ANCsupercub
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Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 2:57 am

There is a plane down at Elmendorf. The news is reporting it was a C-17, 2 miles north of Elmendorf with four people on board. No word on injuries. http://www.adn.com/2010/07/28/138572...o-plane-reported-down-on-base.html

[Edited 2010-07-28 20:02:02]

[Edited 2010-07-28 20:08:16]
 
nutsaboutplanes
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 3:48 am

This is sad, my brother had just landed his P-3 and saw the bird on her way to the runway. As he exited the aircraft after shutdown, there was a huge fireball just off of the end of the runway. The aircraft he saw was an Elmendorf bird for sure, he noticed because he commented that it had a wing light out during taxi.

I hope there are survivors but it sounds like there was quite an impact. I wonder how this will impact the airshow this week, it will certainly put a damper on the festivities.

[Edited 2010-07-28 20:53:54]
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ANCsupercub
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 3:54 am

Yeah I was driving out to Eagle River and saw the smoke. It doesn't look good. Thoughts and prayers to the families involved. ADN has a picture of the smoke on their website now.
 
nutsaboutplanes
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 3:59 am

Does anybody know how many C-17's are based at Elmendorf?

[Edited 2010-07-28 21:01:20]
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ANCsupercub
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 4:11 am

I googled it and came across this article http://www.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123056733. It sounds as if there are eight, but I really know nothing about military operations and have no idea if this is right.
 
nutsaboutplanes
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 4:22 am

Quoting ANCsupercub (Reply 4):
I googled it and came across this article http://www.af.mil/news/story.asp?id=123056733. It sounds as if there are eight, but I really know nothing about military operations and have no idea if this is right.

Thanks, I knew it was small compared to Mcchord, Charleston and Mcguire (Mcchord and Charleston have 40+).
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KFlyer
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 5:23 am

The aircraft was belonging to Elmendorf 3rd Sqn IIRC. Was on a training flight, as per BNO Wire.
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mrskyguy
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 5:26 am

Man, when will it end? This has been a simply awful week.

Prayers to the airmen and their loved ones.
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Galaxy5007
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 7:24 am

Elmendorf has 8 C-17s assigned to them that I can confirm; a ninth might be assigned; but that aircraft has been in depot. 98-0051, 98-0056, 99-0167, 99-0168, 99-0170, 00-0171, 00-0173 and 00-0174 are the C-17s assigned to Elmendorf.
 
bigphilnyc
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 11:06 am

The crew of four were confirmed killed. RIP to them  http://nycaviation.com/x14
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dragon6172
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 1:22 pm

How many C-17 hull losses is this? I know there was at least one belly up landing in Afghanistan, probably not a hull loss though.

RIP to the airmen lost.
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zeke
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 1:38 pm

Quoting KFlyer (Reply 6):
The aircraft was belonging to Elmendorf 3rd Sqn IIRC. Was on a training flight, as per BNO Wire.


They were practicing for the Arctic Thunder air show.

"Air Force Lt. Gen. Dana Atkins said the crew was training for the upcoming Arctic Thunder air show. Three were members of the Alaska Air National Guard and the fourth crew member was on active duty at Elmendorf. The identities of the victims have not been released."

http://www.ktuu.com/Global/story.asp?S=12889630
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CodyKDiamond
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 1:48 pm

My condolences to the entire flight crew, their families and their friends.
 
Galaxy5007
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 1:54 pm

Quoting dragon6172 (Reply 10):
How many C-17 hull losses is this? I know there was at least one belly up landing in Afghanistan, probably not a hull loss though.

You assumed correctly; the aircraft that belly landed (96-0002) is at Long Beach getting permanent repairs; it flew there no problem. As did 01-0196 did a couple years before last years incident. This is the first loss of a C-17.

RIP to the crew; and my thoughts and prayers go out to the family and friends of the crew.
 
Galaxy5007
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 2:07 pm

Unconfirmed word of the tail number is 00-0173, which was also named the Spirit of the Aleutians
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 2:52 pm

Quoting Galaxy5007 (Reply 14):
Unconfirmed word of the tail number is 00-0173, which was also named the Spirit of the Aleutians

RIP my brothers.    My heart and prayers go out to the AKANG and USAF families, and mostly to the families to the 4 crew members.
 
atrude777
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 4:03 pm

My cousin is stationed there at the moment and does flying in the air force out there.

I was concerned my cousin was involved, so I messaged my aunt, and she was also and she has not heard anything at the moment if it was him. We have not heard from my cousin yet.

So far we are assuming it was not my cousin.

RIP to all those killed, and the family for going through this. it was not a good night for me wondering if my cousin was involved I cannot even imagine how it was for the family of those directly involved.

Alex
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twosevenright
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 4:53 pm

Condolences to Flight crew, Family and Friends, it's been a bad week in aviation.

Tom
 
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 7:44 pm

My thoughts and prayers go out the the families of the 4 airmen.
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jetjack74
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 7:58 pm

Quoting Galaxy5007 (Reply 14):
Unconfirmed word of the tail number is 00-0173, which was also named the Spirit of the Aleutians

I think she was one of our birds down here at TCM that we gave to them a few years ago. Very sad indeed for all the men and women in AK ANG and the families of the fallen. Even in the perceived safety and the confines of your own home and country, the servicemen and women still face so many dangers. For those who volunteer for national service, there is no "just another ordinary day". Godspeed my wingmen/women.
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bigphilnyc
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 8:26 pm

Quoting jetjack74 (Reply 19):
Even in the perceived safety and the confines of your own home and country, the servicemen and women still face so many dangers. For those who volunteer for national service, there is no "just another ordinary day". Godspeed my wingmen/women.

Well said. *raises glass*
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Galaxy5007
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 10:11 pm

Quoting jetjack74 (Reply 19):
I think she was one of our birds down here at TCM that we gave to them a few years ago

Yes, 00-0173 (in fact all of Elmendorfs aircraft) were originally McChord birds. Originally the got 99-0167 through 00-0174; but 99-0169 and 00-0172 have swapped out with Altus birds as part of the normal rotation to keep the jets from being worn out from the abuse they take at Altus. 00-0173 was delivered to McChord in April of 2001.

Oh, and I have confirmed that 0173 is the jet in question.
 
nutsaboutplanes
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 11:31 pm

I have worked on aircraft 0173 many times, both at Mcchord and deployed. Its a strange feeling to know that a plane that you worked on is now wrecked and that it took 4 heroes with it.

I hope that the investigation points to mechanical failure of birds, but, being that this was a crew practicing for an airshow, I have a sickening feeling that they simply pushed her too hard....I hope that is not the case.

The C-17 is a remarkable airplane and can maneuver and perform like a fighter jet. Whenever I was on base and there was a jet doing tactical maneuvers over the airfield, I would always park my car to watch and marvel at that fact that a half million pounds could be so graceful and maneuverable....amazing bank angles on the 17.
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Galaxy5007
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Jul 29, 2010 11:47 pm

Quoting nutsaboutplanes (Reply 22):
I have worked on aircraft 0173 many times, both at Mcchord and deployed. Its a strange feeling to know that a plane that you worked on is now wrecked and that it took 4 heroes with it.

I hope that the investigation points to mechanical failure of birds, but, being that this was a crew practicing for an airshow, I have a sickening feeling that they simply pushed her too hard....I hope that is not the case.

The C-17 is a remarkable airplane and can maneuver and perform like a fighter jet. Whenever I was on base and there was a jet doing tactical maneuvers over the airfield, I would always park my car to watch and marvel at that fact that a half million pounds could be so graceful and maneuverable....amazing bank angles on the 17.

I agree completely. When 4059 went down in 06 (C-5B from Dover) It hit me hard as I have done so much work on that aircraft. To have it go down and knowing people that were on board, it was traumatizing to me. Luckily everyone survived that crash; its never a good thing to hear us losing an aircraft, but its horrible to lose lives. They can buy another C-17...the 4 airmen that were lost can't be replaced.

From what I've heard from witness accounts, the plane was banking hard and had the wings vertical to the ground...it almost sounds like a repeat of the 1994 Fairchild B-52 disaster, where they banked it too far and lost all the lift.
 
nutsaboutplanes
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Fri Jul 30, 2010 3:14 am

Quoting Galaxy5007 (Reply 23):
From what I've heard from witness accounts, the plane was banking hard and had the wings vertical to the ground...it almost sounds like a repeat of the 1994 Fairchild B-52 disaster, where they banked it too far and lost all the lift.

I actually watched that video last night because it sounded so similar. They are fine if they carry enough speed into those turns but if the jet gets a little bit slow, it falls like a rock.

The stress that is exerted on the center wing box is immense. When the jets would land after combat maneuvers, there would be tons of sheered and popped screws/ fasteners on the upper wing panel near the fuselage.....those things were a pain to fix.

Like I said, I hope it was mechanical or a bird ingestion into multiple engines and not a case of a well trained crew that just got too comfortable with the seemingly limitless performance of a very capable machine.
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steveg1988
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Fri Jul 30, 2010 1:08 pm

Almost 15 years ago Yukla 27 crashed taking off from the same base, Bird ingestion on two engines on the E-3's TF-33 Turbofan engines. Similar incident to the current crash.


http://www.afblues.com/?p=1182 Memorial Artwork commemorating the brave crews of both accidents.

I wish the family of the crews the best of wishes. and to the crews of both aircraft, i wish you god speed, may you find yourself in heaven, or your relegions equivlent for you have paid the ultimate price for your nation. May we not forget you Yukla 27 and the C17 crews.
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Fri Jul 30, 2010 2:08 pm

Quoting nutsaboutplanes (Reply 22):
I hope that the investigation points to mechanical failure of birds, but, being that this was a crew practicing for an airshow, I have a sickening feeling that they simply pushed her too hard....I hope that is not the case.
Quoting nutsaboutplanes (Reply 24):
Like I said, I hope it was mechanical or a bird ingestion into multiple engines and not a case of a well trained crew that just got too comfortable with the seemingly limitless performance of a very capable machine.
Quoting steveg1988 (Reply 25):
http://www.afblues.com/?p=1182

That is very powerful.........
 
A388
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Fri Jul 30, 2010 3:08 pm

Very sad news, my condolences to the family members of the crew lives lost. Very tragic and I hope they will find the cause of this accident  

A388
 
Lexy
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Sat Jul 31, 2010 5:06 am

My deepest condolences for all the crew members. I caught this aircraft landing here in Nashville once a couple years ago. So sad.  http://www.flickr.com/photos/perspectivephotography/2131273227/
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AKviator
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Mon Aug 02, 2010 5:04 pm

Photos of the crash site.

Horrible accident  
 
nutsaboutplanes
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Tue Aug 03, 2010 9:24 pm

WOW..... the force of the impact must have been imense, they only thing that I recognize is the tail.

Just terrible. Does anybody know if the military makes accidnet findings public?
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EMBQA
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Wed Aug 04, 2010 6:47 pm

Quoting nutsaboutplanes (Reply 30):
Does anybody know if the military makes accidnet findings public?

Not like the NTSB does, but often they will announce a finding.
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fsnuffer
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Wed Aug 04, 2010 7:37 pm

Dies the C-17 have digital flight recorders?
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Wed Aug 04, 2010 11:21 pm

Yes, the C-17 is equipped with digital FDRs and CVRs.
 
Galaxy5007
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Aug 05, 2010 1:34 am

The findings will be released after the investigation is completed. When C-5B 84-0059 crashed, it was about 3 months before the public release came out.

I don't think there is ANY US military aircraft that doesn't have FDRs and CVRs
 
rwessel
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Aug 05, 2010 5:34 am

Quoting Galaxy5007 (Reply 34):
I don't think there is ANY US military aircraft that doesn't have FDRs and CVRs

I don't think the X-26A's at USNTPS are likely to have FDRs or CVRs.   
 
ThePointblank
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Aug 05, 2010 7:40 am

Quoting Galaxy5007 (Reply 34):
I don't think there is ANY US military aircraft that doesn't have FDRs and CVRs

Neither did the F/A-18A/B's, which lacked a crash survivable FDR... don't know if that was fixed.
 
zanl188
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Aug 05, 2010 9:24 pm

Quoting ThePointblank (Reply 36):
Neither did the F/A-18A/B's, which lacked a crash survivable FDR... don't know if that was fixed.

Must have been - here's a company that makes the standard F-18 recorder...

http://www.drs.com/Products/c3a/DFIRS.aspx
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kc135topboom
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Aug 05, 2010 10:54 pm

Quoting Galaxy5007 (Reply 34):
I don't think there is ANY US military aircraft that doesn't have FDRs and CVRs
Quoting ZANL188 (Reply 37):
Quoting ThePointblank (Reply 36):
Neither did the F/A-18A/B's, which lacked a crash survivable FDR... don't know if that was fixed.

Must have been - here's a company that makes the standard F-18 recorder...

http://www.drs.com/Products/c3a/DFIR....aspx

Actually, most US military aircraft are being retrofitted with DIFDRs and DCVRs. Until the last few years, only the C-5, C-17, and KC-10 had them (as well as the VIP fleet). Now, all aircraft are ordered with them, and older aircraft are getting them.
 
zanl188
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Thu Aug 05, 2010 11:26 pm

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 38):
Actually, most US military aircraft are being retrofitted with DIFDRs and DCVRs. Until the last few years, only the C-5, C-17, and KC-10 had them (as well as the VIP fleet). Now, all aircraft are ordered with them, and older aircraft are getting them.

IIRC the T-43 involved in the Ron Brown accident didn't have a recorder and the VIP fleet got them as a result.
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kc135topboom
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RE: Plane Down At Elmendorf AFB

Fri Aug 06, 2010 1:28 pm

Quoting ZANL188 (Reply 39):
Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 38):
Actually, most US military aircraft are being retrofitted with DIFDRs and DCVRs. Until the last few years, only the C-5, C-17, and KC-10 had them (as well as the VIP fleet). Now, all aircraft are ordered with them, and older aircraft are getting them.

IIRC the T-43 involved in the Ron Brown accident didn't have a recorder and the VIP fleet got them as a result.

Correct. At the time that airplane was designated as a CT-43A (B-737-200) and was not fitted with a VIP interior. It was big enough to fly that sized delegation, yet still small enough to operate at that airport. The only other USAF airplane that could have been used would have been the DCANG C-22B (B-727-100), but there were only about 4 of them in the fleet. The C-22B had commerical CVRs and FDRs because they were bought as used commerical airliners.

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