rjpieces
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Obama To Depart For ME From Dulles, Not Andrews

Tue Jun 02, 2009 10:22 pm

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/06...liticalhotsheet/entry5056995.shtml

When President Obama departs this evening on his five day trip to Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Germany and France, he’ll be taking off from Dulles International Airport and not Andrews Air Force Base.

But he’s using Dulles because it’s got longer runways than does Andrews AFB. The crew of Air Force One needs the longer runway because it’ll be topping off the 747 fuel tanks to the brim for the long flight from Washington, D.C. to Riyadh, Saudi Arabia.
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alphaomega
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RE: Obama To Depart For ME From Dulles, Not Andrews

Wed Jun 03, 2009 12:54 am

It was a nice sight - 29000 and one of the 757s parked on the remote ramp and he went off 1C - 11,500ft.

Caused a mess with the scheduled flights with the ramp freeze but its always interesting to see AF1 depart from IAD!

AF1 always departs from IAD for the long trips, but I was thinking about when Bush went on his surprise trip to Iraq - he didn't leave from IAD so how did he make it? A kiss from a KC-135 along the way?
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: Obama To Depart For ME From Dulles, Not Andrews

Wed Jun 03, 2009 1:07 am



Quoting Alphaomega (Reply 1):

AF1 always departs from IAD for the long trips, but I was thinking about when Bush went on his surprise trip to Iraq - he didn't leave from IAD so how did he make it? A kiss from a KC-135 along the way?

No mid-air refueling was publicly disclosed, at least none that I am aware. The non-stop flight from Andrews to Baghdad was approximately 5,400 nm which should be in the range of a lightly-loaded 747-200. The secret Bush trip also flew with a lot less personnel on Air Force One than a typical state visit so they were probably able to stretch the range a bit more than normal.
 
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par13del
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RE: Obama To Depart For ME From Dulles, Not Andrews

Wed Jun 03, 2009 5:28 pm

Makes you wonder why a runway at Andrews has not been lengthened to accomodate, over the years since the VC-25's have been in service how many re-position tirps have been done for this sole purpose, certainely they could have paid off the repair by now.
My assumption is that military engineers not civilian would do the extension, so it could also be budgeted in one year for training of newbie seebees etc.

Another random thought.
 
airtran737
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RE: Obama To Depart For ME From Dulles, Not Andrews

Thu Jun 04, 2009 12:47 am

At 9,700 ft I am pretty sure a fully loaded AF1 can depart from the ADW runway to anywhere that it needs to go. http://204.108.4.16/d-tpp/0905/00561AD.PDF
Nice Trip Report!!! Great Pics, thanks for posting!!!! B747Forever
 
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par13del
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RE: Obama To Depart For ME From Dulles, Not Andrews

Thu Jun 04, 2009 2:21 am

A.net speculation strikes again  Smile
 
EMBQA
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RE: Obama To Depart For ME From Dulles, Not Andrews

Thu Jun 04, 2009 3:56 am



Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 2):
The secret Bush trip also flew with a lot less personnel on Air Force One than a typical state visit so they were probably able to stretch the range a bit more than normal.

It was very lightly loaded.....The President, the flight crew, a handful of support staff and a hand picked group of press.
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QFMel
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RE: Obama To Depart For ME From Dulles, Not Andrews

Mon Jun 08, 2009 3:02 am

Quoting Par13del (Reply 3):
Makes you wonder why a runway at Andrews has not been lengthened to accomodate, over the years since the VC-25's have been in service how many re-position tirps have been done for this sole purpose, certainely they could have paid off the repair by now.
My assumption is that military engineers not civilian would do the extension, so it could also be budgeted in one year for training of newbie seebees etc.


Surely it would pay for itself in the medium-term.

[Edited 2009-06-07 20:03:53]
 
Devilfish
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RE: Obama To Depart For ME From Dulles, Not Andrews

Mon Jun 08, 2009 3:46 am



Quoting Par13del (Reply 3):
My assumption is that military engineers not civilian would do the extension, so it could also be budgeted in one year for training of newbie seebees etc.

Not to knock our CB friends, but the DoD has plenty of accredited civilian contractors who could undertake that critical work more efficiently which would offset savings in employing station forces. Such contractors also work at sensitive installations without disrupting operations (too much).
"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
 
QFMel
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RE: Obama To Depart For ME From Dulles, Not Andrews

Mon Jun 08, 2009 7:25 am



Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 8):




Quoting Par13del (Reply 3):
My assumption is that military engineers not civilian would do the extension, so it could also be budgeted in one year for training of newbie seebees etc.

Not to knock our CB friends, but the DoD has plenty of accredited civilian contractors who could undertake that critical work more efficiently which would offset savings in employing station forces. Such contractors also work at sensitive installations without disrupting operations (too much).

Sure, but even if you outsource it, a runway extension is going to cost a heap of dough. I think the suggestion here was to not necessarily have a specific appropriation for it, and/or to avoid it dragging out on account of budgetary constraints.
 
Devilfish
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RE: Obama To Depart For ME From Dulles, Not Andrews

Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:38 am



Quoting QFMel (Reply 9):
Sure, but even if you outsource it, a runway extension is going to cost a heap of dough. I think the suggestion here was to not necessarily have a specific appropriation for it, and/or to avoid it dragging out on account of budgetary constraints.

Then good luck having your runway extension without a specific appropriation, especially on a military airbase. As to avoiding dragging it on account of budgetary constraints, you would not be allowed to even start if there was not enough funding to complete the project. OTOH, you would be dragging it out due to other reasons, based on the suggestion.
"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
 
QFMel
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RE: Obama To Depart For ME From Dulles, Not Andrews

Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:54 am



Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 10):

Then good luck having your runway extension without a specific appropriation, especially on a military airbase. As to avoiding dragging it on account of budgetary constraints, you would not be allowed to even start if there was not enough funding to complete the project. OTOH, you would be dragging it out due to other reasons, based on the suggestion.

Yes but coming back to the CB suggestion, the idea, impractical or not, would be to plough training costs into such construction- it's simply an offset, even if it's not a complete one. As for work not starting without a line item for the entire amount- this presupposes that the cost of a project is static. Better pray then that the cost doesn't blowout.

Which, of course, never happens in construction. Or with Government, generally. Or even better, with the military.
 
Devilfish
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RE: Obama To Depart For ME From Dulles, Not Andrew

Tue Jun 09, 2009 1:52 am

A study on the workings of MILCON projects (your runway extension would definitely be one) is in order if you're that interested.
"Everyone is entitled to my opinion." - Garfield
 
QFMel
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RE: Obama To Depart For ME From Dulles, Not Andrews

Tue Jun 09, 2009 3:39 am



Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 12):


A study on the workings of MILCON projects (your runway extension would definitely be one) is in order if you're that interested.

Fairly au fait with their workings, obviously more so here in Aus than stateside. The DOD Milcon budget for FY09 is a marvel, it easily dwarfs our entire defence spend. So when I hear proceedings of the Standing Committee on Public Works here, I'll resign myself to being somewhat less impressed.

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