acheron
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Sun Apr 27, 2008 1:59 am

I recently read that the Mig-29 wasn't russian but actually one of Azerbaijani Air Force Mig's. Hence why the Russian keep denying it
 
Spacepope
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Sun Apr 27, 2008 2:09 am



Quoting RJAF (Reply 13):
Why did the Mig-29 fire an expensive missile when a few cannon bursts would have done the job?

Because any stray cannon rounds would be reported to have hit the Georgian convent for blind nuns....

Missiles have a shelf life, if you don't use them, you have to scrap them anyway...

Plus now the drone has provided great marketing footage of the missile in action. Buy one today!
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curlyheadboy
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Sun Apr 27, 2008 12:10 pm



Quoting Acheron (Reply 17):
I recently read that the Mig-29 wasn't russian but actually one of Azerbaijani Air Force Mig's. Hence why the Russian keep denying it

That's strange... because looks like the incident happened on the sea: the only sea there is Back Sea and so an Azerbaijani Mig should have crossed foreign airspace to get there, and it's so far from Azerbaijan.... Caspian sea? Same question the other way round, what was the drone doing there and how did it get there?
If God had wanted men to fly he would have given them more money...
 
elmothehobo
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Sun Apr 27, 2008 4:56 pm

Why would the Azeri Air Force shoot down a Georgian military drone? The jet would have crossed precariously close to Armenian and Russian airspace, crossed the entirety of Georgia (not much to cross, but still), cross to the Black Sea and then do the whole trip all over again. Someone would have made contact with it, it's not like we're dealing with an F-22 or F-117.

Now if the drone were flying over the Caspian, Georgia would certainly be at fault here, as they would have had to cross Armenia/Russia and/or Azerbaijan en route to the Caspian.
 
Acheron
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Mon Apr 28, 2008 7:22 am

Maybe what's pictured at the bottom is rather large lake, and looking at the map there seems to be one in the middle of Azerbaijan.
Armenia also has a rather large lake, and operate MiG-29's aswell, so it could be either Russian, Azerbaijani or Armenian.
 
TEEJ
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Mon Apr 28, 2008 3:00 pm



Quoting Acheron (Reply 21):

The coordinates on the UAV footage show the location as just off the Georgian coast over the Black Sea. Retrieve those from the video and plug them into Google Earth, etc.

Cheers

TJ
 
wvsuperhornet
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Wed Apr 30, 2008 4:56 am

Oh yeah I would believe the Russian Version of the story first...LMAO!!!!
 
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glideslope
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Wed Apr 30, 2008 9:48 pm



Quoting Spacepope (Reply 18):
Because any stray cannon rounds would be reported to have hit the Georgian convent for blind nuns....

Missiles have a shelf life, if you don't use them, you have to scrap them anyway...

Plus now the drone has provided great marketing footage of the missile in action. Buy one today!

LOL. I'll go with "buy one today." The Russians are like children playing with matches. The EU better get ready.
To know your Enemy, you must become your Enemy.” Sun Tzu
 
IronDuke08
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RE: Russia "shoots Down Georgian Drone" (video)

Thu May 01, 2008 7:45 am



Quoting Glideslope (Reply 24):
LOL. I'll go with "buy one today." The Russians are like children playing with matches. The EU better get ready.

Do you think I can get a good deal on last year's model?? Maybe a 2 for 1 or something. hehe...

One of the cool things I noticed about the video was that the MiG was not pointed at the target when the missile was fired so I'm inclined to think that the pilot was using his helmet mounted sight to cue the missile's seeker head in the right direction. Can anyone else comment on this being a possibility? I'd think that a small drone has a relatively small IR signature and that it could be difficult to get a good lock.

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